@excoverer Thank you! You too 
LOL, it’s cool that you got a good idea of where to pick up from your last essay though! I hope the new draft goes well for you!
I’m going to start my common app essay this Friday and start getting my common app prepared. 
@Lunarlitgend Good luck! I decided that I’m gonna write out every idea I have and decide which I like best.
Have a nice day.
Hey guys
As college application for class of 2024 begins in September, I had one particular issue that I just could not find a straight answer to and wanted to see if you guys knew any better. So, I never took AP tests in high school due to financial problems, and tough I took the classes and got an A in them, will not sending in any AP Test scores hurt my chances at getting into Yale?
And also, I have never taken any SAT II subject tests either but have taken the SAT, and gotten a 1580, and the ACT, and gotten a 1580, will that also hurt my chances at getting into those extremely competitive schools?
@herewego2024 Your application will be competing against many applicants who would have SAT subjects test scores and AP scores. If you’re an admissions officer, what would you do? Most of them would have near perfect SAT/ACT scores just like you with great GPA.
Don’t know much about if not sending in AP scores will hurt your application, but your SAT score is very good! How much did you get on the ACT?
@herewego2024 and welcome to the group!
@mavian @herewego2024
Hi guys!!! Welcome to the Yalie 2024 Support Group!!
Now @herewego2024 to answer your question(s): You never took AP scores due to financial problems. Does that include with the fee waiver? What I mean by that is, when the fee waiver was added and the original prices dropped you, could you and your family still not afford it?
If so, this is the kind of information that NEEDS, as in IT’S ESSENTIAL, that you put this into your additional information section. Many people underestimate the importance of the additional information section (which it shouldn’t be).
This kind of circumstance that you mentioned to us, and other situations like this, is what needs to be put in the additional information section in order for the admissions officers to see and understand. Because if you don’t send in your AP scores and you don’t mention why anywhere throughout your application, then the admissions officers will form their own conclusions: They’ll most likely assume that you didn’t pass.
However, if you did put this in the additional information section and the admissions officers saw this, then they would completely understand. They may be wondering the same thing that I am with the whole fee waiver thing (so make sure to elaborate on that too), but financial aid is a completely valid reason as to why you can’t take an exam. Some students are only able to retake the SAT/ACT a certain number of times (sometimes only once) because retaking it would put some serious financial strain on their families. In addition, schools like Yale, Princeton, Harvard, etc, take financial aid very seriously nor do they judge an applicant based on their financial situation (hence, their application process is need-blind). So if you were to inform the AO’s about this, then no it would not hurt your chances on admissions. If anything, this could further inform them that your family doesn’t have as much money as other applicants and their families and may give you more financial aid. Not that that’s certain. It’s just an assumption by the looks of it.
Furthermore, you (and everyone on this chat as well) have to take into account that these schools judge applicants based on the context of their school and situations, and this dilemma you mentioned is an example of that. People’s circumstances are different and not being able to take AP exams due to financial problems is something that won’t harm you when being compared to other applicants because unlike stats, and extracurriculars, that’s something you have no control over.
Not saying this to give you hope, I’m just saying this because, from how these schools present themselves, it’s true.
As for SAT II’s, SAT II’s aren’t required when applying to Yale. Some people actually take SAT II’s but because they don’t have the score that they want they don’t submit any of them. I’ll admit that, yes, taking SAT II’s can definitely help especially when applying to more STEM-based majors and can give you a little bit more of an edge. But, in the end, it won’t drastically hurt you. There are multiple people who don’t submit SAT II’s who still get into Yale. The same thing applies to AP exams. If anything, AP scores barely matter. Admittedly, it’s good to take AP exams to show the admissions officers that you knew the material in the class and it can help bump you up to more accelerated/higher-level courses of a certain subject (History, Math, etc) based on your scores; it can also give you a bit of an edge. But you won’t get credit for them.
Overall, not taking SAT II’s won’t hurt you that much (Depends on the major that you’re applying to though. For example, for more STEM-based majors it’s important to take the Math II SAT Subject test).
As for your SAT score. Dude, you’re fine. In fact, don’t even stress about your SAT score and god forbid do NOT retake it. I mentioned this before earlier in the form, but SAT/ACT scores only serve one purpose: As a benchmark. You’re clearly way past that benchmark. The average score is usually around a 1450+.
You don’t need a perfect score. If someone tells you that you do, they’re lying. Complete misconception.
Once you hit that benchmark, test scores are no longer important. The admission officer isn’t gonna look at a 36 or a 1600 and be like “WOW THAT’S AMAZING!! SO-AND-SO GOT A PERFECT ON THEIR TEST SCORE THEY SHOULD BE SERIOUSLY CONSIDERED FOR ADMISSION!” Yeah no. That’s not how it works.
