Yale vs. Stanford

College Search & Selection
1

<p>Okay, so I've pretty much ruled out Northwestern despite the interesting music + engineering program I got into (parents didn't let me visit...)</p>

<p>And the deadline to commit is Saturday, so, here we go.</p>

<p>I went to Yale during Bulldog Days. Loved it. Loved the people, the classroom environment, the amazing music culture, etc. The housing wasn't as great as I thought it would be (but it was probably because I was staying in some dreary-ish annexed housing), but it was still pretty nice. The city was fine.</p>

<p>I went to Stanford on an alternative visit (didn't have time during Admit Weekend). Thought it was okay. The people were pretty cool, but the whole drinking/partying thing was a lot more in-my-face and they tried really hard to seem laid-back. The classes I sat in on weren't as great (but I sat in on some huge lectures, as opposed to small classes at Yale). Didn't feel as...stimulated or spirited at Stanford, but I also happened to visit during midterms week.</p>

<p>I think it's pretty obvious that my heart lies with Yale, despite the bias of comparing Bulldog Days to midterms week. I'm from CA, and I wouldn't mind a nice change. Here's the problem: as much as I love music (Yale clearly wins here), my major is probably going to be in the science and engineering department. Stanford has a "much better" program in that area and seems to provide more future opportunities with Silicon Valley and all. Yale's program is small and allows for a lot of attention and easier research opportunities, but it's program isn't as "good" (quotations because I don't really know what it means to have a "good" or "bad" program).</p>

<p>I've always been leaning towards Yale, but I'm second-guessing myself. I've been thinking: if I think I'll be happy wherever I go (which I do believe), and if I think I can be extremely involved in music wherever I go (which I kind of believe is true, even at Stanford), why not choose the school with the better engineering rep and more opportunities?</p>

<p>Maybe I should just commit to Northwestern instead? haha :P</p>

<p>Any comments?!</p>

<p>EDIT: I think I should add a point. I know most people say at the HYPSM level, choose based on factors other than departments because they're all high-quality educations. I understand that, but the engineering difference between Stanford and Yale seem to be more pronounced (in terms of reputation, rankings, and whatnot) than the difference between other departments between these 5 schools.</p>

2

<p>If you seriously want to become an engineer, it is Stanford all the way.</p>

<p>Stanford people invented a lot of technologies: transistor, Klystron (foundation of radar), GPS, LASER, internet, microprocessor, gene cloning, micro-array, electronic robot arm, digital music synthesis, DSL, google search engine, the world’s first radio station, satelite dish, expert system, and etc. To simply put, Stanford nutures some of the most creative engineers who change the world. </p>

<p>Yale is not a factor in engineering. </p>

<p>In terms of current faculty strength, Stanford has 90+ national academy of engineering members, while Yale has less than 10. There is really no comparison between these 2 schools in engineering.</p>

3

<p>Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery:</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>[Is</a> Stanford invading Harvard-Yale turf? | Nov 16, 2000](<a href=“yaleherald.com”>yaleherald.com)</p>

4

<p>Go to the school you like, sounds like Yale. Though I would seriously consider Stanford. I also would take a second look at Northwestern, great school.</p>

5

<p>Honestly dude, its possible to be a fantastic engineer out of your local state school.</p>

<p>You’re going to have the Yale name on your degree. When you’re looking for jobs, you’re almost always going to have advantages over others in terms of the name on your degree. And even when you’re competing with someone from Stanford, its likely that you yourself will be far more important that the slight difference between Yale and Stanford.</p>

<p>You can absolutely choose between HYPS schools based on strengths of individual programs. What people really mean to say when they say “The programs are all so close it doesn’t matter” is that you shouldn’t ignore other factors for a superior program.</p>

<p>If you really liked both Stanford and Yale and you were having trouble choosing between the two, the Engineering program would absolutely tilt the scales in favor of Stanford. But I’d say clearly Yale is your school. You loved Bulldog Days, you loved the people, you loved the classes, you loved the environment, you love the extra-curricular opportunities–I’m just reading your post back to you!</p>

<p>What’s more important? A better (and let’s be honest, you’re going to be with top students, top faculty and with top-level resources at either school) Engineering program with worse everything else, or a worse Engineering program with a better everything else? As important as I’m sure engineering is to you, you’re likely going to spend a lot more time and create a lot more memories with the actual life at your school outside of classes.</p>

<p>I say, the dropoff between Stanford and Yale’s engineering programs (which I don’t perceive to be that large) is worth it if you truly love everything else about Yale.</p>

6

<p>Well, I’m not 100% set on becoming an engineer, that’s just the main focus of the comparison because that’s where there seems to be the biggest disparity between programs. I’m probably like 50% engineering, some pure science major or economics could conceivably take over.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Hm … it doesn’t seem like many of these have to do with <em>chemical</em> engineering, which I forgot to mention. I don’t see myself ever entering mechanical or electrical engineering or any computer science type of field, more like chemical, biomedical, materials, etc. I understand that you brought this up just to show a general strength in engineering though …</p>

