<p>Mom60 posted just as I was going to mention the books.
I do like structured programs, also structures that accommodate to individual's needs (like using computers for visual learners), sitting in front of class, untimed tests, and med.s. If parents don't see an improvement within a few months, they can be discontinued. So many people I know address not just the ability to focus, but the benefits to family life.</p>
<p>SBMom - I have another book to recommend - this is just one that I really loved when my son was probably around the same age as yours. It is not about ADD but is wonderful in terms improving communication and putting it all on a more positive track. It's called:</p>
<p>Strong-Willed Child or Dreamer? Understanding the Crucial Differences between a strong-willed child and a creative-sensitive child. by Ron Braund and Dana Scott Spears. </p>
<p>Anyway, the title of the book doesn't do justice to what is in it. It really has some extremely important insights, focusing on the difference between kids who are "dreamers" and "doers". ADD kids tend to be the "dreamers" who have a hard time translating thought into action.... lose track of time... etc. But what happens in terms of family dynamics is that parents often do the very worst things possible to get the message across to these kids -- so for example the book explains how threats of punishment can end up making the kid even less likely to do what the parent wants. </p>
<p>--
On the yelling & losing it issue, I would like to also simply suggest that you let go of your sense of responsibility for your son's mistakes a little bit and simply let him bear the consequences. I mean, as hard as it is, sometimes you have to let things be your kid's problem and not yours. Even WITH ADD -- ADD may be the reason for your kid's lapses, and it may also be a reason that you will want to arrange accommodations and support at school and at home --- but you don't want it to start being an excuse. That is, your ADD son needs to know that (a) he has a problem that makes it harder for him to remember and keep track of stuff, and (b) it is still HIS responsibiity to remember and keep track of stuff, despite the fact everyone understands that it is more difficult for him. Otherwise, you will keep clashing and things won't get better. It is really important for him to develop specific strategies that solve the problem ... and so the important thing is to focus on those solutions. The second set of textbooks at home is exactly the sort of solution that eliminates the problem, and allows everyone to move on.</p>
<p>Calmom - haven't heard of that book, but my S definitely falls in the dreamer mode..even tho' he is 18 and hardly a child, I'm going to read it! The "...but I have ADD" excuse is an easy trap to fall into...
It's also been mentioned in several books I have read that the typical punishment/reward behavior moification stuff often does not work with ADHD kids...even my sis-in-law who's son was just diagnosed last year has said that the things that always worked with her other two kids had no effect whatsover with this one!</p>
<p>Emerald & Mom60-- These are great ideas. My S had two sets of books already, but he frequently brings the school set home by accident!</p>
<p>This is such helpful info. thanks again for all the ideas and info.</p>
<p>SBmom</p>
<p>Hello,
I know this topic is relatively old, but I saw it and couldn't help but make a few comments.</p>
<p>First, on the subject of medication, I can really see bothj sides of the issue. My brother was diagnosed with ADD in HS and promptly put on medication. That combined with increased maturity made his grades skyrocket and seemed, at least to me, to make him happier. However, I personally feel Americans have a tendency to look for a "magic pill" to solve all their problems, and thus I probably won't take meds. myself. If you want to go the no med route, then you may want to take to a psychologist instead of a psychiatrist. Only psychiatrists can prescribe medication and therefore are much more likely to suggest that path.</p>
<p>The issue of accomdations at school is one my family and I have dealt with a lot, and the best advice I can give you is to get involved. Talk to the administration and teachers yourself and explain the issues in realistic terms. If you get your foot in the door, so to speak, early, then you'll be better able to handle problems when they arise. Also, it might be good to have your son talk to the teachers as well and explain his difficulties and abilities on an individual basis for each class. In my experience, most teachers have been very accomdating if I just spoke up-I guess they trusted that I would know what would work and what wouldn't. While having a parent intervene is sometimes critical, some teachers do seem to get edgy when they feel parents are over involved. If you ever move, make sure the IEP or other plan is airtight as some schools and school districts can be less accomdating than others.</p>
<p>Also, make sure you have some idea of what'll happen if one of the classroom books is lost or stolen (It happened to me before). Make sure you know if you'll be expected to pay.</p>
<p>About testing accomdations: Start early! If your son is planing on taking the SAT/PSAT/ACT or AP tests that year, start collecting paperwork at the beginning of the year. Also, keep in mind that the ACT and CB require different forms and provide different types of accomdations.</p>
<p>Good luck to you and your son.</p>
<p>Thanks for your wise words. In about a week we will have a specific diagnosis and recommendations from the ed psych we saw. I will update then.</p>
<p>SBmom</p>
<p>Thanks Wolfpiper!</p>
<p>In reference to the ACT/SAT accommodations, they are becoming increasingly difficult to get,as I understand it. I don't know how they make the decisions...but they do require pretty extensive paperwork, both diagnostic and from the school...so, as wolfpiper said...start early...</p>
<p>S did have accommodations on only the SAT II's...we did not request them on the ACT and he was not allowed accommodations on the SAT I...he did just fine without them...standardized tests typically go quite well for him...</p>
<p>Also, I think (not positive) that if you have an IEP in place and are classified as a 504 student, you are much more likely to receive accommodations.</p>
<p>An IEP is an individualized education plan and is for students who are in special education. A student with an IEP requires "specially designed instruction" and this is covered through the Federal law IDEA.
