2011 National Merit Scholarships Questions

Paying for College National Merit Aid
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<p>On Wisconsin (no pun intended):</p>

<p>There are several factors not related to educational quality that could explain the disparity between cutoff scores in WI vs. (for example) MA.</p>

<p>1) The number of PSAT testers in WI in 2009 was about 21,000, in MA about 52,000, in spite of the fact that they have nearly equal numbers of graduating students (about 67,000 vs. 62,000, respectively). This limits the population from which high scores could come and, probably more importantly, demonstrates that the level of test awareness in WI is not nearly at the level that it is in MA.</p>

<p>2) WI’s HS graduation rate is 89% (highest in the nation), MA 81% (2007 numbers). This allocates to WI relatively more “slots” among NMSF qualifiers and hence allows a reduced cutoff number. (Slots are allocated in proportion to percentage of total high school graduates each year).</p>

<p>3) Probably most significantly, about 34,000 students (55% of the eventual graduates) take the test as sophomores in MA. Only a little over 3,400 (5% of the eventual graduates) sophomores take the test in WI. As previous exposure is a well-known score booster, this is likely a substantial factor in increased scores in the junior year.</p>

<p>(I will leave aside the issue of whether this test, or any single test, could settle the question of quality even if other factors were the same.)</p>

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<p>mom2collegekids, thanks for reply. My son was told by a teacher that, though he got a 235, and would make NMSF, he would never make finalist. He said in spite of SF’s repeatedly submitting completed applications, our high school was ignored due to it’s zip code and had very few finalists. Hmmmm guess you cant believe everything you hear! That’s encouraging what you say! I’ll tell him to go for it anyway. (He wasn’t going to…)</p>

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<p>My wording was not as specific as it could have been. It isn’t a higher education level; it is a higher percentage of people with bachelor’s degrees.</p>

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<p>This is what I know about the corportate awards: some are given to children of employees and some have other requirements and some are competitive and some kids just are awarded. My husband works for a company that gives a scholarship to every finalist who is a child of an employee, so my daughter is a NMS for that company (Bill Gates was a National Merit Boeing Scholar, for example).</p>

<p>If you want to check requirements, go to the NM site and look at the brochure. It will list all companies that sponsor scholarships and I think it will tell you how they are awarded.</p>

<p>The corporate scholars are selected first, then the others. The kids who get the money from National Merit are the top in their states after the corporate awardees are recognized.</p>

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<p>I would be very concerned that your school has been lazy and has not been doing their responsibilities…getting transcripts, getting recs, submitting paperwork on time. And, it sounds like they discourage kids from filling out the packets.</p>

<p>I would make sure that my child’s packet was completed by my kid AND BY THE SCHOOL and make sure that it is submitted on time. ** I would also call NMCorp to make sure the completed packets were rec’d with everything in it… **</p>

<p>You can call NMCorp for verification…</p>

<p>Nat’l Merit Corp 847-866-5100
NMCorp code 0085 (for sending SAT scores.)</p>

<p>Also…ask this teacher how such could be true if Villa Park High School in Villa Park, Calif (a pricey zip code) has all of its NMSF making NMF?</p>

<p>Heck…even Chelsea Clinton made NMF and her zip code was - well - THE WHITE HOUSE!!!</p>

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<p>I’m new to this so I didn’t realize it was odd. Good advice! We’ll take it! Thanks!</p>

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<p>Wow, what an articulate answer regarding the stats. I’m tempted to–more than that, I will–ask how you know all of these statistics? Do you work with National Merit?</p>

<p>Very helpful stuff. I appreciate your insights.</p>

<p>Richard – On Wisconsin!</p>

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<p>State graduation rates can be found by a google search; state graduate numbers by the same, but require a little more digging. In the case of MA I had to calculate the graduate numbers based on graduation rate percentage and entering HS freshman cohort available from the MA Department of Education (I think).</p>

<p>PSAT statistics are available here: [College-Bound</a> Juniors & Sophomores 2009 - PSAT/NMSQT](<a href=“http://professionals.collegeboard.com/data-reports-research/psat/cb-jr-soph]College-Bound”>SAT Suite of Assessments – Reports | College Board)</p>

