Will admissions dismiss a high GPA if it's from a homeschool student?

Pre-College Issues Home Schooling and College
1

My family doesn’t put a lot of emphasis on GPA, but today I determined that my GPA is currently a 4.0 unweighted, and 4.8 weighted. I’m aware that this is pretty freaking high. But…does it even matter?

I’ve noticed that if I share my grades with other people, they tend to think that, because I’m homeschooled, they don’t mean anything. They figure that I must be getting 100% grades in ‘Being A Good Daughter 101’ and ‘AP Sleeping In Until Noon’. They figure that my parents must be padding my transcript with “fake” classes and “fake” grades, when really that’s not the case at all.

My parents rely on a lot of third-party sources to support their education. Whenever I self-study a subject, or they directly teach me, it doesn’t go on my transcript. Only courses that I’ve taken with other people go on it. These are “real” classes that I’ve taken with “real” teachers. We weigh my GPA just like everyone else does, adding a .5 to Honors classes and 1 to AP classes.

I know that obviously it matters that I have been doing well, but if a traditional student had that same GPA, would it be seen as more impressive?

2

My kids take classes I have designed mixed with outsourced classes and both go on their transcripts. I don’t weight grades bc it got way too complicated for me to figure out. How do you weight 300 level classes taken at a university? Equal to an AP? Higher than an AP? It was just easier to not weight any grades and let schools figure it out on their own. My current college student had a 4.0 on his transcript. It was never questioned. (And his college GPA verifies it.)

The only opinion that matters in terms of your GPA is admissions. Man on the street opinions are irrelevant.

3

If you use the Common App to submit your applications, your parents will have to sign up for their own account as your guidance counselor. There, they’ll be asked to fill out a school report and a number of sections that include “how were grades determined,” “how and why you homeschool,” and a list of any outside/non-home classes. They’ll also have to submit transcripts and a guidance counselor letter. (We do mostly in-home classes and so included everything on his transcripts.)

Homeschoolers have more hoops to jump through - required to take the SAT and SAT IIs even at “we don’t look at test scores” schools. In my son’s case, his scores were average. (Long story made super short - he could only take the tests once and there wasn’t much time to prepare for them.)

Our son has a really high GPA too and a strong application. (Challenging course load, excellent LoR, incredible essays, an extensive list of strong ECs.) He got an interview with his first choice Ivy and we’re pretty sure his application has made it to committee. They take a handful of homeschoolers each year and during our tour and info session, the Admission’s officer said they welcome them.

The outside perception of homeschoolers sucks. If I hear the phrase “mommy grades” one more time I’m going to scream. Our kids work their butts off. It would be a disservice to them and a waste of years and money if we sent them to college unprepared. Many colleges love homeschoolers because they’re independent, driven learners.

4

The GPA you report is impossible for most high school students to achieve, because they don’t have the option of picking and choosing which courses they include in their GPA–so it’s meaningless to make comparisons.

5

@mathyone I’m not sure I follow. I don’t really get the choice to choose what is included in my GPA? My parents don’t really assign me grades for work that I do for them. Whether I do it really well or not so well, I don’t get any kind of grade for my work. Typically, this consists of things like read this book, watch this documentary, do some research on this, etc. I do it, tell them I did it, we talk about it, and that’s it. My transcript that we get my GPA from consists of ALL “real” classes that I’ve ever taken, regardless of grade. So, these are courses taken online via my districts virtual school, these are classes taken at the community college… If I get a C in a class, it would go on the transcript. If I get an A in the class, it would go on the transcript. There’s not really any picking and choosing involved.

6

I would not worry about it other than to check each college where you want to apply and see what that particular college is looking for in homeschoolers.

My homeschooled DS has applied to mostly state universities and there is variation even in that world.

What can you do about it now anyway? Work with what you’ve got (which sounds great).

7

@Bozusaki I think the confusion is being caused by how you are describing your homeschool. Most homeschoolers do not outsource every single class. It sounds like all of your courses are outsourced and your parents are supplementing those courses by asking for additional work. I think @mathyone thought you were not including courses in your GPA.

8

No they won’t assume, especially when you say you’re just counting 3rd party or “real.” They look at the transcript, see the courses and results. Just understand that the top holistic schools look for more than stats. You need to present the whole of what they look for. The GPA will put you in good stead, hopefully your std scores are good, then you have to show the rest of the attributes they like. Put in that effort to understand what it is.