Focus more on the subjective things now like your recs, essays, and extracurriculars/passions, because in the end, other than your transcript, that’s what will set you apart from the thousands of applicants who also have 1580+'s.
Hopefully that helps answer your questions 
@herewego2024 Could you not take SAT II’s due to financial reasons as well?
If so, also mention that in the AIS (Additional Information Section).
Thank you guys so much for your replies! I got a 35 on the ACT and yes, I did not take any AP tests due to financial reasons. Thank you guys so much, this put me at a bit of an ease. I will definitely make sure to put my family’s financial status in the additional section when the time comes. If you have any thoughts or ideas regarding this subject or me, please do respond, I love reading them and broadening my understanding.
@Lunarlitgend @Lithopefulyalie
@herewego2024 Yeah your standardized test scores are fine don’t worry about them.
No problem
Thank you!
I really enjoy conversing with the people in this discussion. You guys are very understanding and love to give advice or feedback whenever you can, especially the people who understand the admissions process a bit better than the rest of us!
@LilHopefulYalie LOL! That’s what this chat is for! We’re a support group! We’re supposed to help each other 
Even if I don’t get in, it’ll feel really rewarding to see you guys get in and/or to guide you guys throughout the entire process.
@herewego2024 Yes absolutely! I’ve done a lot of research about the college application process (since freshman year). So if you have any questions don’t be afraid to ask. However, I’m not that informed when it comes to financial aid and the FAFSA and the CSS Profile, though, I am aware of them. I plan on doing more in-depth research regarding finances especially now that we’re applying
Hey @Lunarlitgend and everybody else,
Ok! In matter of fact, I just came up with some other hazy situations that I need more clarifications on.
So honestly these are the areas that I feel most insecure about, the fact that my GPA is a bit low and the fact that I have never taken AP and SAT subject test. Are these things that I shouldn’t really worry about or that I can work around? I do have to say that I have some extremely unique and impressive extra curriculums though so will that make me competitive enough or do you have any advice on more things that I should do?
Let me know what you think!
Is it okay if you can elaborate on what Running Start is? From what it sounds like I assume it must be an academic program at your school kind of like AP/IB/AICE. I looked it up and it says it’s when you take classes at community colleges and such. Basically duel enrollment. But I’d like to hear more about it from you—I need a bit more information.
In general, Freshman year is a tough year for so many students, if not all. It’s the year when you’re transitioning from middle school to high school and it’s the year when you realize you can no longer slack off or study the day before a test as what was acceptable in middle school. High school is when the classes beckme more rigorous and it’s when students really have to learn time management and efficient study skills that work for them. Though it’s not an excuse to slack off and/or have bad grades, this transition is still a rough one and it is one of the main reasons why most students don’t have the best grades their first year. Wanna know a secret though?
Colleges know this. Admissions officers understand that rough transition. In fact it’s one of the main reasons why some schools like I believe UCLA (correct me off I’m wrong) only look at sophomore-senior year grades.
This sort of leads to my next point. Due to that rocky transition, what colleges value more so than the stereotypical straight A’s all 4 years is they LOVE to see an upward trend. Freshman year is tough, hence, they love seeing when a student gets stronger grades throughout the years. For example going from A’s and B’s Freshman year to A’s and A-‘s sophomore year to straight A’s junior and senior year. That shows improvement and adaptability and that’s what colleges like Yale want to see in a student’s transcript. Part of the upward trend, however, is also throughout the years you’re taking more and more rigorous courses. For example: You’re going from taking honors classes to 2 AP classes to 3 AP classes but ALL THE WHILE getting strong grades in them.
Your schedule needs to show increasing rigor but your grades still need to be strong and consistent.
Again, that shows improvement and that you’re learning.
As for you situation with depression, I’m really sorry you went through that and I’m happy to hear that you’re doing better now
To answer your question regarding that, once again this is something you NEED to put in the Additional Information Section. AO’s need to be informed about these things, as I mentioned above, so they can get some context on your situation and give you a fair evaluation in comparison to everyone else. When they see your freshmen grades they WILL wonder why you did poorly. If you tell them that you were going through severe depression, hence, your bad grades, once again they WILL understand that. Life is unpredictable and as teenagers we go through a lot. We go through mental illnesses and we go through personal/family issues and it may inevitably get in the way of our schoolwork. Once again, if you mention this, the AO’s will see this and understand. Plus there’s the fact that you recovered and managed to improve. They will also see that and will take into account your upward trend. It will also tell the AO’s how you were able to fight passed a difficult obstacle—how you didn’t let that stop you from continuing to work hard in school. If anything, that’ll reflect well on you.