<p>In truth I have looked into this issue in the past and found similar results. Because of these factors vary widely across states I would not infer anything about educational systems based on standardized test results. For example, MN and IA have the highest SAT averages in the country, but only 7% and 3% (respectively) of their HS graduates take these tests, compared to 70+% in MA. Hardly a basis for comparison.</p>

<p>There is an assumption by many posters that just about every HS student knows about and takes the PSAT and SAT. This is simply false in a wide number of states, especially those in the midwest. Indeed, I would be willing to bet that most of those WI sophomores who take the PSAT are in private schools. Perhaps you will agree that public school sophomores in WI who take the PSAT are just about unheard of.</p>

<p>(Full disclosure: I am a UW-Madison alum and current resident of MN.)</p>

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<p>^ I agree with RickUW. I love your stats, and the concise way you laid them out. Excellent insight!</p>

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<p>*I’m new to this so I didn’t realize it was odd. Good advice! We’ll take it! Thanks! *</p>

<p>Seriously…this teacher doesn’t know what she’s talking about.</p>

<p>My SIL has been a high school teacher for 25 years. When her son made NMSF she said that he wouldn’t make NMF because “we make too much money.” (my bro makes a lot of money.)</p>

<p>I had to spend a lot of time explaining that we never provided ANY income info to anyone. We’ve never have done a FAFSA - ever! NMCorp doesn’t know what we earn…they didn’t care that my son went to a prep school…yet my son still made NMF. It wasn’t until I showed her that Chelsea Clinton made NMF that she believed me!</p>

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<p>My reaction to the teacher: Nonsense.</p>

<p>Mom2collegekids has posted a list of what it takes to go from NMSF to NMF and that is all there is to it. School recommendation is important but no school will not recommend you unless you have done something totally unacceptable.</p>

<p>Getting an scholarship is a totally different ball game. I have made several posts on this, the fact is that not all deserving students get a scholarship as their parents do not work for a corporate sponsor, they do not choose to go to a school that offers scholarships and there are only a limited number of NMSC direct scholarships. </p>

<p>Again, there is no discrimination based on zip codes in the award of scholarships. It is a combination of the strength of your application, the state you reside in, the school you choose, the employers of your parents.</p>

<p>With a Score of 235 your son has a very good chance of getting a scholarship, it would be stupidity not to apply (sorry for the choice of words but there is no earthly reason he should not apply).</p>

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<p>^^Thanks for the answers about corporate scholarships, MD Mom. </p>

<p>I checked out the NM website and read the brochure and paperwork that came home with my son. I saw the listed corporations, etc.</p>

<p>I have what might be a really stupid question – for anybody who can answer …</p>

<p>So after all the brochure explanations about the $2500 NM Scholarship winners and corporate-sponsored Merit Scholarship awards, the next paragraph, titled “Which Finalists can be considered for college-sponsored Merit Scholarship awards?,” says:</p>

<p>"To be considered for a college-sponsored award, a Finalist must meet ALL THREE of the following conditions. The Finalist:</p>

<p>*must have notified NMSC that the sponsor college is his or her first choice;</p>

<p>*must have applied for admission to that institution;
and</p>

<p>*must NOT have been offered any other National Merit Scholarship."</p>

<p>So, here’s my dumb question …</p>

<p>It looks like the corporate-sponsored awards can be one of three types of awards — a one-time, single-payment of $2000-$5000, or a renewable and variable award for amounts of $500 to $2000 or more per year, OR a renewable and fixed award for amounts of $1000-$5000 per year. </p>

<p>Well, in a lot of cases a corporate-sponsored award could amount to significantly less money than a college-sponsored award, if the student’s college awards the value of a full-ride for NMF, for instance.</p>

<p>And, it looks like corporate awards might come sooner than college-sponsored awards.</p>

<p>AND, one no longer qualifies for a college-sponsored award if they have been offered any other National Merit Scholarship, right? (Including a corporate-sponsored award, right? Or a $2500 National Merit Award, right?)</p>

<p>So, could a student possibly lose out on a huge college-sponsored award if a corporate sponsored award or $2500 National Merit award is given prior to the college-sponsored award? That would be sad.</p>

<p>I’m guessing that I’m missing something here, because I would think that NMSC would want each NMF to get the maximum merit award to which they are entitled.</p>

