<p>Bring out the world’s tiniest violin:</p>
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<p>Apparently it wasn’t accepted after all. Sucks for him.</p>
<p>I take it the “thousands” is a figure of speech. Because according to this there were 588 students with that level score. </p>
<p><a href=“http://media.collegeboard.com/digitalServices/pdf/SAT-Percentile-Ranks-Composite-CR-M-W-2011.pdf[/url]”>http://media.collegeboard.com/digitalServices/pdf/SAT-Percentile-Ranks-Composite-CR-M-W-2011.pdf</a></p>
<p>Superscoring may raise that number, but throwing in perfect grades and amazing ECs qualifications significantly reduces the number again.</p>
<p>As people constantly post (accurately), the admissions are holisitc, but having perfect “anything” is a measurable statistical bump -
[Applicant</a> Profile : Stanford University](<a href=“http://www.stanford.edu/dept/uga/basics/selection/profile.html]Applicant”>http://www.stanford.edu/dept/uga/basics/selection/profile.html)</p>
<p>It may be causation, may be correlation, who knows. But there’s a relationship. I’m certain that there’s also a bump for being val as opposed to being lower in the top 10%.</p>
<p>It’s just that the odds are still low.</p>
<p>Quote:
In years past, the course, Introduction to Congress, had a reputation as one of the easiest at Harvard College. Some of the 279 students who took it in the spring semester said that the teacher, Matthew B. Platt, an assistant professor of government, told them at the outset that he gave high grades and that neither attending his lectures nor the discussion sessions with graduate teaching fellows was mandatory.</p>
<p>“He said, ‘I gave out 120 A’s last year, and I’ll give out 120 more,’ ” one accused student said.</p>
<p>It is very hard for me to believe that a Harvard professor ( or any serious professor for that matter) would say something like this. Class and lecture attendance is not necessary??? Predicting how many A’s he is going to give out??? If true, I am beginning to think there might also be serious issues with this professor. These students were never going to take this class seriously.</p>
<p>Good grief. My post #122 makes no sense without the quote I was responding to -
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<p>I hate when I do that.</p>
<p>Of course they don’t completely prevent cheating. Any dishonest student can just ignore the honor code if they are truly determined to cheat. But for the average students, who rarely or never cheat, the honor code simply reminds them of the standards they should set for themselves. This video explains it pretty well:</p>
<p>[Dan</a> Ariely: Our buggy moral code | Video on TED.com](<a href=“http://www.ted.com/talks/dan_ariely_on_our_buggy_moral_code.html]Dan”>http://www.ted.com/talks/dan_ariely_on_our_buggy_moral_code.html)</p>
<p>@HarvestMoon1, it’s important to separate out what you imagine Harvard must be from the real Harvard. As Harvard has in the past had a problem with grade inflation, informing the students that he doesn’t grade on a curve is useful information. </p>
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They’re adults. The Ivies don’t usually take attendance. It’s their own fault if they choose to make stupid decisions, such as not getting out of bed to attend class. I’m sure he didn’t say “you don’t have to come to class,” by the way.</p>
<p>I’m amazed at the number of posters who are willing to blame the professor for the students’ lack of moral fiber. I can feel sympathy only for the fact that this class happened to be the class selected for consequences. It seems there have been concerns about cheating at Harvard for some time. The editorial opinion below from the Harvard Crimson was written 10 years ago:</p>
<p>
[Problem</a> Set Problem: Cheating | Opinion | The Harvard Crimson](<a href=“http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2002/12/5/problem-set-problem-cheating-lets-be/]Problem”>Problem Set Problem: Cheating | Opinion | The Harvard Crimson)</p>
<p>“Class and lecture attendance is not necessary???”</p>
<p>Most all of my college classes were like this. You don’t get graded for attendance anymore in college. If you don’t show up but can still ace the tests (most students don’t) then good for you. </p>
<p>“It seems there have been concerns about cheating at Harvard for some time.”</p>
<p>I know. There is something about the culture of Harvard - get ahead at all costs - that breeds unethical behavior and brings it out in certain individuals in ways that may not have occured if they had gone to “lesser” schools. After all, these are the students who went on to be the executives at all these financial institutions that have been so good to the american people this past decade.</p>
<p>Interesting sample from one of reviews:</p>
