<p>You people are nuts. I'm reading some of these posts and can only imagine how your kids actually feel. You are going to push them so hard they have nothing left. They will turn to drugs and other methods of self exploitation. Ive seen it first hand to many times. </p>
<p>If your kids are meant to be successful then there is no need to push. If they are smart and deserve to go to a top school. the admission committees will see it and accept them. If not then so be it. You cant force success. If you are going to push them to do one then, they will naturally stray to the other. When they are teens, forbid sex , they will have it. Forbid drugs and alcohol, they will consume it. Dont forbid these things, they wont.</p>
<p>Hey, I’m a senior in hs, but I’ll respond anyway. I understand where you’re coming from but a little push from parents helps a lot. I have friends whose parents don’t care about their education or are fine with their kids getting straight B’s. Maybe parental pressure would have helped those kids earn A’s and go beyond what they’re currently doing. My parents have always asked me to get A’s and do well on tests, but they haven’t been on my case all the time, and I think I’ve been quite successful. What I disagree with you on is “If you are going to push them to do one then, they will naturally stray to the other. When they are teens, forbid sex , they will have it. Forbid drugs and alcohol, they will consume it. Dont forbid these things, they wont.” I just feel you’ve oversimplified the issue. Who else is going to tell kids not to have sex other than their parents? As a student, as much as I dislike it, I think parental restrictions/involvement are crucial.</p>
<p>Im 23 now and Of all my friends I am the only one who didnt have a parent who pushed. My mother actually told me not to go to college, she said do a trade. Now when I look back the parents who pushed have kids who never went to college or are all messed up with drugs and crime. I on the other hand was told to have sex with as many girls as possible and experiment. No restrictions what so ever, and im a Graduate student. In that I don’t mess around or have alot of sex nor have I ever even used drugs or even tasted alcohol. All of my truly smart friends in school seem to be raised exactly the same as me. There may be different ways to raise successful kids, but what I read preached here is not what has been successful in my experience throughout my life thus far.</p>
<p>Whatever works I guess is ok. But seriously? Your mom told you to have sex and experiment? I think that’s a little extreme. I do agree with you that some parents here are too extreme as well. I feel like kids should have the opportunity to figure things out on their own.</p>
<p>I went to a few holiday parties given by my girls’ friends’ parents. There was one given by my older daughter’s friend. They invited the gang(10 best friends) and their parents for dinner. Th0se girls are going to Georgetown, UPenn, Cornell, Hamilton, Bucknell, Duke…I have known some of those parents since the girls were in grade school. I know all of them were very involved with their children growing up, very similar to CC parents. I am sure those girls party at schools, some of them have had sex, surprisingly some of them haven’t, but they are all doing well in schools. </p>
<p>Dr.Horse, it’s great you have turned out so well with no help from your parents (my dad did the same also). But I don’t think it is an accident that all of those girls are well adjusted and happy kids. I would also like to mention that those girls are all very close with their parents and very happy to have their parents there with them that evening.</p>
<p>Dr Horse, I actually somewhat agree with you. It is responsible parenting to instill behavior that may beget success in their children by setting reasonable expectations and allowing failure if the child’s behavior is the cause. It is too late to begin this process in their hs years. As fpr the college admissions thing, our only expectation was for him to select a college where he could pay for tuition, fees, books and spending money with a combination of merit aid and his $76k college fund. And we informed him that the top universities and LAC’s were financially out of reach. A bit of “tough love” some families would think. For us it was more about personal responsibility and a lesson in the difference between want and need.</p>
<p>He is now a college grad with a great job as a computer game designer, something which he stumbled onto at RPI during his last 3 semesters there with nary a push from his parental units.</p>
<p>Dr. Horse, please be aware that there is a fine line between pushing, nudging, and supporting that parents navigate everyday. Different situations call for different degrees of this. I know I have sometimes crossed the line in both directions, but I know my child knows without a doubt that it is all done with her best interest’s in mind.</p>
<p>Keep reading. CC tends to draw the most hyper of students and parents. Sometimes I read here and have to go for a walk just to get back in touch with reality. (Honestly, the “chance me” stuff is bizarre. Wayyy too much paranoia!). But you also get students and parents who check in and find out minutiae that is helpful and even life changing. </p>
<p>My kids are good examples. They’re smart, motivated (some of the time) and in a huge public high school. Our counselors have some 400 kids each. Some of the kids are struggling to get to the high school diploma – some won’t make it. So, if I waltz in and start asking questions about highly selective colleges, I get the “what planet are you from?” look. I need (and my kids need) to connect with others that are on the same path. </p>
<p>One of my kids is a National Merit Finalist. He was the only one from our school that year. So, what does that mean? What options did it give him? I found the best answers here. </p>
<p>I have to laugh – Dr.Horse, you probably see yourself as a tolerant, nonjudgemental guy (or gal). Just like the organic friendly, religiously tolerant, freedom loving folks at our local alternative school – but, man, you should have heard the moms on the playground start to hand out judgements when a prospective parent drove up in a monster SUV. Tolerant? Not hardly! You don’t like pushy parents. I get that. What about Mrs. Edison, who told her son’s teachers that they were idiots (for saying the kid was unteachable) and flounced home to teach young Thomas herself? She sure was no doormat. I kinda like the sound of her!</p>