<a href="http://www.ldonline.org/ld2/test/article.php?max=20&special_grouping=&id=374&loc=9%5B/url%5D">http://www.ldonline.org/ld2/test/article.php?max=20&special_grouping=&id=374&loc=9</a>
A 504 is covered under the civil rights act of equal access and is what is used for students who need accomodations not specially designed instruction. THis is also what students with an IEP will have after they graduate high school. A 504 also protects adults in the workplace from discrimination for their disability.
<a href="http://www.wrightslaw.com/info/sec504.index.htm%5B/url%5D">http://www.wrightslaw.com/info/sec504.index.htm</a></p>
<p>Interesting to note how long each post is on this topic. I would like to mention that not only are there several different forms of ADHD, but there are many other learning and/or emotional issues that may look like ADHD on the surface. A good neuropsychological evaluation can help tease out whether you/your child has problems with information processing, processing speed, executive function (organization, planning, problem-solving), working memory, visual/perceptual problems, input/output problems, fine motor problems, Nonverbal Learning Disability (NLD), etc etc etc. There are many causes of these problems, from birth/developmental problems, to injury/illness, etc. Also, depression, anxiety, bipolar disorder, substance misuse, etc can present with symptoms that "look" like ADHD. A proper evaluation can help with the appropriate interventions-- medication, therapy, accomodations or any combination thereof. These are physiologically based disorders and are separate from behavioral issues. As you can probably tell, I am in the field. I really encourage a good, comprehensive eval to see what is going on and what is the right thing to do. It is unlikely that you will get the kind of eval you want/need through the school system, and your insurance may or may not pay for some of the testing. But as a mother of a kid I tested once said to me,"I can either take my money and go on vacation, or I can invenst i my son's future". Very wise woman. That kid, who has a nonverbal learning disability, also ended up with a full scholarship to college. I guess her initial investment in the testing paid off....</p>
<p>so how do you find someone to do an evaluation?
I had my daughter tested through the school system , all they determined was that she has a "specific learning disabilty" without mentioning what that was or what was needed.
Then I just paid almost $1000 to have her tested ( which I had to borrow- it wasn't a choice of buying a "want" instead), by an educational psychologist who still hasn't given me a report, I have the results of the tests but not a report making suggestions.
I would love any ideas on how to find a neuropysch and what testing to ask for. I get overwhelmed reading abstracts on line and while I am willing to go further in debt to get my daughter appropriately assesed, I also don't like paying money for little feedback. Sorry if I am sounding bitchy I have a migraine and this is an area that really frustrates me. My daughter is doing ok but only after much hard work by us, not the school system. We also have a lot more free time to advocate for her, ( for all the good it has done) than other parents do. I am really frustrated on behalf of all the kids in teh district who aren't getting appropriate help, and for the teachers and parents who don't know what to do for them. :(</p>
<p>emeraldkitty-
You ask some big questions to a big problem that is forever ongoing. I don't know where in the pacifiv NW you are, but there are several ways to find a (hopefully good) neuropsychologist. I don't know if the national organizations (International Neuropsychological Society or National Academy of Neuropsychology) have their directories available to non-members, but it is worth a look. You can also check with some of the big universities if you are near one, and try your physician, neurologist, pediatrician, etc for recommendations. Schools usually don't like to "diagnose" nor give specific treatment reccs, because they will need to be able to provide them. Also, most school psychologists have a very different training background than a neuropsychologist, and same for and educational psychologist- there can be a lot of variability in their training and expertise. Not to say they arent good, it just may vary. I know some edu. psychologists that are very knowledgeable, and some who think they are... (enough said).