<p>“They throw at you situations you haven’t encountered before in such a way that you have to make assumptions about what you should do in a certain situation (not just that you need to think critically, no). Imagine being asked the definition of a word, but you can’t find it online. It has Germanic roots but you were only taught the Latin ones. And you need to use the definition of the word to answer the question. So you have to assume it means something, and go from there. Oh, you got it wrong? Sucks for you.”</p>
<p>I imagine this would be a reference to the test in question.</p>
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<p>I’ve watched lots of Berkeley course videos and it’s pretty clear that you don’t need to attend those lectures as you can just watch the lecture videos online afterwards. You may already know the material too. You just take the risk of missing something - though if you have a good class network, you can just grab the notes from a friend.</p>
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<p>Find the appropriate scholar and ask them. That shouldn’t be too hard to do in Boston.</p>
<p>Well, I think that’s the issue–that students did ask someone more knowledgeable (the teaching fellow) because they didn’t know how to answer the question without knowing the definition, which they couldn’t find online.</p>
<p>(To be clear, the review was referring to the tests. The grade in the class is based on four tests, so those are the only things ever turned in.)</p>
<p>“Find the appropriate scholar and ask them. That shouldn’t be too hard to do in Boston.”</p>
<p>That would be cheating, as the exam clearly forbids students from discussing the exam with others.
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<p>If the cheating turned upon the definition of an unknown word, then the committee investigating the issue could determine who worked with whom. If the word can’t be found on the internet, it would be easy to link the various guesses to different work groups. If it was a word the professor made up for the exam, then it isn’t a case of working from prior notes–it’s clear proof the students worked with each other on the exam.</p>
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<p>This is a clear (unintentional) indictment of the “if I hadn’t cheated, I’d have gotten it wrong” school of excuses. In my opinion, admitting primarily valedictorians can lead to unintentionally admitting many students who place GPA before everything.</p>
<p>New article in the Crimson:<br>
[url=<a href=“http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2012/9/1/ad-board-accused-students/]Students”>Students Accused in Cheating Scandal Frustrated by Uncertain Process | News | The Harvard Crimson]Students</a> Accused in Cheating Scandal Frustrated by Uncertain Process | News | The Harvard Crimson<a href=“emphasis%20added”>/url</a></p>
<p>Harvard University is sending a message.</p>
<p>@Naturally, but the student quoted in the earlier article who had spoken with the teaching fellow had not been contacted by the committee, because everyone who is suspected of cheating has been notified–thus, speaking with the teaching fellow was not cheating.</p>
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<p>Well, if they could look online, why couldn’t they ask an expert?</p>
<p>One thing that I’ve noticed about the younger generation is the reluctance to use the library as in physically going to the library and looking things up in books and periodicals. Would going to the Boston Public Library and asking the reference desk the meaning of the word be okay?</p>
<p>A student could certainly just hop the T and go to BC or BU to find an expert in this area.</p>
<p>“I’ve watched lots of Berkeley course videos and it’s pretty clear that you don’t need to attend those lectures as you can just watch the lecture videos online afterwards. You may already know the material too. You just take the risk of missing something - though if you have a good class network, you can just grab the notes from a friend.”</p>
<p>lol, glad to know lower level undergraduate classes are the same whether you take them at CC, a 4-year univeristy, or Berkeley. You don’t need geniuses teaching these subjects (and you generally don’t, even at an IVY). Course content is often identical (they use the same textbooks!). Makes me glad that I went to cc instead of paying thousands and thousands in tuition to go elsewhere. </p>
<p>I think it is in mainly in graduate school, and to a lesser extent in upper level undergraduate courses, where going to a school like Harvard can make a difference. Enough to justify tuition? Debatable when looking at the quality of education alone. Perhaps more justifiable when looking at other benefits of attending a name brand school.</p>
<p>Many top colleges do have much “higher” expectations of their students. They do expect them to be responsible adults. They do not “take attendance” to see who comes to class, or make students take tests where they can be “watched” to prevent cheating.</p>