<p>

haha. I think the biggest problem for me isn’t that Stanford’s is so much better than Yale’s, it’s just that Yale’s isn’t good at all (or so I hear). So the fact that they’re trying to imitate Stanford and move up isn’t actually a bad thing to me … but of course, I don’t know how successful it’s going to be. </p>

<p>I talked to some Yale engineers (some who chose it over Stanford) and they repeatedly emphasize small class sizes, great learning environments, easy-to-find and well-compensated research opportunities, etc. And some also attribute Stanford’s engineering reputation to graduate school, not undergraduate. Some of these guys are getting offers from like, Pfizer and NASA, which are pretty cool? I don’t know …</p>

7

<p>If it is for humanities and social science, they are close. But for science and engineering, Yale can not compete with Stanford.</p>

<p>Here is a side by side comparison according to US NEWS graduate school department rankings:</p>

<p>Math: Stanford #2, Yale #10
physics: Stanford #1, Yale #11
chemistry: Stanford #4, Yale #13
biology: Stanford #1, Yale #7
computer science: Stanford #1, Yale #20
earth science: Stanford #4, Yale #12
statistics: Stanford #1, Yale #33</p>

<p>engineering: Stanford #2, Yale #39</p>

8

<p>Perhaps here is something that matters to you. Stanford is #5 in chemical engineering, #5 in material engineering, #8 in biomedical engineering. Yale is not within top 10 in any of those fields.</p>

9

<p>Those are graduate school rankings, to be clear.</p>

<p>It sounds to me like you want to go to Yale. I dont think any program youre going to find there is going to be anything short of excellent. Your College experience is going to be better in this place you fit best. This isn’t graduate school yet.</p>

<p>It sounds to me like your mind is already set on Yale. Just pull the trigger.</p>

10

<p>Thanks for the data, I know about it already though. And they ARE graduate school rankings, which is probably where the whole idea of Stanford’s rep being based on grad school comes from.</p>

<p>I know it’ll seem like I’m trying to justify choosing Yale over Stanford, but this is my legitimate opinion. </p>

<p>The problem with what you’ve presented me is the fact that almost everything you’ve said is based on some magazine’s rankings (i.e. reputation?). I understand there must be some kind of a base to the reputation, but what is that base? Why is Stanford such a better place for engineering other than the fact that it is ranked more highly, or that historically it has churned out some better engineers? Yale’s engineers can tell me that they have smaller class sizes, more focused teaching, etc., while Stanford’s just tell me about their ranking.</p>

<p>Again, I’m not trying to defend Yale … I just have a problem with the use of rankings because I don’t understand what they really mean. Nothing?</p>

<p>

haha, I guess what I said above pretty much indicates that too … I <em>am</em> legitimately confused, though.</p>

11

<p>*the place that fits you best.</p>

<p>Sorry about that.</p>

12

<p>Yelopen,</p>

<p>Based on your post, probably you should go to Yale. If smaller class means better, then a LAC may be even better than Yale. More focused teaching, what do you mean? How come Stanford is less focused?</p>

<p>To measure which one is better, we have to cite the facts that are measurable and meaningful.</p>

<p>Here is why Stanford is better in engineering (let’s focus on engineering).</p>

<p>1) Stanford has better reputation because it ranks much higher in US NEWS graduate school rankings, and ranks higher in every single engineering major. </p>

<p>2) Stanford ranks higher in undergraduate engineering rankings, and in every single undergraduate engineering major. See [Best</a> Undergraduate Engineering Programs - Best Colleges - Education - US News and World Report](<a href=“http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/spec-doct-engineering]Best”>http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/spec-doct-engineering)</p>

<p>3) Stanford has far more famous professors. Stanford engineering professors are generally super stars in their field. Yale engineering professors are just average good. Again, Stanford has more than 10 times of faculty members selected into the prestigious national academy of engineering. </p>

<p>4) Stanford engineering graduates make more money. Think about Yahoo’s founders, and Google’s founders.</p>

<p>5) Stanford is close to Silicon Valley, the world’s MEGA of modern technology. Silicon valley provides countless job and internship opportunities.</p>

<p>6) Stanford is the most innovative university in modern technology.</p>

<p>If all the above are not important to you, I think you have set up your mind and you should go to Yale. Some one else will love to grab the chance you give up.</p>

13

<p>Why some students chose Stanford Chem Engineering:
<a href=“http://cheme.stanford.edu/current_students/curr_undergrad.html[/url]”>http://cheme.stanford.edu/current_students/curr_undergrad.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Stanford Summer Research College
[UAL</a> - Summer Research College (SRC)](<a href=“http://ual.stanford.edu/OO/research_opps/SummerResearchCollege.html]UAL”>http://ual.stanford.edu/OO/research_opps/SummerResearchCollege.html)</p>

<p>Stanford Student Research Grants
[UAL</a> - Student Research Grants Descriptions and Deadlines](<a href=“http://ual.stanford.edu/OO/research_opps/Grants.html]UAL”>http://ual.stanford.edu/OO/research_opps/Grants.html)</p>