<p>But what about that 3rd qualification for college-sponsored awards – “must NOT have been offered any other National Merit Scholarship?” It would make more sense to me if it said, “accepted any other …”</p>

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<p>I have a somewhat silly question –</p>

<p>When I send my SAT score to “confirm my performance”, will they care if I send a subject test score along with it? I’m retaking a subject test in October and want to use one of my free score reports to send my SAT score to NMSC, but I’m forced to send along my subject test score with it.</p>

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<p>^^
no problem</p>

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<p>**must NOT have been offered any other National Merit Scholarship."</p>

<p>So, here’s my dumb question …</p>

<p>It looks like the corporate-sponsored awards can be one of three types of awards — a one-time, single-payment of $2000-$5000, or a renewable and variable award for amounts of $500 to $2000 or more per year, OR a renewable and fixed award for amounts of $1000-$5000 per year.</p>

<p>Well, in a lot of cases a corporate-sponsored award could amount to significantly less money than a college-sponsored award, if the student’s college awards the value of a full-ride for NMF, for instance.</p>

<p>And, it looks like corporate awards might come sooner than college-sponsored awards.</p>

<p>AND, one no longer qualifies for a college-sponsored award if they have been offered any other National Merit Scholarship, right? (Including a corporate-sponsored award, right? Or a $2500 National Merit Award, right?)</p>

<p>So, could a student possibly lose out on a huge college-sponsored award if a corporate sponsored award or $2500 National Merit award is given prior to the college-sponsored award? That would be sad.</p>

<p>I’m guessing that I’m missing something here, because I would think that NMSC would want each NMF to get the maximum merit award to which they are entitled.</p>

<p>But what about that 3rd qualification for college-sponsored awards – “must NOT have been offered any other National Merit Scholarship?” It would make more sense to me if it said, “accepted any other …” *</p>

<p>Don’t worry…</p>

<p>NMCorp WANTS each child to get the MAXIMUM money that the child can get from whatever available sources. NMCorp will call you to even set the whole thing up (or you can call them.)</p>

<p>This is how it works…my son got the big NMF scholarship from Bama AND got the corporate one from H’s company…</p>

<p>Schools like Bama that offer huge scholarships for NMF designate a tiny part of their scholarship ($1k) to be the “official” NMF scholarship. The rest of the Bama scholarship is not an “official” NMF scholarship…it’s just one that they give to NMFs.</p>

<p>“Official” NMF scholarships are administered by NMCorp. That means the “official” part is sent to NMcorp and then returned to the school (silly, I know). The unofficial part is purely administered by the school.</p>

<p>So, my son “declined” the $1k “official NMF” Bama scholarship, accepted the rest (tuition, housing, laptop, etc), and accepted the “official” corporate scholarship of $2500 per year.</p>

<p>So…that’s how you can get “two” NMF scholarships…but only one can be the “official” one. </p>

<p>A bit more info…</p>

<p>A corporate scholarship doesn’t require being named “#1” since it’s not a college.</p>

<p>You need to find out if your child’s school choice designates some/all of their scholarship as “official.”</p>

<p>For instance…if the school gives 1/2 tuition ($20k per year), but designates $5000 per year as the official portion, and your corporation only gives $2500, then you’re better off ONLY taking the school scholarship…otherwise your school scholarship will deduct $5k from the half tuition scholarship.</p>

<p>However, if the school’s official portion is only $1k and your corporate one is $2500 per year, then you get both…but the school’s scholarship will be $1k less.</p>

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<p>To go from NMSF to NMF…</p>

<p>1) keep your nose clean at school - you need the rec</p>

<p>2) Take the SAT by Dec and have score sent to NMCorp - code 0085
(Typically a score over 2000 is considered good enough - altho some with scores of 1950 have reported making NMF.)</p>

<p>3) Receive the NMSF paperwork in September. Follow all the directions, write a nice essay, and return paperwork to school before the due date.</p>

<p>4) Check with school to make sure paperwork is submitted on time to NMCorp.</p>

<p>5) Keep your GPA strong at school; the school sends your transcript to NMCorp with your paperwork.</p>

<p>6) Don’t fret about picking #1 choice for college. That can be decided in late winter/early spring - depending on school’s deadline.</p>