<p>The Honor code is alive and well , and taken very seriously at those colleges. It is up to each student there to live up to that code. Those who make “excuses” for violating it in any way should be expelled. There are many other students who are eager to take their places.</p>
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<p>Well, I am inclined to agree with you. IMO, if you need a definition of a word to correctly answer a question, and the teacher has not actually taught that word in lecture or literature, it’s appropriate to ask the teacher or TA “what does this mean?”. I’ve seen students do this myself, during an in-class test. Not if it was a term or concept taught IN class, but if it was some other word needed to answer the question, like “what does silviculture mean?”. The fact that so many in the class apparently could not find the definition of a word that was needed to answer an essay question does not reflect well on the teacher, IMO. The point of a test should be to gauge how well the student learned information from the class (including critical thinking skills)–not to play some “gotcha, I tricked you!” game.</p>
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<p>Yes, that’s a good question. At work when I can’t figure out how to something, I often google “How do I [do whatever I’m wondering about]?”, and then I look at message boards where people asked the same question and got answers.</p>
<p>I don’t really see why asking someone in person is any different from looking at answers from a thousand strangers on the internet.</p>
<p>People cheated on a take home test? Well, I for one am shocked.</p>
<p>What’s been reported thus far sounds ambiguous. However it seems odd if Harvard would choose to suspend for one year many of these students when Kaavya Viswanathan was allowed to graduate without penalty and go on to law school.</p>
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<p>Yes, thousands was an exaggeration, but there are definitely 150 kids up to Harvard par who may end up being rejected. I say take those kids, dump the cheaters. Harvard and an ivy-league diploma are cheapened now that there are obvious cheating scandals. Ivies are going to go down if these things keep happening.</p>
<p>One of the poli-sci professors at Reed College had some interesting thoughts about this situation:</p>
<p>"Watching this story unfold at Harvard feels like watching a slow motion train wreck. I worry that the story reveals an educational model that tolerates and encourages this behavior. The students are to blame, for sure, but there is more than enough blame to go around. I wonder how the administration will protect themselves in the end.</p>
<p>Many will focus on the quotes from over privileged students. It isnt cheating because everyone else does it. You cant charge me with cheating because Ill lose my job.</p>
<p>But look a little deeper, and you may see a system that tolerated such behavior for a long time. </p>
<p>Why has the Administration and the Department of Government allowed a course like Introduction to Government to exist for so long? The course has long been know as a gut. There are 279 students in lecture and 10 discussion sections that meet once a week (an average of 28 students per discussion sectionat my own school we cap classes at 24). The exams consist of four take-home, open book, open note, open Internet exams.</p>
<p>Why did the instructor (if reports are to be believed) write an exam full of gotcha items that were not in any of the lectures or readings? Did the instructor actually supervise the teaching fellows, who (again if reports are to be believed) criticized the exam (didnt the TAs and instructor discuss and collaborate on creating the exam?) and gave out answers? Same question for the teaching fellowsif the exam was that problematic, did any one of them convey this back to the instructor? Or did they just go along with the system that just pushes students through the course?</p>
<p>The honor system at Reed College is alive and well. Its endured some strains because of controversies over drug and alcohol use and sexual harassment cases, but on the academic side, it remains strong. What struck me about the Harvard case is not just how different the culture is from Reed, but how different the students are. I dont think Reed students would have intellectually allowed the kinds of arguments made at Harvard to prevail.</p>
<p>I suppose thats how honor systems are maintained, not just by rules and procedures, but by a culture of learning (as many studies have shown) and a solid set of ethical principles."</p>
<p>[Thoughts</a> on Harvard and the culture of cheating | Politika](<a href=“http://wordpress.reed.edu/politika/2012/09/01/thoughts-on-harvard-and-the-culture-of-cheating/]Thoughts”>http://wordpress.reed.edu/politika/2012/09/01/thoughts-on-harvard-and-the-culture-of-cheating/)</p>
<p>I’m really surprised that Harvard didn’t have an honor code in the first place. ALthough i doubt that with a cheating scandal that involved so many people it would have made such a huge difference.</p>