<p>@weavingtrials,</p>
<p>Thanks for your insightful comments about education in Singapore. For the American CC readers, “tuition” in Singapore is UK-English speak for “tutoring”</p>
<p>IMO, tertiary education is too late to start steering kids away from rote-learning.</p>
<p>@GMTplus7 ,</p>
<p>Tertiary education indeed is too late, but rote-learning is still the most efficient way of getting all the facts into your head at such an impressionable age. For example, right now although I do plan to study overseas after secondary, I am worried that I will not be able to cope with the large difference in education methods. But since the age of which tertiary education starts is the age where teenagers are easily influenced, I guess it won’t be too hard to try and adapt.</p>
<p>Many people in Asian societies attribute academic success, or success in general, to crazy cramming of content.</p>
<p>To be honest, rote memorizing and excessive drilling is pretty disgusting, and will get a person nowhere, beyond developing testing skills. 
It, for lack of better word, completely sucks, whether in primary, secondary or tertiary establishments, and I’d rather be out there actually learning and feeling the whole wide world, instead of sitting in my room all day attempting to cram “model answers” into my head. </p>
<p>Rote memorizing =/= learning. </p>
<p>Point of information: rote memorizing doesn’t work in tertiary establishments in Singapore, since one can’t possibly stuff two years worth of information into one’s head and unleash the metaphorical floodgates at the a levels. Just doesn’t work that way.</p>
<p>Sure, Singapore kids test better than their American counterparts, but I don’t think growing accustomed rote memorizing and cram-culture is something I’d like to introduce to my future kids. :(</p>
<p>No doubt there are some issues, within China at least, of freedom of speech. It would be ironic to have an elite educational institution in Beijing and yet be unable to openly debate the sensitive issues within China.</p>
<p>^^</p>
<p>I have to agree. China and the rest of Asia have so many other issues that a new boarding school might not be the best idea. From information provided by my father who lived in Asian countries for years, newspapers, books and my best friend who moved here from China recently, I would have to come to the conclusion that Asia has a copious amount of conflicts and problems that they need to solve before someone tries to start an elite boarding school.</p>
<p>To be concise, the world right now is in such anarchy and chaos, especially in Asia, that I do not believe anyone would a cogent mind would start a school. Also, I do not know many kids who have parents that would send their children to Asia. At least, I know those whose parent’s have read and studied would most likely not send their child. Not even my Asian friends would go to Asia or back to it. </p>
<p>I have nothing against Asia, and I would love to go to Asia. They have had a very interesting history and have produced some amazing people. I’m simply just stating my point of view.</p>
<p>Asia has no particular shortage of wonderful high schools, including the International Schools. Since the private schools in Asia are typically for the wealthy, these families can also hire as many private tutors as needed. There’s still a fair amount of Asians that apply to US or Euro boarding schools, but nowhere near as much as those that eventually apply for US or Euro colleges.</p>
<p>@weavingtrials: As it happens, I spent two years in public school in Singapore. It was just elementary school- “primary” there- but that has, out of all the others I’ve been in, been the educational system which has left the biggest impression on me. It was a grueling experience, especially as I did not speak English, and there was no ESL, but Singapore trained me into having unshakable basics and, by forcing me to work my tail off, work ethic. In other Chinese words, since we are talking about Asia, it gave me “實力”.</p>
<p>One thing I will never approve of, however, is the sorting of kids. Even in first grade in Singapore they sorted kids into A, B, C, D classes… based on academic grades. I’m not real sure how exactly they did it, but it was basically into the loser class, the okay class, and the best class. Do you know how much that hurts to be labeled like that?</p>
<p>@CherryRose I think that sorting kids is the best thing to do, because letting kids just go into the next grade or higher class when they are failing is the worse thing to do. America use to let kids who (and still do) can’t read graduate or go onto to the next grade, because some idiot said it would hurt their self esteem to be held back. </p>
<p>Also, I believe that it gives kids a goal to aim for. Everyone has to learn that they need earn things instead of having it handed to them.</p>