I agree with, “Many colleges love homeschoolers because they’re independent, driven learners.” But the individual needs to show this, same as traditional high school kids do.

You can consider including the “coursework” you did that wasn’t graded, to show the breadth and depth. Maybe other homeschool parents can comment on whether they did that.

9

^^yes, definitely take the time to show what makes you special as a student (homeschooling is a part of that picture).

I just don’t find it productive to ask “what will colleges think?” The best thing to do is to get the facts of what a particular college/university is looking for, and if you have any time left you can plug the gaps (take SATII’s, etc., if needed). UF has a specific admissions person who helps homeschoolers.

We have some classes on DS’ transcript which were graded by me, but my son also has lots of outside validated grades as well. If it’s a problem at a particular school we try to address it with a DE credit or CLEP test. My son also took SATII math level 2.

My son, thanks to his reading tutor, has an awesome literature background, and we really don’t have it reflected on his transcript other than his freshman year English grades. I consider it as just part of who he is as a student, though I have seen schools that want lots of details of textbooks used, book lists, etc.

10

“My parents rely on a lot of third-party sources to support their education. Whenever I self-study a subject, or they directly teach me, it doesn’t go on my transcript. Only courses that I’ve taken with other people go on it.”

Are you filling all credits required for high school graduation with third party sources? You take third party PE, art, music, years of foreign language, and these are all on your transcript as non-weighted classes? If not, then you are picking and choosing.

11

I am in that group that assumes a 4.0 UW GPA and a 4.8 W GPA is meaningless if you have a class of one and have no comparisons to any other student or widely accepted textbooks/online materials/college courses. I don’t care if it is your parent or anyone else teaching you, a class of one requires justification of grading.

I teach college, and even with classes of ten students, it is very hard to grade students fairly because the material is changing year to year, and one year 80% might be an A, and another year 90% might be an A.

What we end up doing in some cases is when we need to cover Ch. 1 - 10, sometimes we cover Ch. 1 - 8 because otherwise we might be spending too little time on each chapter.

And that’s exactly what some colleges think about homeschooling - barring standardized tests or online course records, the parent can customize the course for the student, and also allow things like open book exams and extra time as needed, so yes, what does a 4.0 GPA really mean unless there is comparison to other students somehow.

Homeschooling is one of those issues that people get defensive about, but it’s not the homeschooling itself that is the issue. Homeschooling can be MUCH better for some students, and be defensible. But that’s the key - as a college professor, I have to defend my grading, and a homeschool parent should be prepared to do the same.

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/01/26/how-my-child-went-from-home-school-to-harvard-and-yours-can-too.html

(note: the parent is quite a prig, and proves that money is necessary as well as standardized testing and a strong plan)

This thread might be useful if you didn’t find it already:
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/home-schooling-college/874682-homeschool-students-admission-rate-to-harvard-princeton-yale.html

12

Picking and choosing isn’t a liability. You have any idea what sorts of picking many homeschoolers are doing? The best are operating on a different level than many trad hs kids, not missing the basics, but exceeding them.

13

@Mom2aphysicsgeek Right, I should have probably clarified. My family works a lot, and they don’t really have the time nor the resources to spend 8 hours a day completely monitoring my education. I am homeschooled because we can’t afford private school, and because the local public schools are very, very, very bad. I spend a lot of time taking online classes, and recently taking dual enrollment courses at my local community college. I also take advantage of the free time I have by pursuing personal interests, volunteering, and working. As I am sure many people here can relate, it is kind of difficult to put all of this experience that I’ve had on paper. However, the closer I get to applying to colleges, the more I feel as though I have to do just that. The point of this thread was to say, basically: When I put it on paper, it looks pretty ridiculous.

@lookingforward I will definitely consider it. One school I am applying to requires a list of texts used, which I think can convey the depth of some of the instruction. There have been times when a class does not require a certain book to be used, but my parents do. That will be included. My parents and I are just kind of put off by the idea of making up course descriptions and assigning credits/grades to their own curriculum.

