<p>
[quote]
Yes, fine, whatever. Some people clearly revel in their pain so I almost feel bad taking it away. Without going all feminist-y on you, black people got the right to vote before women, a black president was elected before a woman president, and women still make something like 70 cents to every dollar a man (white or black or purple) makes. Let's not play the 'who suffers more' game.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>At the risk of getting flamed at, US society has, for better or worse, accepted AA for African-Americans as it's currently practiced to redress circumstances that were (in general) unique to African slaves brought to the US. They were ripped away from their families, against their will, brought to a strange land they knew absolutely nothing about. They were not legally allowed to read or write. They faced severe emotional and/or physical punishment if they attempted to communicate with others in their native tongue. So basically (in general) they were bereft of any advantages other groups that emigrated to the US had. Any past history they may have had of scholarship, hard work ethic, etc. that other groups had was effectively lost.</p>
<p>Another thing to consider is that the Civil Rights movement of the 1960s raised awareness of discrimination and racism to a level that it was nationally recognized. This helped the causes of all other minority groups.</p>
<p>You make it sound as though anyone alive today was actually a slave. My great grandparents were enslaved by communism in Russia that lasted for decades. They got no schooling and were practically slaves in almost every sense of the word. I don't believe I should get preferential treatment because I, Miss Silvestris, was never a slave, nor were my parents. Nor were any black person's parents alive today. And I don't believe that you can seriously demand special treatment for something that happened generations ago. You can't blame all the problems of black people on once being slaves.</p>
<p>"Miss Silvestris," you forget that your family came to this country willingly. Thus, it is not our responsibility to try and "fix" what the soviets did to your family. HOWEVER, many black people were stolen from their homeland, enslaved in America. As a result of that and of generations of segreation, many (if not most) black people in America still feel the effects of this in their daily lives. Many black people are still caught up in never ending poverty cycles because of segregation. </p>
<p>While I do agree that AA is a flawed idea (just like every other idea in the West), all it seeks to do is try and level the playing field. Unfortunatley, it often helps black people who do not need the help since not all black people are still feeling the effects of segregation.</p>
<p>Check out Dr. Sheila Widall's presentation [Digits of Pi] on women in engineering on the MIT website. Below a threshold of around 5 or 10%, any urm gets a subliminal message that they don't really belong there. </p>
<p>So go to schools where your demographic group represents more then 10%. They exist. Find them and go. The data can be found on ASEE.org</a> - ASEE - Publications - College Profiles - Search the Profiles. If you are talented enough to get into engineering schools, you can chose to go to schools where being the only XXX in the room does not end up being a barrier to success.</p>
<p>Thanks for that link, Toadstool. Wow! I'm really surprised at how low the numbers are for women generally and for AA women in particular.</p>