<p>I want to study math-cs, but could switch to econ, don't care much about sports/party. Please help me.
I'm international and no one in my country's ever heard of Williams.</p>
<p>many people warned me that after you came to US you'll chang your mind and study econ. Is it true? Thanks.</p>
<p>Hey Cloria, congrats on the acceptances. Williams and Dartmouth are sooo similar ... Dartmouth might have more resources and is closer to a university feel, while Williams definitely has the small liberal arts school atmosphere (but also has great resources). And you'll always have time to tinker around with your major once you get to school, but a lot of people do end up falling in love with econ. Dartmouth has a great business school, so if you end up going there and doing econ, that might be an asset for you. Good luck.</p>
<p>Cloria--you'll find that the people who "count" (academe, prospective employer, etc) will have heard of Williams, usually even internationally. The street name recognition is obviously less than at Dartmouth, but that shouldn't be something that you base your decision upon. Williams has arguably the strongest math department among liberal arts colleges and has quite strong econ and CS programs as well (top couple among LACs in the country). The term "Williams Mafia" is typically used to describe the incredible amount of alumns in powerful positions networking in the art world, but it is occasionally used for business/ibanking as well--Ephs are overrepresented in the professional world of economics.</p>
<p>Dartmouth is strong for all of these programs, but a very different school (for one, it's about 50% frats--Williams doesn't have frats). You should visit both schools and see which feels best for you.</p>
<p>You should also consider the D-plan trimester system, one of which must be during the summer. Some people like it, some don't. Williams is superb for math, and there's enough overlap with economics that it's a common double major. Both great places!</p>
<p>I have found that Dartmouth is recognized more in academic circles throughout the country more so than Williams. Having visited both campuses, I enjoyed the atmosphere at Dartmouth more and almost attended Dartmouth. As far as changing your major, yes most peope change their major. I completely changed mine with in the first 2 months of my college experience. Both are essentially in the middle of nowhere, so location is a push. On a side note, you might find that once you get to college, you will want more of a social life. Remember, the person you are when you are apply to college is not the person you will be once engulfed in the college experience. Your priorities might shift, though I am not implying that social life will come before academics. Also, have you visited either school?</p>
<p>"Cloria--you'll find that the people who "count" (academe, prospective employer, etc) will have heard of Williams, usually even internationally"</p>
<p>ph my gosh, no! Williams is not well known at ALL...but it will give you a good education. Of course, for prestige, Dartmouth is much better, but in terms of education, it may be a toss up.</p>
<p>To be quite honest, I am really not sure that either is well known.</p>
<p>I'd pick Dartmouth for the name.</p>
<p>wow.. when i talked to professors and stuff, ppl who knew dartmouth knew williams and vice versa. Williams has its own prestige among 'those who matters'. williams isn't no name either. its just as hard to get in as dartmouth.</p>
<p>Have you ever heard of AWS? It stands for Amherst Williams Swathmore. To merit its own abbreviation ala HYP, it has to have prestige.</p>
<p>Yea, my experience with talking to people in influential positions (college profs, people working in grad school admissions, people in influential positions in companies, etc) is that the Williams name is just as well known as the Dartmouth name. Of those people who have heard of both schools I'd say that more tend to be impressed with Williams, but that's obviously an entirely subjective experience of mine. My guidance counselor (who had never heard of Williams), however, is still crushed that I turned down Dartmouth. If his opinion mattered to me, however, I would be at University of Maryland rather than either of those schools.</p>
<p>"Have you ever heard of AWS?"</p>
<p>no, and neither has anybody else. Gosh, Dartmouth vs williams is not even a questions...go to the Ivy for your future's sake!</p>
<p>Don't speak for anybody else. I actually first came across that abbreviation on these boards.</p>
<p>Go to the one that best suits your needs and personality the best...and that you think will help you develop the best as a person (that means social experience, life's skills, as well as academic field of interest). Selecting a school that you can help you become the person you want to be is what is really best for "your future's sake." Both have superb reputations, but, in a very short period after you finish your undergad (after grad school decisions are made), most people won't care...really. Most of the people you deal with in your adult life...for the next 60+ years...won't care. The population in general woon't even know what these "names" mean anyway, and, as an adult later in life, what you have accomplished will mean more than where you went to undergrad.</p>
<p>if you are looking at prestige:</p>
<p>Keep in mind that Williams is ranked #2 on the LAC list as opposed to Dartmouth's #10</p>
<p>Williams is #1. ;)</p>
<p>Apples and Oranges. Isn't Dartmouth listed under "universities," while Williams is under colleges? Again, both are just terrific schools, but one is larger than the other.</p>
<p>ummm... yea just kidding about Williams being no. 2... As they are both ridiculously selective I will not be looking at either... :)...excuses excuses</p>
<p>Trust me, is you are concerned with prestige, Williams is at least the equal of Dartmouth, and among places I imagine you would like to be after college -- fellowships, grad schools, consulting / investment banking jobs, etc. -- Williams may be considered even more prestigious: after all, for folks who want liberal arts colleges, Williams is clearly the best of the best (along with a few others), while many people (wrongly, I would say) consider Dartmouth in a second tier below the top few ivies. Just look at the Wall Street journal survey of 2004 of percentage of students at the top five business, law, and medical schools: Williams finished fifth, after HYP and Stanford, ranking above Dartmouth. I am not saying Williams is "better" than Dartmouth -- I think both provide amazing educations and attract similar students -- but for those on this or any thread that say Williams is less prestigious, that is just demonstrably false. The average "man on the street" will have heard of neither. More people in general will probably know Dartmouth because of the Ivy affiliation, but honestly, who cares? I think 90 percent of people who would attend either school do so, in part, because of the opportunities they provide to attain some greater goal -- usually a graduate degree, or perhaps a top job out of college, or access to an accomplished and loyal alumni network. For any of these goals, Williams certainly does not suffer in comparison to Dartmouth. Williams alums are perhaps the most loyal in the country -- no school has a stronger sense of campus community, and that extends to alumni as well. As mentioned before, pretty much any grad school, medical school, etc. respects Williams, Amherst and Swarthmore as much as Harvard, Yale and Princeton. Most would probably think it provides a stronger undergrad education. And in terms of fellowships -- Williams kicks butt. As just one example, three Rhodes scholars in two years. I don't think Williams' non-ivy status is exactly hurting it in Great Britain. </p>
<p>In terms of the choice, it is a difficult one. I think the 4-1-4 vs. trimester calender is a huge difference, as is the frats / no frats distinction. I think one fun thing about Williams is the Williams / Amherst rivalry, while Dartmouth doesn't have a true natural rival. I think the arts both at Williams and in the community, in terms of opportunities, facilities, and alums, are second to none, and math, econ, history, art history, natural sciences, earth science, english / creative writing are particularly strong departments. Williams just has a ton of fun, quirky, campus traditions that make life there unique: end-of-semester trivia, mountain day, "the walk", and I think perhaps a quirky, off-beat personality would find more kindred spirits at Williams than Dartmouth (the lack of frats being a primary reason for that). Williams is a little more diverse than Dartmouth, particularlly racially. But what really makes Williams unique is the sense of community.</p>