I don't know how long ago your testing was done, but you do need to be patient. It takes time to pull together records and get the data scored and the report written.
Lastly, cost is always a delicate issue. Unfortunately, many people cannot afford do pay privately, and their insurance company may be quite restrictive in what they will cover. Most won't cover anything related to learning or developmental issues- they prefer to push you to the overloaded school psychologist. And so the world turns. And yes, this testing is not inexpensive. Paying less than $1000 is actually very, very, very reasonable. I used to participate on a local LD parents network forum. Most of these parents were appropriately frustrated with the public school system's limitations, but they also had some unrealistic expectations for the psychologists. For example, some wanted the psychologist to never use a psychometrist to aid in test administration, they wanted the scope of the testing to address a gazillion questions, the psychologist to come to their IEP and advocate for their child, and expect medicaid to pay for this. That would be nice in some ideal world. Most people charge for their time. These are services that are purchased. And feedback, including the opportunity to answer questions and discuss options, takes time. I wish I had the time to give "a little feedback" to all the patients, families, teachers,tutors, doctors, etc. at no cost. There aren't enough hours in the day, even if it was affordable to do so. Oh, one last thing-- What I do is meet first with the parent and child to get a comprehensive history. That helps provide the foundation of the problems that are occurring and helps me to ascertain what questions should be addressed. You can come in with the list of concerns- you shouldn't be asking for any certain test- that will be determined by the doctor. You don't usually go to your primary care doc asking for specific lab tests- you go in with a list of symptoms and they determine what to do. It is no differenct in psychology. Good luck, and take care of your headache.</p>
<p>Emerald...thanks for the clarification..I was not clear on the difference between IE and 504 - thought they worked together...</p>
<p>Anyway...jym makes excellent suggestions...when my son was tested, we lived close to Yale and had access to a top person in the field of ADHD. He began just as jym states - a comprehensive history, talking with my son, H and myself separately, then all together...then some comprehensive tests of son. I think at the time about 4 years ago it cost around $800. No insurance coverage either...</p>
<p>One of my friends who teaches learning disabled students suggested a pediatric neuropsychologist, but we were never able to find one...people didn't even know what it was and we were in a relatively large metropolitan area at the time...
There may be some LD parents organizations that could be helpful - you could go on-line to try to track some local chapters down. I tried to hook up with CHADD,but there were no local chapters where I lived.</p>
<p>it took us literally years to get our son's problems correctly diagnosed...even the school psychologist and educational consultant disagreed (one said possible ADD; one said "extreme gifted-ness")...frustrating to the max, so I can empathize and sympathize with you. We were VERY fortunate to be referred to an expert...</p>
<p>Best of luck - and take care of that headache...hope we have helped...</p>
<p>CKR-
Did you see someone through the Yale Child Study Clinic (or some other branch of the Yale training systems) or did you see this person solely as a private client in their private practice office? Often to get a comprehensive eval at a modest cost, you go to a university-based program with grand-funded clinics that subsidize the cost of the evaluation. Where I live, the universities can offer these for kids and for currently enrolled students (though the pediatric one, if still grant-funded, is a 90' drive away from the metropolitan city) with ,I think it is now either a $500 or $700 out-of-pocket expense.. But they can offer good services at good prices. Yay for grant funding! Its a win-win situation.</p>
<p>We went to his office...but I think I called Yale to start the ball rolling...it was several years ago, so I really don't remember all the details...we got a tw0-three page typewritten report, along with test results, graphs, copies of a variety of articles and abstracts...since you are in the field, you may have heard of the person we saw...Dr. Thomas Brown.</p>
<p>CKR-
There are a few folks by that name-- I'll look him up in my directories whenI am back in the office after the holidays. I end up generating a 10-15 pg report. I am impresssed with a succinct one!</p>
<p>This is all very interesting info. I was referred to an educational psychologist who is considered one of the tops in town. I checked him out with other psychologist friends & he has a great reputation. My son's eval consisted of one hour interview with son, me, & Dad; then about 5-6 hours of tests over three seperate days. We all go back in in about 10 days to get the results in person, along with a written report that includes recommendations. Cost is about $1500.</p>
