<p>*... "It's just another symptom of their culture of arrogance - image over substance - and it's finally catching up with them," Inouye said. "Everybody in the business knows just how little Harvard students work. They're essentially a lazy bunch. A lot of them aren't even that smart."</p>
<p>Harvard senior Trevor Cox supported Inouye's assertion in the Globe. Cox described a career characterized by an easy grading scheme that has left him with a B+ average. "It's scandalous," Cox said. "You can get very good grades, and earn honors, without ever producing quality work." *</p>
<p>
[quote]
Sakky, do you really mean us to take this seriously? A completely unsupported claim of what "everyone knows", with no data to back it up???
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Uh, I think I provided the data: that link. </p>
<p>Look, if you disagree with what was said in the link, don't take it up with me. I wasn't the one who said it. Take it up with the people who actually said it. I'm simply presenting a news article that discusses what other people are saying. I'm not responsible for what they say. </p>
<p>
[quote]
Notice that I said isn't not wasn't. Show me the data for the past several years - not hearsay.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Uh, that's quite an interesting demand, considering the fact that YOU haven't presented any data to support your assertion. Yet you want others to do so? Let me ask you - where is YOUR data for the past several years?</p>
<p>And I never claimd to be providing any hard numerical data. I am simply pointing out that it is at least the belief of some that Harvard doesn't grade harshly. </p>
<p>Look, if you really want data, here's an idea. Why don't we together contact some of the people in that article and ask them for it?</p>
<p>That isn't data - thats a joke. I didn't realize that Trevor Cox was the President of the Harvard. You're the one who made the original assertion - now back it up! I base my information on my kid who is there now and my kid's friends who are there now, not 6 years ago. In the Harvard handbook for students (2006-2007), it clearly states that a total of <= 50% of all June degree candidates can be awarded honors - not 91% and there is no mention of gpa - so there isn't any indication of % A's or B's or whatever. A maximum of 20% can be granted Summa and Magna Cum Laude degrees. As a matter of fact, the gpa required to graduate Cum Laude in a field is decided at degree meetings. If to get the requisite percentage, the gpa is 2.3 then that's what it is.</p>
<p>It was published recently (last few months, I think) that 53 percent of grades awarded at Harvard are A's. That includes both A and A-, but am not sure whether that's one year of grades or an average over several years. It was in one of the Harvard press outlets (the Crimson, the alumni magazine, or similar).</p>
<p>Assuming Siserune's recollection is correct, that puts it similar to "grade-deflated" Cornell.</p>
<p>And Sakky, we already know that someone thinks, apparently in a fact-free world, that Harvard is grade inflated relative to other elite colleges. That how this discussion got started. </p>
<p>The question now is not whether someone is willing to make the claim, but whether the claim is true.</p>
<p>Here is a link reporting that "more than half" of 2005-6 grades were A or A- at Harvard, and that Princeton faculty voted to cap grades in the A range at 35 percent. </p>
<p>Don’t be soooooo sensitive. Just google H and grade inflation and several internal reports appear that show that ~25% of H’s grades are A and ~25% are A-.</p>
<p>No one said that it was easy to earn those grades; they are what they are. But, the point is that NO OTHER major US college gives out A’s to 50% of its student body…</p>
<p>Interesting info. My kid just finished freshman year and there is no way that half the grades were A, A-. As a matter of fact courses such as expository writing were limited to ~ 3 A’s and A-'s for the entire class by the profs. The students were told this the first day of classes. Also, interestingly enough, my kid found the core courses more difficult for higher grades than math or science.</p>
<p>The issue of grade inflation is not just at some colleges but in schools in general. Nowhere is it more apparent than in high schools across the country.</p>
<p>Interesting. The information I cited concerns aggregates across all courses. Any individual course could deviate substantially.</p>
<p>A and A- representing a large portion of all grades is the norm at elite universities. It makes sense to note this. In my opinion, it makes no sense to complain about it. However, this is a matter of opinion. </p>
<p>Blue and Sakky, </p>
<p>To claim that Harvard has unusual grading practices or much higher grades than other elites is not a matter of opinion, it is a matter of fact. And it is wrong.</p>
<p>“Garbage” may be too harsh - but undeniably, there is an East coast bias
(how would the NE LACs do with say UChicago, Northwestern and Michigan law, bus and med schools?).</p>
<p>I don’t have the most recent stats for Chicago Law, but I do have their 2004 stats:</p>
<p>Colleges and Universities represented in the ENTIRE University of Chicago Law School student body:
Amherst College 5
Bates College 2
Bowdoin College 2
Bryn Mawr College 2
Colby College 0
Colgate University 0
College of the Holy Cross 1
Davidson College 0
Hampshire College 1
Haverford College 3
Middlebury College 1
Smith College 2
Swarthmore College 2
Wellesley College 1
Wesleyan University 1
Williams College 5</p>
<p>Amherst and Williams do well, but the others do not do as well.</p>
<p>For Michigan Law, I have newer stats, but they aren’t as accurate. Michigan Law school gives ranges rather than numbers. </p>
<p>Among NE LACs, only Wellesley and Weslyan have more than 5 students currently enrolled at the Michigan Law school. </p>
<p>MBA programs do not publish their stats. </p>
<p>Medical schools also do not publish detailed stats, but Michigan Medical school has some limited data that also show that NE LACs do not place a lot of their students into Michigan Medical.</p>
<p><a href=“docT:”>quote</a>
no way that half the grades were A, A-. As a matter of fact courses such as expository writing were limited to ~ 3 A’s and A-'s for the entire class by the profs. … Also, interestingly enough, my kid found the core courses more difficult for higher grades than math or science.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Notice that the more harshly graded courses were the ones that are required (expository writing) or semirequired (core). The incentive structure is different in those courses, some of which are also filters for specific majors such as economics or biology and therefore limit the number of high grades.</p>