<p>By the way, extremely cool that you went to Singapore! I wish I could go for the experience. I remember once we had an exchange student come from China, and she was in shock about how slack our school was in America lol :)</p>
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<p>Do you know how much it hurts the productive capacity of a nation to have its best and brightest held back so that no kid gets left behind? Imagine the frustration of the brighter kids pooled with those needing a slower pace? Wonder why BS apps are up?</p>
<p>While I see and understand Weatherby and ThePrepGirl’s points, I agree with CherryRose on the whole sorting/ranking issue in China. I’ve seen firsthand just how much pressure that puts on the students. Asian parents are all “You have to be in the top ten of your class or ____ (insert your own form of harsh HARSH punishment here)”. This ranking system essentially takes over the students’ lives and they live for nothing but for their class rank. Is that how a child should live? Is that what a student should learn for? Students should learn for their own love of knowledge, NOT some stupid ranking system. In fact, the ranking does the opposite. It makes most students HATE learning, and I have almost never heard a local school student actively WANT to learn. It’s all forced and in the end, is that really better for the student? IMO, it’s really really not. No self-motivation, no interest, no love for learning - aren’t those all qualities that make these people able to survive in the real world?</p>
<p>They are both bad systems and representative of extremes. It saddens me to hear aaralyn describe the parental pressure but I have also the witnessed the sadness of watching kids with a real thirst for learning search and search for opportunities. I read an article once (can’t remember who wrote it) about what it’s like for a gifted student in a regular classroom. It was something like this: “It’s like feeding an elephant one blade of grass at a time. It will starve to death by the time it ever realizes you’re trying to feed it.”</p>
<p>As a country, we are really shooting ourselves in the foot by refusing to acknowledge the special needs of our brightest kids. Sure, a few states mandate gifted education, and there are a handful of specialized high schools, but most gifted kids are left to their own devices at schools that neither acknowledge nor value them. They are often looked at as something to “deal with” by the teachers. If they stay in the lockstep age graded system that is step up, the teachers tend to love them because they cause no trouble (they learn very little, but they don’t stir the pot up too much and teachers adore that). If they push ahead and say “teach me!”, they are often resented as the teachers who take it personally and say “What, we’re not good enough for you?” As such, the self-motivated, non grade grubbers (those not placated by an A and a gold star) are left to fend for themselves in a sea of mediocrity when all they really want is work that they can be proud of. </p>
<p>/end rant</p>
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<p>As a child in regular classes, I would hyperventilate to pass the time with the hope of taking a trip to the school nurse. </p>
<p>I have friends whose parents beat them if they brought home an Asian B (A- for the rest of us). Such mistreatment of children does not justify the setting of a deliberately slow educational pace so that we all can feel equal because in fact, we are all given different gifts that should be cultivated for the overall benefit of society.</p>
<p>I have always refrained from discussing American education, because most on CC have experienced it in some sort and probably at more length than I have. But the exposure to Asian education is so comparitively little, I really feel that I must try to provide a balanced view. </p>
<ol>
<li>“I think that sorting kids is the best thing to do, because letting kids just go into the next grade or higher class when they are failing is the worse thing to do.” -ThePrepGirl</li>
</ol>
<p>I never said anything about failing kids, because interestingly enough, in my years in Asian public schools, I have not come into contact with anybody actually failing. Now, there are plenty of on-the-brink kids, but I’m pretty sure they just get thrown into cram school until they pass by the skin of their teeth. This trend undoubtedly rises in secondary school, but the consequences are so dire (as stereotypical as it may sound, shame upon the family) that it doesn’t happen that much. Most parents will probably put their academically struggling kids in private school, which in Asia mostly have less rigourous academics and are considered ‘worse’ than public (unless you’re talking about international schools, which is another story). I’m talking about kids who are passing, but put into classes by their grades. The “high C” class, the “low B” class, the “straight-A” class, etc.
