<p>In second grade, my son's handwriting was so beautiful that you almost could not tell the difference between his handwriting assignments and the example chart of perfect letters they were copying. But it later deteriorated into tiny printing that was hard to read. He did score well on AP tests and essays all through college - I guess the graders are used to reading this kind of writing.</p>
<p>Wow, my son has this issue, too. I'm sure it has affected some of his test scores, although when we realized that might happen we made him engage in a training regimen to make his writing a little more legible. There were also really significant style and content differences between stuff he typed and stuff he wrote by hand -- basically, in the latter case he was using the fewest, shortest words possible to minimize the number of penstrokes required. He had to discipline himself to write more discursively with pen and paper. Luckily, most of the time he winds up OK, but one of the AP tests he took as a sophmore was severely affected by this.</p>
<p>I do think good handwriting is a lost art. In HS I dated two guys with beautiful handwriting and remember this clearly b/c I used to get letters from them at college. One was an engineer and the other went into business, so no, not artsy types.</p>
<p>What are the odds any of our kids know TWO males with beautiful handwriting?</p>
<p>It is a fine motor issue. My sons could build tiny lego civilizations but they printed like third graders and so does my husband and so does one of my brothers.</p>
<p>I insisted that they both practice a decent signature but otherwise, their days of printing are coming to an end. They type like 'sand crabs on meth' (thanks cur).</p>
<p>Architects USED to learn to print well because we used straight edged triangles and parallel bars to make vertical lines. With the advent of CAD, that talent will disappear.</p>
<p>Another one here -- our son's script/handwriting is almost unreadable. The strange thing is that his awful script looks very much like my brother's awful script, so I wonder if it's a genetic thing carried along on the male side of the family. I don't think I've ever seen my husband write in script except to sign his name -- odd.</p>
<p>It's been so long since my boys had to do more than sign their name in cursive, I really don't think they can do more than print.</p>
<p>26 posts and I believe <em>one</em> girl was mentioned ;).</p>
<p>Another thread full of solace for us Parents-of-Boys.</p>
<p>I wonder if the fingers rarely used in keyboarding will just atrophy. Of course, those fingers aren't used in writing cursive either... but don't confuse me with the facts :D.</p>
<p>jmmom, not only is it all about boys, but I had to keep checking the member name to make sure it wasn't the same person repeating the same thing over and over again! The stories are so similar. And here is a "me too" with 2 boys. I have often criticized the SAT writing for expecting a handwritten essay (btw, can they use pen or does it have to be #2 pencil?) from kids who almost never handwrite.</p>
<p>The funny thing is that until this thread, I, for one, thought my kid was the <em>one and only</em> 20-year-old whose handwriting looked like a 4-year old's letter to Santa, as someone above so aptly described it. I knew they were all Platers and Mounders in their rooms, file their important papers by scrunching them into their backpacks. But somehow I thought the handwriting deficiency was unique to him.</p>
<p>My son has developed a very sophisticated looking cursive signature, dashed off quickly and worthy of any highly stressed and busy CEO. Don't know whether he worked at it, or it just came naturally. But if he had to hand write (cursive OR printing) whatever preceded his signature, well - the jig would be up.</p>
<p>My son's writing is microscopic. It's actually painful for me to watch him write and I need strong reading glasses to read it.</p>
<p>My husband's writing is completely illegible chicken-scratch. I'm looking at a note he left on my desk and I can't read what it says :P</p>
<p>Is sometimes related to Dysgraphia (spelling?) which, if diagnosed, can lead to accomodations at both the K-12 and college level that allow the student to avoid writing by hand in every situation and do all work and tests on a laptop. Probably improves their grades if for no other reason than the teachers can actually read the work!</p>
<p>Ever see some of those Amex commercials where famous people "sign" their cards at the end? Our family laughed upon seeing the terrible signatures because there are a couple of males in our family who write illegibly.</p>
<p>I think that boys just don't care much about handwriting. My 13 year old son was never so happy at the end of 4th grade, because in 5th grade they could go back to printing instead of cursive. Also, my 43 year old brother still prints his signature.</p>
<p>I'm wondering how many replies have been written by dads?????</p>
<p>My 14 yo son is similar.</p>
<p>At first I asked myself, is it sloppy or just penmanship, because
scrawling appears sloppy. </p>
<p>The conclusion I came to was that it didn't matter. It is unacceptable,
particularly in math and science where you have to be able to sequentially
show your work, neatly. </p>
<p>We are working on it and it will improve. He does not have a disease which is responsible, an acronym for a disease which is responsible or some arcane excuse. He rushes, and doesn't fully comprehend the fact that appearance matters. </p>
<p>He's a 14 year old boy and you should see his precision and touch from the foul line.</p>
<p>My son was diagnosed with dysgraphia. Teachers could test him orally and he would get in 90's - written he would fail. The Psychologist who did his testing in 9th grade couldn't figure out why she was testing him because she said his IQ was higher than hers - plus he actually pointed out to her that one of the tests was incorrect and could not possibly work the way they said it should - he was correct. then she got to the writing part of the testing and figured out why he was having problems. But he point blank refused accomodations and in the end all we asked for was that the high school let us know if a grade dropped to a C. He learned to make his own compensations and graduated with a B average though School was not fun for him.</p>
<p>Moms of sons unite again! DS has terrible handwriting. I used to tell him "if I was your teacher I wouldn't even grade this because it is a struggle just to read it." I can't imagine how the scorers for SATs are dealing with the "essay" portion. DS has typed most everything since about age 7, unfortunately there are times (job applications for one) where you have to hand write something and it is a pity that it can't be legible.</p>
<p>My son was also dx with dysgraphia. He was in the fifth grade at the time. I must admit I thought he was just a lazy writer- his writing was completely illegible. The psychologist helped us to understand that the huge discrepancy between his verbal IQ and perfomance IQ (written work only) was not acceptable. We insisted on a 504 and accomodation for word processing for written work and to be graded for content not appearance of written work. He is now a successful college student. </p>
<p>In the words of my son years ago after he first learned to type...