<p>I’m a student in high school. Personally, I feel that people are borned with who they are. Nurture may play some kind of factor in how well the student turn out to be, but the good students are almost always the ones that would succeed without any parental pressure. The students who want to make all A’s in school would want to make all A’s whether their parents push them or not. Also, how far exactly can parental pressure go? It is the student’s personal desire that drives him/her to success. </p>
<p>Last year a guy graduated in the top 5, got into Princeton and Yale and a bunch of other top schools, and won national science awards. His little brother (who’s a grade lower) is nothing compare to him. His little brother just show up to school and get whatever grades he ends up to get. They have the same parents, but turned out completely different. There are several other siblings at my school that are completely different people.</p>
<p>For those against parental pressure, why not just get rid of the idea of school completely? So that you can get rid of the pressure from school, teachers and society so that the child can completely learn and grow in freedom?</p>
<p>I agree with you. I don’t think that children should be pushed and pressured it only stresses them out and it will make them not want to do well. If they are doing good then support them not tell them to do better.</p>
<p>While I agree, some folks seem a tad overinvolved, I think a 23 year old who clearly has no kids of college age cannot adequately comment, especially since his parents were “hands off”. He does not say if he went to college or went for a trade. He does not say why he is on this forum to begin with (perhaps now looking for college??). I think it is impossible to know what is happening in the lives of most posters here. You see a tiny glimpse, a moan of angst, but the full picture is not here. You have no idea if the children of these parents are being pushed into directions they do not want to go, or if they will rebel (all kids do to some extent, of course, but not every parent who is involved in their kid’s life is going to drive their kid to self-destructive behavior. That makes no sense)
But still, Horse, your mom telling you to go into a trade, that was being involved, it was saying go get the means to get a job. While many of us are just saying, hey, go get an education. We happen to think an education is valuable and are willing to support our kids a few years longer so they can find something to be passionate about. That is generally because most of us went to college and recognized what a huge “gift” it was. Does that mean we are better, no, but it means we are willing to make some sacrafices and yes maybe just push a little so our kids can experience something awesome.</p>
<p>The only situations I see as being sad or worrisome are the ones where kids on here come crying about “low” SAT scores in the 2100 range and freaking out about not getting into Harvard, Princeton, Yale, etc. Those are the kids who need help. Whether its parental or self-imposed, kids who worry about getting into those schools need a reality check. Those are several schools out of thousands. Look at it this way, you can get accepted into a state school’s honors program and graduate number one in the class, come out debt free and move on to graduate school rather than be in hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt.</p>
<p>Dr.Horse - both my H and I have post-graduate degrees, and from an early on age, my kids spoke of going to college. We also started saving money for this before they were even in elementary school, so of course, we wanted them to find that ‘perfect’ school. They were highly involved in extracurricular activities and did not have the time to spend hours researching their options. Both knew what they wanted to study in college, so it was a matter of finding the schools that would provide the best education.</p>
<p>If it had not been for CC, to this day, I would have never heard of the college D2 is at now. She loves it genuinely, and it does make me feel good to know that the resources available through CC provided an introduction to this school. </p>
<p>The admissions committees were able to see, through my D’s transcripts, recommendations and SATs/ACTs that they were well qualified for admissions to their schools. I had nothing to do with those achievements; those are my daughters’ achievements. </p>
<p>Most of the parents on CC highly value education, and tried to instill these values in their children from a young age. </p>
<p>I don’t think you can associate pushing kids into college with blame for drug and alcohol abuse. Parents who are overbearing when it comes to education, are going to be overbearing in some other areas of parenting, too. And there are lots of parents who are not overbearing when it comes to education (they don’t see a value in it), but are overbearing in other areas, and these kids act out, too. Overbearing, in a pathological sort of way, is not exclusive to college.</p>
<p>I feel that pressures from school are more like peer pressure. It’s something that students can avoid if they choose to. Public schools do not force its students to join clubs, study past midnight, take SAT/ACT/AP, or attend college. It is a choice that some students make. Students can decide if they want to make all A’s in all AP classes or average grades in all regular classes. Parental pressure, on the other hand, is less unavoiable. If the parents chose to force their kid to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, etc., the kid does not really have the freedom to choose not to.</p>
<p>Why do we have compulsory school attendance laws? There is pressure on the student and parent for children to attend schools. If you don’t, the parents wind up in jail or lose their kids.</p>
<p>There is an educational philosophy called unschooling.</p>
<p>I do find myself wondering, Dr. Horse… why do you choose to hang out with us here on cc? Perhaps we are the parents who provide some structure and direction that you indicate you didnt have and perhaps prefer to be with?</p>