Re: # 36: The PSAT and SAT are aptitude tests, not tests of intelligence.
Per post #39 - It isn’t like National Merit Finalists were enrolling at WPI in huge numbers. The last annual report shows they enrolled 13 that year. Actually the relatively small number of enrollees could have something to do with the fact they are dropping the scholarship, because they found it wasn’t a huge draw, and most (probably all) of the kids who are finalists will get merit aid from them anyway due to test scores and grades.
I guess you are correct…they would not make a “stand” if it actually hurt them. Good to see the actual numbers…it makes more sense now. that said they are free do what they want.
Way back in the Dark Ages, the NMSF cut off applied to you was determined by where you went to high school. New Hampshire went berserk and complained for years and years. The problem was than NH had relatively poorly funded public schools in a state with a relatively low total population and some of the strongest boarding schools in the nation, e.g., St. Paul’s and Exeter. When NMSFs were announced, 80% or more were students from boarding schools. VERY few NH public school students got the status. Eventually, after many years of complaining, National Merit agreed to have boarding school students count in the cohort from their home states. In one year, the percentage of boarding school students in NH getting NMSF status plummeted. A kid from Massachusetts had to qualify based on Massachusetts cut offs, not NH’s. And the percentage of NH public school kids getting NMF status skyrocketed.
While the change helped NH public school kids, it illustrates why the process is unfair. Cities like NY, Chicago, Boston, and LA have many excellent private schools and lots of excellent public schools like Scarsdale, Rye (NY), Winetka (Chicago), Lexington (Boston) , etc. in the suburbs. So, the kid who attends an urban inner city school in one of those states has to attain a higher score to become a NMSF than a kid at the best Jesuit high school in Baton Rouge, Louisiana or St. Andrew’s Episcopal in Mississippi. Seems incredibly unfair to me. Why should a kid who attends Taft–one of the weaker public high schools in NYC located in the Bronx—need a higher score than a kid who attends St. Andrew’s, simply because one high school is in NY and one is in Mississippi?
@jonri because it’s a MERIT scholarship based on proportional application across states.
Currently, Boarding school students have to meet the DC/NJ (highest) cutoff, not the students own state cutoff and not the state where the BS is located. Students that go to really expensive day schools (that compete with BS) get to qualify based on their state, not the highest cutoff.
@mom2collegekids If you are from a relatively “poor” family and you can get into an Ivy school, you will get almost all costs in financial aid and grants, so there is really no reason for you to go there even if some school offers you a full-ride scholarship. My family did not have money when I was in HS, and I went to an Ivy for almost free, but now that I have some money, I don’t want to send my kid to an Ivy because it costs too much because we won’t get anything in financial aid. When it comes to colleges, it’s middle class and high middle class families who suffer the most if their children want to attend well-known schools.
Since we live in CA, hopefully my kid can at least get into to UCLA, UC Berkeley. And believe me, IMO it’s harder for CA students to get into UCLA/UC Berkeley than some Ivy schools.
Depending on the definition of “middle class”, a “middle class” family may still get substantial financial aid at places like Harvard.
Net price calculators say for a US citizen California resident student with two parents, no siblings, and no assets:
Parental income Harvard net price UCB net price (living on campus)
$ 60,000 $ 4,600 $12,921
$ 80,000 $ 7,000 $17,604
$100,000 $ 9,600 $23,400
$120,000 $13,000 $26,400
$140,000 $17,200 $29,400
$160,000 $24,600 $36,030 (list price)
$180,000 $34,300
$200,000 $45,000
$220,000 $52,340
$240,000 $61,480
$260,000 $67,850 (list price)
Note:
student $ 4,600 $ 8,400
loan+work
assumed at each
school included
in above numbers
https://college.harvard.edu/financial-aid/net-price-calculator
https://saservices.berkeley.edu/calculator/dependent.aspx
In other words, even with the relatively good in-state financial aid at UCB, Harvard may still be less expensive even up to $180,000 or so parental income, which presumably includes some of the “middle class”. Of course, getting into Harvard is the hard part (although getting into UCB is not that easy either).
Not so. I was a top fraction of one percenter, was in High School in Massachusetts. I washed about 100,000 dishes, delivered mail, and generally worked my butt off to pay for college and pay off all the loans I took out before I started Grad School. And I graduated from the University of Southern Maine, not exactly the kind of school 750+ SATs and A grades are supposed to get you into.