@mathyone In my state, to receive a standard 24 credit diploma, you only need 1 physical education credit, which I received last year when I participated in a sport (track) for two years at a local high school and passed a written fitness competency test. You only need 1 fine arts credit, which I qualified for when I took AP Art History in my freshman year. I do not HAVE to take any foreign language to graduate, but I have taken Honors level Latin I in my freshman year, as well. I will probably take Latin II next year. There’s an 8 credit requirement for electives, which is satisfied by things like foreign language, as well as AP classes that I’ve taken like Psychology, Computer Science, Music Theory, etc…

I probably should have noted, but the GPA I mentioned in the OP is my GPA for my JUNIOR YEAR. I’m sure if you take the entirety of my high school career, my weighted GPA would be smaller. (However, my unweighted GPA would remain the same.) It just so happens that in my state, I’m able to get classes that drag your weighted GPA down out of the way early. I know that, realistically, it would impossible for a “normal” high schooler to attain my weighted GPA, and that mine should be taken with a grain of salt. With that being said, my parents try to make me take courses that most closely replicate the classes I would be taking in a brick and mortar school. We follow graduation progression charts and everything. The only “choosing” I really get is determining which class I will take to satisfy a credit requirement. (As in…physical science vs. earth-space science, AP Lang vs. English III, etc.)

14

@Rhandco We will have to disagree. I don’t have to compare my children to other students to grade the difference between A work and B work. Yes, my kids’ courses are designed by me for them, but what they complete for assignments is not flexible and the rubrics for grading are firm. If they earn an A, they earn an A. If they earn a B, they earn a B, etc. I have had a child with a C on his transcript, another with multiple Bs. If my child has a 4.0, it was hard earned and superior work.

There are homeschoolers who do not assign grades and their core philosophy is work to mastery. They have to explain their courses and progress in their guidance counselor letter.

15

Weighting is done differently at different public schools. Consider what your unweighted grades themselves represent, the rigor and how the courses relate to your possible major.

You have to weigh the effort in describing a non-graded course versus the possible impact of showing that on the app. If you decide to only describe graded/3rd party, you can still show some list of the more relevant others in Addl Info, with a line of explanation. Short but sweet. We don’t know what these are, for you. Nor your college choices.

When adcoms review, they look for not just performance but some of the judgment or enthusiasm behind choices. Eg if SFMom’s son has “awesome literature background,” there are ways to describe that, if it was a goal to, say, read a particular breadth and depth, even if not in class format. This is different than a regular hs kid saying, “I love to read.”

16

@Bozusaki - I’m feeling of vibe of something here, maybe a bit of sheepishness about homeschooling? If that’s going on try to resist it. Homeschooling is a great opportunity for the right student/family. Colleges/universities are pretty good at spotting the positives and negatives of homeschooling (at least it seems to me).

Maybe I’m projecting my own feelings on to you. It took me a long time to get over the feeling that we were doing something weird with homeschooling. I was a public school person all the way through grad school. I truly value and love education.

Just do your best to capture everything you’ve done/doing, and to meet whatever requirements there are by a school of interest (and of course in compliance with state law). That’s really all you can do.

You sound like a good student!

17

@SouthFloridaMom9 Yes! The OP does not need to apologize for homeschooling. Project the truth of what has been achieved…no less, no more. But state what has been done with confidence.

No way I will ever feel like I need to apologize for homeschooling or justify what my kids have accomplished. No apology. They are outstanding students with great work ethic. Their As are most definitely As. If outsiders want to diminish their accomplishments as “simply bc they are homeschooled,” they can, but it doesn’t actually change what they have done or continue to do. :slight_smile:

18

Your test scores will be important. Colleges are looking for some benchmark against which to compare you to other students. I am going to be honest – I don’t recall ever seeing a home schooled student out here reporting a poor GPA. Colleges are aware of this, so are going to be looking for some external comparison or validation.

19

Colleges will not accept “My kid is brilliant, trust me”. Test scores would be crucial for such applicants.

20

I wonder if some of the responders to this thread have ever been admission officers reviewing homeschool applications or have been homeschoolers submitting applications.

Universities make the application process for homeschoolers pretty clear in terms of what they expect. Different schools have different requirements. Some want subject test scores. Some won’t even look at them. Some only want a transcript. Some want course descriptions, book lists, and descriptions of how grades were determined.

What we have never encountered is cynicism toward what has been submitted. The cynicism in this thread is not at all representative of my kids’ college application process. (And all told, all my grads combined have only ever received one rejection.)