<p>The kids who don’t make NMF after being named NMSF typically cause that to happen by…</p>

<p>1) bad behavior at school</p>

<p>2) poor academic performance (GPA issues)</p>

<p>3) didn’t do the paperwork, did it incorrectly, or submitted it too late.</p>

<p>4) wrote a rude/poor essay.</p>

<p>5) didn’t take the SAT, didn’t send score to NMCorp, and/or didn’t have a good SAT score (typically a score over 2000 is considered “safe.”)</p>

<p>If you receive a rejection letter stating that you didn’t make NMF, you can appeal. Some appeals have been successful.</p>

<p>Any questions…feel free to call NMCorp - they’re very nice on the phone.</p>

<p>Nat’l Merit Corp 847-866-5100</p>

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<p>^Thanks, mom2collegekids! That makes sense. I <em>thought</em> NMSC would want the kids to get the largest award they could qualify for. But as I read that, I wondered …</p>

<p>That is so awesome that your son got both a corporate award AND the big Bama package. It did not occur to me that these kids could possibly qualify for MORE than a huge free-ride package. How very exciting.</p>

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<p>SimpleLife–Also keep in mind that there are some dandy merit scholarships that are not related to NMF. My daughter has full tuition to Pitt for four years and she gets the $1000 corporate award each year as well–it arrives after the bill is paid, so DD just gets it put into her account. It goes a long way toward paying the expenses.</p>

<p>DD designated what was her top choice (not Pitt initially) to NM Corp. in hopes that that university would throw a little merit money her way. When #1 school offered her nothing, she switched her designation. She did not get the NM$$ that Pitt offers specifically for NM.</p>

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<p>Is there any detriment at this point to saying “undecided” and making a first choice designation later in the process or are the schools you designate now notified of this now (giving them a heads up of your interest)?</p>

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<p>mrdysart, your son’s school’s experience with NMFs is definitely very odd. I’d check with the school GC to find out if the teacher’s story is accurate. Schools BRAG about the number of NMFs they have! I agree that it might be that the school has had NMFs, but that students haven’t received NM money.</p>

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<p>mrdysart: There is great confusion in the popular mind about what NMF means. Finalist simply means one is a candidate for a scholarship, not a recipient. Only about 17% of NMF’s end up getting actual money from the NMSC (selection criteria for this are not clear but there is no reason to think it has to do with zip code). Another 40% or so get money from private corporations (based on varying criteria) or from some colleges if they choose to attend.</p>

<p>Usually advancement from NMSF to NMF is just a matter of completing the paperwork (and taking the SAT if it hasn’t already been taken). Both the possibility of getting some money and the recognition itself makes it worthwhile to apply.</p>

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<p>Descartesz, great point. That probably explains it. I asked my son this morning who the teacher was and he said it was actually his GC that told him that! But I’ll bet he meant the actual scholarship was rare here, not NMF.</p>

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<p>^^MD Mom, that is so great. Who’d a thunk you could be paid to go to college?!</p>

<p>How does she like Pitt? We get a ton of mail from them. I’ve read about their amazing scholarships. Is she (and are you) glad she chose them?</p>

<p>Interesting about the switching. If she switched her designation, why didn’t Pitt give her the NM offer? Because their other, non-NMF offer was better? Because she did it too late in the process?</p>

<p>This info could apply to my son as well. One of his schools offers an incredible package to NMFs. Another of his schools offers a President’s Scholarship that is equally amazing and has nothing to do with NMF. He’s a pretty good contender for that scholarship, though we know it’s very competitive.</p>

<p>It sounds like if my son were to designate the NMF school as his first choice with NMSC, because he really does love the NMF school, but then also gets offered the President’s Scholarship at the other school, he could possibly end up with a few great choices in terms of finances AND schools that he loves, right?</p>

<p>I mean, if what I’ve learned here means that he could get NMF scholarship money from corporate sources or NMSC sources AND take a large NMF-related college package at one school OR a large NON-NMF-related college package at another school, he would have two fantastic choices that we could afford and that could possibly pay him a stipend each year! That is amazing.</p>

<p>Did I get that right? No wonder son’s guidance counselors called me hootin’ and hollerin’ and celebrating at his score last fall! It’s all coming clear to me … :)</p>