In short, no. This will not affect your admissions chances. Your struggled in your personal life, just like with your family’s finances, is not something you can control.
As for those B’s. B’s won’t kill you. There are so many students who get accepted into these schools that have B’s on their transcripts. Of course it depends on the context of your school and how competitive your school is as well as your personal situation.
Your standardized test scores should, for the most part, make up for your GPA alongside with that upward trend you have.
A lot of students who don’t do too well their freshman year try to make up for it by getting high ACT/SAT scores to balance it out. You did the same and, considering how high your scores are, I think it’ll balance out with your GPA .
However, another way students make up for a low GPA is by taking more and more rigorous courses to boost their GPA, especially around junior year. But senior year counts too.
If there’s a way you can do that, and if you believe you can handle the coursework, that’s another alternative as to how you can better your GPA.
I already mentioned AP and SAT II’s and if you elaborate this dilemma you have with these tests in the A.I.S you should, for the most part, be okay.
You mentioned having unique Extracurriculars which is amazing.
Yes, academics are very VERY important when applying to these schools. After all they are ACADEMIC institutions and if you can’t handle the course load they won’t accept you. It’s part of fit and it’s part of the college “business” —maintaining high graduation rates and successful post graduates to boost their reputations.
That’s why your transcript will always be the first most important thing in your application. Test scores are a 2nd but again you’re at the benchmark so you’re fine. However, activités and essays and recs are, other than the transcript, THE MOST IMPORTANT. It shows the admissions who are as a person and your passions.
Other than making up for your application academically, you need to make sure to work hard on those essays. You said you have unique activites which is amazing in and of itself because it can really set you apart from other applicants. But you better work your butt of on those essays. Don’t underestimate them. This is your chance to really show the AO’s who you are and how you can contribute to their school. During unsteady circumstances like this the essays can honestly make or break your application. Of course it’s a holistic process so the essays alone won’t get you in, but they can really help get you far in the decision process.
Grades are important but they aren’t what determine success which is why the subjective is just as, if not more, important than the stats/objective.
Hopefully that helps
@Lunarlitgend Thabk you so much! Honestly I can’t velieve you just explained all of this to me in that much detail! You are amazing. As for Runbing Start, it’s a program given in some states that enrolls juniors and seniors in college classes full time, meaning that you basically don’t even live in the high school environment but rather in the college environment (of course except when it comes to after school programs).
So, in conclusion, you think my GPA meets the benchmark? or in other words it wont hurt me that much, of course in addition to everything else!
@herewego2024 Welcome to the Yale group, and it’s nice to meet you.
Have a nice day.
@herewego2024 LOL No problemo dude!! I’m happy to hear that it helped! Hopefully it eased your mind a little bit and gave you a bit more clarity!! 
As for Running Start…
Dude. Like WOWWWWW! That sounds so hard! Like academically challenging!
HA HA! Now that I know what Running Start is, here’s the answer to your first question:
Remember what I said in the beginning: Colleges like Yale judge applicats based on the context of their school. Always remember that because that is a really fact to important.
Every and I mean EVERY high school is different. Some high schools do AP, others do IB, some Duel Enrollment, others do AICE, some do all, some do a few, and some do none. Every high school offers different academically rigorous programs, and every high school calculates grades differently (hence the need for standardized test scores: to standardize everyone’s Academic range and fairly compare them with each other).
Your school is different in the sense that they don’t have AP or IB or AICE. Rather they have Running Start. This WILL NOT, I repeat, WILL NOT put you at a disadvantage whatsoever. That is how your school works, and just like everything else, you have no control over that. The Yale AO’s will most likely be aware of the Running Start program and if they look back see how you took advantage of it by taking classes that are rigorous IN THE CONTEXT OF YOUR HIGH SCHOOL, then you are completely fine! They will see that in your program you took advantage of your the academics YOUR school offers and challenged yourself.
It’s things like this where high school transcripts can’t really be compared because of how different every school in the US and beyond are. So don’t compare yourself with other applicants. That’s something that many students forget when applying to these kinds of schools.
If you need any more clarity here’s an example: I’ve watched YouTube videos of students who took like 20 AP classes out of the 30 their schools offers and hence get a 5.00+ out of a 6.00
GPA weighted. In the context of their school that’s really good! I mean something like that shows how competitive their school is and they took advantage of the AP courses they knew they could handle and did really well in them. But even though that’s impressive, I CAN’T compare myself with those students because MY high school only offers 16 overall AP classes and only goes up to a 4.33 GPA weighted. So I’ll have completed 8 AP’s by the time I graduate and will have a 4.10+ GPA but it will NOT be above a 4.33. In the context of MY school that’s still really good because, just like other high school students, I took advantage of the rigorous courses my school offered and did well in them.