So, you think this will be beneficial to them, right? They are put by skill level, so you can teach to their needs… but they don’t. This simply serves to put a sticker on kids even before they can understand why. Imagine growing up wearing a school uniform that has essentially a badge of “C student class” on it. It isn’t that they’re not trying, either. Most of them are. But with such advanced academics and testing, it’s just not mentally possible for everyone to do well.</p>
<ol>
<li>“Do you know how much it hurts the productive capacity of a nation to have its best and brightest held back so that no kid gets left behind? Imagine the frustration of the brighter kids pooled with those needing a slower pace?” -Weatherby</li>
</ol>
<p>Oh, yes. I read novels all last year in my (American) math class. I know what you’re talking about. But in Asia, this is simply not the case. “No Child Left Behind” in Asia? It’s more like “60% of the Children Get Thrown Behind So the Other 40% Can Have a Shot at Peking University/National Taiwan University/National University of Singapore, etc.” NOBODY IS HELD BACK. Almost everybody is trying valiantly to catch up to the calculus-infused curriculum… in ninth grade. The others have given up long ago, being told they’re just not good enough, after years of having their names at the bottom of the finals and midterm ranking charts and of sitting in cram school in hopes of catching up.
Even though classes are separated, EVERYBODY IS TAUGHT THE SAME THING. They all cower in the face of the same tests. Their parents and neighbors and society all put the same pressures on them- to get into the best schools, score the highest- except more than 90% will give up their lives and fall short. </p>
<ol>
<li>“Also, I believe that it gives kids a goal to aim for. Everyone has to learn that they need earn things instead of having it handed to them.” -ThePrepGirl</li>
</ol>
<p>Theoretically, having a goal is good. But what kind of goal is it to give up your life, at ages as young as six, for that half a point that can get you into, say, Tsinghua?</p>
<p>With that said, I feel gratified that there is intelligent discussion on this amongst parents here, but more so that us applicants are contributing too. If I seem too aggressive, I apologize. But there really is a pain among the students I have been one of; a pain that is all too often unknown to the outside world. I’ve never forgotten watching the fourth grader in front of me faint while crossing the road, from midterm stress, or how the theme at every sixth-grade graduation ceremony is “Bidding Farewell to Childhood”.</p>
<p>P.S. @ThePrepGirl: The experiences, while tough, open your eyes so much. If you get a chance at BS, you might want to go on an exchange trip! 
P.P.S. As you may know, I’ve studied in public systems throughout the world. Anyone game for European education? ;)</p>
<p>CherryRose, thank you so much for your perspective. It is true that most of us here have no clue about what it’s like, which makes your contribution valuable to me. It sounds like no one can thrive in that kind of environment. At least the American system appears to serve the middle quartiles reasonably well. You don’t sound aggressive as much as really passionate - and that’s a this thing. :)</p>
<p>Parents want to be involved in their student’s daily lives , although I have seen some boarding pre-schools near Beijing ,for parents who work too hard or travel . They board M-F ,and are with parents on weekends . Only for the upper classes .</p>
<p>@neatoburrito: You’re very welcome- it does mean a lot to me. I actually wrote two BS admissions essays comparing/contrasting European/Asian/American education and how to fix American education, since they asked what I was passionate about. :D</p>
<p>Cherryrose…the context of my no kid gets left behind comments relate to education in the US and was a response to NeatoBurrito. I did not comment on the education in Asia; my comments were wholly directed to education in the US. Sorry for the misunderstanding</p>
<p>NLCB? Thank goodness the current US Adminstration is putting it out to pasture.
Just would like to point out that while ‘Asia’ seems to be thrown around to cast a wild net, several Asian countries have a totally different education mindset than what seems to be seen/described in China. It would be better to refer to specific countries than simple say ‘Asia’. It would similar to lumping mindsets in ‘America’ together.</p>
<p>alextwooffour, it’s not a stretch to acknowledge some commonalities in educational approach among different Asian nations. Before entering BS in U.S., DS was in an int’l school with kids from a number of countries in Asia: SKorea, Japan, China, Singapore, Vietnam, Thailand, Taiwan. Common complaint of parents about the educational atmosphere in their home country was: cram, cram, cram. tutors and more cram, cram, cram.</p>
<p>@ CherryRose</p>
<p>Yeah, I know how it feels. I was never good in academics and as such always placed in the last few classes that were deemed as “disruptive & no-hope” by most teachers and they are always fustrated with my class. They usually sort the classes in primary school by your level position. & I agree that sorting in primary school when everyone has yet to understand anything is totally unneeded.</p>
<p>@GMTplus7
Yeah, you got that right. The atmosphere over here really is cram cram cram, tutor, cram cram, school and then cram again. Its lucky that my parents are looser on academics that as long as I can get the occasional As and not fail any subject, they let me be.</p>