<p>My son goes to a private school (8th grade) and it was the learning specialist at his school that told us to get him tested. She was brought in by his faculty advisor after we'd all been banging our heads on the wall for months due to his chronic disorganization. The Learning specialist told us he will qualify for more help from the school with a specific diagnosis. Also, we were told, if he is to have accomodations in CB testing, etc, one needs to get this process going now; HS is too late. </p>
<p>There is a University in our town that does this testing (grad students under supervision) for about $400 but we did not want to wait weeks and weeks till they were available... we want a proactive approach up and going with no lag time when he's back to school in January. The Ed Psych could get us in fast so we did that. </p>
<p>We are really curious to see what the diagnosis says. This is uncharted territory for me.</p>
<p>One of our children was also diagnosed with ADD. In our case, the main symptom is procrastination to the nth degree, not necessarily forgetting assignments, etc.</p>
<p>We have some concerns about this, as I'm sure others do as well.</p>
<p>First of all, based on the questions on this ADD test, it seemed to us that half the world would be diagnosed with ADD. How valid are these tests ? Especially since they're based on self-responses, not observations by a clinician?</p>
<p>What makes psychiatrists feel that medication is the appropriate response to this issue, as opposed to working to change the particular detrimental behaviors? (eg finding ways to start work on time like everybody else). </p>
<p>It seems to us like :i) the diagnosis can't possibly be accurate, based on the questions; and ii) it's like a "magic bullet" - an easy answer for the psychologist, to just prescribe drugs, and then avoid the hard work of trying to find what's really wrong, and work to solve that through behavior modification.</p>
<p>It seems to us that our child could easily take all these meds and then still have the problem, since nothing really has been done to address the negative behavior patterns.</p>
<p>How does one know when drugs are the way to go? Isn't a simple test, with virtually no other knowledge of the patient by the psychiatrist, and having tried nothing else, insufficient basis for the psychiatrist to validly make this determination? That's what it seems like to us.</p>
<p>Emeraldkity- we went for years with the testing results that were done by the school psychologist- with a portion done by an intern. We to had a vague diagnosis- at the time his was visual-motor processing problem. We had no idea what they meant but he qualified for an IEP and recieved resource services. Later we went to a educational therapist who said he had a phonemic awareness problem. He went to her for private tutoring and finally at age 10 learned to read.
We let it go for years where he did fair. When at the recommendation of his private school we have him retested they recommended that we do it privately. I did call the public school psychologist who was at the high school he would be attending in the future. She tried to convince me they would test him for free. We went with the private. I got names from sons primary Dr. and also from the learning skills teacher at his school and lastly from my older D's therapist who is a child psychiatrist as well as a psychologist. There was one name that was on all 3 lists. He was a neuropsychologist. My husband and I met with him first and then he saw son alone just to talk. He then did about multiple sessions of testing. He also spoke to son's teachers. Then he met with us again without son to talk about results and about how he was going to present it to my son. Then he saw son alone. He prepared a multiple page report with test results and his opinions as to what course we should embark upon. He also saw son for several sessions of therapy to talk about where son saw himself going.<br>
I think it was about $1600 not including the additional therapy sessions.</p>
<p>mom60 - your testing/interviewing sounds similar to what we did...the self-test that monydad mentions is not very helpful...most of us procrastinate, forget things, etc. etc. It is the pervasiveness of the symptoms, how long they have existed, and the fact that they interfere with daily life that is significant - that's why parental input, as well as input from teachers is valuable...</p>
<p>In S's case, he even had problems in elementary school not finishing the most basic in-class work - it was NEVER completed! His only reason "everyone was distracting me..." and he was actually telling the truth...there was no way he could concentrate and block out kids talking, etc. </p>
<p>SB Mom - FYI - when you apply for accommodations from the CB, they will ask for a diagnostic report which has to have been done within three years, I think. The school also has to list what accommodations are being given. Your guidance folks at the high school will know all about it.</p>
<p>We are also finding out that we need to have a current diagnostic report if we want S to qualify for any accommodations in college (like tutoring, etc.) Not sure if he will need to use them, but want to be sure they will be available if needed.</p>
<p>I read today in the NYT that there are new warnings (I think issued yesterday to Drs.) about Strattera and new findings of liver damage.</p>