<p>arcadia, what do i think? without sounding mean, i think you have way too much time on your hands or you are thinking too much about pecking orders, prestige and status.</p>
<p>I think arcadia's ranking is pretty accurate, although, at least, historically think that Wesleyan & Bowdoin are more highly regarded than Middlebury; but maybe this has changed more recently. Has the Laissez Faire updated their study in the last six years? I think it's the best ranking I've seen, especially with regard to methodolgy. Maybe I'm somewhat biased, but in the tier ranking above would think that Colgate should be at the back of tier 2 (with Carleton probably in the middle of tier 2) and that Bucknell should be in tier 3 before tier 5.</p>
<p>actually fur uncle, the above took me around 30 minutes to compile (and it beats sitting at my desk doing actual work). i know where to find the information, and it's all avail. on the Internet. I thought maybe i'd present a ranking that takes into consideration a number of different sources to look for trends. And there are trends to be found. One already has been discussed (East and West Coast bias in national rankings). I'm sure there are others. Why are you looking at this post if you don't care for "pecking orders, prestige, and status?" I would think the thread title would give it away...</p>
<p>so arcadia, </p>
<p>are you telling me that if you see a car wreck on the freeway you're not gonna look? i thought people who apply to lacs care more about "education" than "name recognition" and "prestige"? you're really wasting your time cause you're trying to make a science out of something that isn't. and, in terms of your methodology, some rankings are better than others in terms of design but you seem to place the same value and weight on them all.</p>
<p>oh... never mind, i see that you go to middlebury which seems to be the last stop on the dartmouth, williams and amherst train for wealthy white kids...</p>
<p>and I see you're interested in Bowdoin for next year, which is one stop beyond Middlebury on that same train...</p>
<p>i like all the very intelligent people who agree with my list, more or less :)</p>
<p>"the last stop on the... train for wealthy white kids..."</p>
<p>I thought I'd just point out to you people that all the top colleges are on this same train. I don't care if Wes and Swat kids don't dress in J. Crew, the majority of everyone at the top schools are wealthy and white, as are the majority of leaders in our country. I don't like it. But not a whole lot is accomplished by fighting over who does and doesn't carry the burden for inequality in our society, when it's pretty darn obvious most people on these boards are quite priviliged.</p>
<p>well ecape, i hate to tell you, but inequality was always around</p>
<p>it used to be</p>
<p>wealthy white protestant kids went to top schools</p>
<p>catholics worked themselves up the ladder so now its just </p>
<p>wealthy white kids in general</p>
<p>and btw, catholics didnt have welfare, affirmative action, and well recruited historically catholic colleges to help them</p>
<p>the same could be said about asians - through hard work alone they have brought themselves to the very top and can be seen at the tops of every field except maybe united states politics</p>
<p>id say asians are a great example of what hard work, and not complaining can do to solve americans "inequalities"</p>
<p>"i hate to tell you, but inequality was always around"</p>
<p>do you think I'm a moron? I know that. It doesn't change anything I said in my last post. And the problem is a lot more complicated than "hard work," though hard work helps. I personally think everyone should have access to good healthcare, for instance. There're plenty of people who don't work hard but are priviliged, plenty of people who work very hard but are poor. I'm the first generation in my family to be "upper-middle class" and it took three generations of hard work to get my family here. (I'm also white, so that helped I'm sure) I think every child should have equal access to good education and health care, at the most basic, irregardless of their parents' economic status. I just dislike the rhetoric of equality professed by our government and educational system, when it's clearly a lot of hot air. But this thread was not meant to be a political debate, you know?</p>
<p>arcadia, i think your ranking methodology makes the most sense of any ranking on this thread i have seen. dima does make an interesting point in pointing out a NE bias. i don't believe that W&L/ davidson are any less selective than many of the top NE colleges (haverford, colgate, wesleyan), yet they are consistently ranked lower.</p>
<p>you can go from lower class to upper middle class in one generation if you work hard enough and catch some breaks - it has been done, being white isnt that great of a help, its probably a big burden - your worst for getting into colleges(no AA) and being recruited(they have quotas to meet and already enough qualified white people) </p>
<p>there are minorities who take advantage of all the advantages they have with AA and recruiting - they go rich and never look back. they might take in some family bet you can bet your upper middle class wealth they wont be going back with their millions to help their neighbors</p>
<p>minorities who were once poor but became rich soon forget their poor pasts and embrace their rich, often white counterparts </p>
<p>i'm not say hard work = financial comfort </p>
<p>but it sure helps a great deal</p>
<p>
[quote]
well ecape, i hate to tell you, but inequality was always around
[/quote]
</p>
<p>And this means we shouldn't try anymore?</p>
<p>it means you should work 10x more, and keep your mouths shut to stop the urge to complain, if you read my posts at all i advocate hard work to overcome inequality</p>
<p>Mike99, race is a /huge/ barrier in this country. The cultural/socioeconomic factors are quite complex. The average income of blacks and hispanics is far below that of whites. Overt racism was quite prevelant through the 1960s, and still is in many parts of the country today. Have you been to the south, Chicago or any number of cities and experienced the racial tension? Pressures come from both sides of the racial divide, but issues are not so simple. When public education is funded on property taxes, huge disparities exist between quality of suburban schools and inner-city schools.</p>
<p>And you speak in huge generalities when you spoke about what is and isn't possible. You were the closest when you said lucky circumstances are needed, in addition to hard work, to make a huge difference in one generation. I am so tired of rich white people complaining about AA. Most of the minorities I know at my "elite school" went through tremendous odds to get here. And they do add something valuable to the campus, in diversity. They have to work as hard as anyone else to make it from here-on out. I know far more white kids who went to prep school and then got here. If /so many/ minorities get rich and never look back, you find them for me, eh? I think you're talking out of your arse. Not that many minorities get rich quick. And many of those that do, are still concerned about the larger societal issues and reducing inequality. You know going to grad school and professional school in many fields has a huge amount to do with having families who can fund it, right? People with rich parents have an all-around advantage.</p>
<p>
[quote]
it means you should work 10x more
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Implicit subjugation, in other words. Yes we should work harder, but it's not mutually exclusive with social justice.</p>
<p>White people complaining about AA is just plain risible. It's like the able driver who complains of being unable to park on the handicapped spots in a full lot. Well, guess what genius: if they weren't restricted someone else would already have parked there.</p>
<p>ecape, stop making sweeping, left-wing generalizations that are fundamentally flawed and founded in opinion, not fact.</p>
<p>dwincho, thats the most ridiculous analogy i have ever seen. i hope you were kidding.</p>
<p>It is a sound analogy. Everyone complains about something that, more than likely, would have never benefitted them either way.</p>
<p>Now go back to differentiating between LL Bean and Nautica, you seem good at that.</p>
<p>guys, hard work overcomes everything- asians were just as poor as blacks and hispanics and look where they are today through their hard work. these were the same people found in these "inner-city" schools</p>
<p>and no i dont live in rural mississippi, i live in NYC suburbs and spent my childhood living in the south bronx NYC so i have seen poverty first hand, and the fact of the matter was 99% of kids just didnt care about their grades at all, they cared about sports or cars or some other thing and disregarded school entirely. whether their parents made 100k or 10k if their kids had no interest in school theyre not going anywhere academically</p>