<p>Departmental Research Programs
[UAL</a> - Departmental Research Programs](<a href=“http://ual.stanford.edu/OO/research_opps/ResearchDepartments.html]UAL”>http://ual.stanford.edu/OO/research_opps/ResearchDepartments.html)</p>

<p>Other Undergraduate Research Opportunities
[UAL</a> - Other Research Funding](<a href=“http://ual.stanford.edu/OO/research_opps/ResearchOtherFunding.html]UAL”>http://ual.stanford.edu/OO/research_opps/ResearchOtherFunding.html)</p>

14

<p>Yelopen,</p>

<p>Based on your post, probably you should go to Yale. If smaller class means better, then a LAC may be even better than Yale.</p>

<p>To measure which one is better, we have to cite the facts that are measurable and meaningful.</p>

<p>Here is why Stanford is better in engineering (let’s focus on engineering).</p>

<p>1) Stanford has better reputation because it ranks much higher in US NEWS graduate school rankings, and ranks higher in every single engineering majors. </p>

<p>2) Stanford ranks higher in undergraduate engineering rankings, and in every single undergraduate engineering majors. See [Best</a> Undergraduate Engineering Programs - Best Colleges - Education - US News and World Report](<a href=“http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/spec-doct-engineering]Best”>http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/spec-doct-engineering)</p>

<p>3) Stanford has far more famous professors. Stanford engineering professors are generally super stars in their field. Yale engineering professors are just average good. Again, Stanford has more than 10 times of faculty members selected into the prestigious national academy of engineering. </p>

<p>4) Stanford engineering graduates make more money. Think about Yahoo’s founders, and Google’s founders.</p>

<p>5) Stanford is close to Silicon Valley, the world’s MEGA of modern technology. Silicon valley provides countless job and internship opportunities.</p>

<p>6) Stanford is the most innovative university in modern technology.</p>

<p>If all the above are not important to you, I think you have set up your mind and you should go to Yale. Some one else will love to grab the chance you give up.</p>

15

<p>I’m pretty sure most people would like to have as small a class as possible (assuming they want to learn as closely as possible).</p>

<p>Your new post has a little more explanation…but I don’t know. 2 of the 6 points you made are about rankings again, which I already said I don’t care for unless there was some way to back it up …</p>

<p>Famous professors are cool, but I’m at college to learn, not to be starstruck. Not to say that Stanford’s teaching is bad, because it was pretty good in the classes I visited, but Harvard has star professors and … yeah.</p>

<p>The last three points pretty much go hand and hand and are all related to Silicon Valley. I’m not out to make the most money either…and it’s not the best idea to base a median income on a few anomalies like Yahoo’s founders. That’s not to say Stanford’s engineers DON’T make more money, but I don’t have that stat.</p>

<p>So you’re telling me that Stanford is a great engineering school because of Silicon Valley. I’ll take that point.</p>

<p>Oh, and also, I’m pretty sure going to Yale isn’t going to make me a failure. There should be no reason for you to imply that I’m a lost cause or something because I don’t value the (I think) unsubstantiated points you have presented (other than Silicon Valley, that one is obvious). And true, I am giving up a chance to go to Stanford, but I am also accepting a chance to go to Yale.</p>

<p>In any case, I don’t want to start an argument. You have presented me with your points and mindset. And I have to agree that my mind was already in Yale’s direction, so I will come off as extremely defensive. But, regardless, I’m committing to Yale. And just watch me be a successful engineer there :)</p>

<p>EDIT: Hm, missed namaskar’s post, I’ll look at the links.</p>

16

<p>Thanks for the info namaskar. The first link was helpful, it’s good to know that not all the students at Stanford are trying hard to be laid back. I don’t think I’ll have a real problem with research at Yale though, since I’m probably going to be one of like 10 Chem E majors in my class (assuming I end up doing engineering). We’ll just wait and see :)</p>

17

<p>Great to see you chose Yale. Looks like you’ll get one of the best educations in the world (and probably be a pretty successful engineer if you choose) AND it was at a place you loved.</p>

18

<p>For graduate school admissions, you can go to virtually any 4 year university. The main thing is to get really good grades there and great recommendations from profs- if you have compelling research, it doesn’t matter if you’re at MIT, Stanford or at Cal State Sacramento. Of course, engineering profs are world-renowned at Stanford and not as well known at Yale, so for recommndations, Stanford undergrads have an advantage. Also, there will be more peers interested in engineering and classmates/alums working for the top names in the industry like Microsoft, Apple, HP, Intel, Cisco, Google, Yahoo, etc. as well as the leading startups.</p>

<p>Engineering Rank
35 Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute Troy, NY
36 University of California–Irvine (Samueli) Irvine, CA
37 University of Rochester Rochester, NY
37 Vanderbilt University Nashville, TN
39 University of Colorado–Boulder Boulder, CO
39 University of Virginia Charlottesville, VA
** 39 Yale University New Haven, CT **
42 Boston University Boston, MA
42 Lehigh University (Rossin) Bethlehem, PA
44 Arizona State University (Fulton) Tempe, AZ
45 Iowa State University Ames, IA</p>