This is why, over the summer, AO’s (yes even over the summer AO’s are working) spend their time researching so many different schools in the U.S and sometimes internationally; so they can understand the kind of school systems, GPA calculations, academic programs, etc that high schools offer to their students. Some high schools have GPA’s that grade on a 100 scale. Some high schools are new so they don’t have as many, if not no, AP classes offered. Some are more rigorous and competitive, hence, getting a B in a hard course is considered understandable to AO’s.
To answer your question, this will, once again, NOT put you at a disadvantage. Once the AO’s know how your school works and judge your academic schedule and transcript by what your school offers (and think you’re a worthy applicant in comparison to people who attended YOUR school) It’ll put you at the same level as everyone else.
Hopefully that helps
@herewego2024 To answer your other question, your weighted GPA does meet the benchmark. As for your unweighted it’s a little below the benchmark because the average unweighted GPA for Yale applicants is around a 3.90. However, this ties back to what I explained before. It depends on the context of your high school. For all I know, a 3.7 and 4.13 may be a really good/high GPA at your high school. If that’s the case AO’s will definitely take that into consideration. For instance, A 4.0 may be considered really high at a small public school but may be considered pretty low at a bigger more competitive high school. It reallyyyyy depends on where you come from.
Remember this is HOLISTIC admission.
To demonstrate I’ll try and gather what you told me in our last few messages:
-School doesn’t offer IB, AICE. Instead, it offers AP and Running Start which enrolls juniors and seniors in college classes full time.
-Didn’t do too well freshman year. But this was because of severe depression and personal struggles. Nonetheless, this student’s grades and rigor increased throughout the years, resulting in a 3.7 unweighted and 4.13 weighted GPA. That’s an upward trend right there and shows overcoming struggle and adaptability.
-35 ACT and 1580 SAT really good. Way above the benchmark. Could make up for GPA.
-Didn’t take SAT II’s and AP exams. But this was because of financial issues/instability in the family.
-E.C.'s are very unique. Could set you apart.
-(Hopefully) really strong Essays. Shows who you are as an applicant.
-(Hopefully) Rec letters are really strong. Teachers show and support how strong this applicant is as a person and as a student.
Now how does that look to you?
Now I am BY NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO means an admissions officer so take that little overview with a grain of salt. Admission to these schools is really unpredictable and you never know what can happen. Hence, I can’t guarantee you, me, and everyone else on this chat, acceptance AS WELL AS rejection.
However, the purpose of that overview is to see how nuanced your situation is in terms of a holistic view point. Your application is not just black and white. No one’s application is black and white. These AO’s are tasked to look at the nuance and little details of a person’s situation and application.
Even if your GPA is below average, your E.C’s, Test scores, Recs, and Essays can very well balance that out, if not outweigh it. Hence, (it even says this on Yale’s website), it’s not worth stressing over every little itty bitty detail because pretty much everything is looked into.
Bonus:
A little unwarranted advice to not just you but everyone on this forum: Yes, we are going against very competitive applicants and because of that we do need to consider how we’re standing realistically in terms of grades, test scores, and E.C.'s when applying to these schools. BUT everyone’s situation and application and school experiences are so different that comparing ourselves to them is like comparing apples to oranges.
The best advice, especially on a website like C.C., is to really focus on yourself throughout this entire application. I know it’s hard, trust me I know. Easier said than done. But don’t go running around looking at what everyone else is doing because not only will that hurt your self-esteem but it can be unhealthy for you mentally. Plus, it’ll make you go insane during this really stressful season.
Sure it’s helpful to look at other people’s E.C.'s and stats as some sort of guidance but it’s important to take it with a grain of salt because, again, everyone is so different. For instance, I, @excoverer and @beautifulchaos are all interested in Humanities and English but WHY we’re interested in and HOW we chose to show our passion, as well as the opportunities offered to us in not only our school but our community/state to pursue those passions may be completely different (with the exception of international/national competitions and programs).
What I’m trying to say is:
Focus on yourself.
Focus on your own application process.
Remember where you’re coming from as an applicant, person, background, etc.
and most importantly,
Be yourself. That’s honestly the best thing you can do because in terms of college admission everyone is LITERALLY already taken and admission officers are always looking for different people, different perspectives, etc. Afterall they’re trying to make a well-rounded class.
Hopefully, this helps
@Lunarlitgend It helps immensely. A lot of things have been much clearer to me now! THANK YOU