""Trying to write on paper is like trying to drag my self up the stairs with two broken legs. Word processing is like hopping on an elevator, pushing a button and before you know you are there! ?|"</p>
<pre><code> What are the Warning Signs of Dysgraphia?
</code></pre>
<p>Just having bad handwriting doesn't mean a person has dysgraphia. Since dysgraphia is a processing disorder, difficulties can change throughout a lifetime. However since writing is a developmental process -children learn the motor skills needed to write, while learning the thinking skills needed to communicate on paper - difficulties can also overlap. </p>
<p>If a person has trouble in any of the areas below, additional help may be beneficial.
Large gap between written ideas and understanding demonstrated through speech.
Tight, awkward pencil grip and body position
]Illegible handwriting
Avoiding writing or drawing tasks
Tiring quickly while writing
Saying words out loud while writing
Unfinished or omitted words in sentences
Difficulty organizing thoughts on paper
Difficulty with syntax structure and grammar</p>
<p>daffymom, my S has none of the signs you list except those related to the mechanics of writing. I can't believe that this problem is caused by a deficit. </p>
<p>I agree with scidoc that this is not acceptable. My son's goal is to be a physicist, but even if he were not intending to do math or science I would believe that he should be able to write legibly. But I know I'm in the minority.</p>
<p>Yes, Jmmom, this is yet another "parents of boys" thread. Do you think we should have our own forum?</p>
<p>I liked the course you linked to, dmd77. I'm going to look for one in our area.</p>
<p>Dysgraphia is a reality and so are Haste and Couldn't Be Bothered. I think my son has a combination. As I said earlier, when a favorite teacher he revered said, "I can't read this so I'm not giving full credit" he started improving (this was in 9th grade). I know he had and has legitimate difficulties. I used to let him dictate the occasional writing assignment to me (with teacher's permission) and the resulting product was in stark contrast to what he could write by hand. But over the years he's improved with practice and that's good too.</p>
<p>So I'm in the middle on this. I know some kids may permanently need accomodations. Others, though, can learn if motivated and there are benefits, like his math work is now neat as a pin and therefore easier to score. Also glad he made progress before SATs, etc. where some handwork is required. The kids who really can't get there should be able to take modified testsand do all written work by keyboard or dictation. But I'm grateful for the stubborn teacher who thought my son could do better.</p>
<p>
Why would a student with dysgraphia possibly refuse accommodations that would make his school life so much better? Dysgraphia is real, and there is no shame in accepting accommodations for it. In most cases, the accommodation may be as simple as allowing all schoolwork, tests, etc. to be done on a computer or laptop. And given how many career paths there are where no handwriting will ever be required, it's not as though this type of accommodation is going to undermine the student's success in life after school. To the contrary, the ability to perform up to one's true abilities in school will enhance the student's opportunities in life after school. </p>
<p>When my son was finally allowed to do all his work on a keyboard, he was like daffymom's son - no longer having to drag himself up the stairs with two broken legs. He is also now a successful college student. Yes, bad handwriting does not necessarily mean a child is dysgraphic. But if a child is diagnosed with dysgraphia after proper testing for it, I think the parents should insist on appropriate accommodations for the child (and insist that the child take them). It really does make a huge difference.</p>
<p>P.S. to scidoc: Dysgraphia, for those who have it, is not "some arcane excuse." But that kind of attitude towards dysgraphia is probably one of the reasons that some people are reluctant to accept accommodations for it.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I'm wondering how many replies have been written by dads?????
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Well, here's one dad. Our older son wrote incredibly small, but it was much neater than the chicken-scratches our younger son generates - both printed. (I could attribute the difference to the extra hundereds of hours our younger spends on the computer, playing games, instead of writing or studying more.)</p>
<p>So cursive is definately a dying artform.</p>