“A debate about the size of raindrops in a bucket when the COA is $75k.”
Not when you consider how many hours of additional work study it’ll take to make up the dif. We didn’t care about those college-sponsor awards either - when our kid was still in high school. We cared a lot once we saw the FA package.
@DavidPuddy - Very confusing indeed! Our D didn’t receive any news of anything till her one letter in May 2017 about the college sponsorship (first on the portal, followed up by a later later that month). Very odd to send out notifications piecemeal like that. But congrats to your son on his college award!
"they are going to have most if not all of those $1,000/yr sponsored scholarships assigned well before the 5/1 notification date. "
once again, this is pure speculation on your part. And is factually incorrect.
please read this carefully. It was written by Timothy Brunhold, the Dean of admissions at USC.
“Students don’t need (and never have had) to tell NMSC before May 1 that we are their first choice and I believe that NMSC allows students to change their designation anytime between now and the end of May. Bottom-line is that as long as we receive a roster from NMSC with an admitted student’s name on it indicating a USC first-choice, he or she will be awarded a Presidential, regardless of when that roster comes to us.”
"In the initial letter, verbiage is used very close to "we know you might be disappointed to not be named a Merit Scholar, but a Finalist is an honor ". We knew he would not be a corporate winner of course. We assumed he would not be an at large winner. So the letter was not a surprise. The wording described above implies some finality to the process.
Only students who have enrolled at a college that sponsors NMSC and have notified NM of their first choice, OR have parents who work for a company that sponsors NMSC OR have been awarded one of the $2500 awards become NM Scholars. And at that point your DS had not met any of those conditions.
Students who do not meet any of the above conditions are NM Finalists, and do not move on to be called NMScholars.
"In the college sponsored letter -which I can only assume was generated May 15 because he did not name his school as his number 1 school until essentially May 1- the language says, verbatim: “All of us at NMSC hope that being named a Merit Scholar designee will be a source of great pride and encouragement…”
He received the 2nd letter because he DID enroll at a college that sponsors NMSC and he notified NMSC of his first choice college before the mid May deadline.
I understand that very clearly, which is why I explained the dates in my post.
My point is, and the strange thing, as I noted: they send what i will call a soft “rejection” letter … and then contradict it. It’s strange and confusing in general.
Furthermore, the school and NMSC indicate that per process the school should be listed as preferred choice by May 1, which it was. I’m not here to complain, but the process is imperfect, and the communication is as well. That said, I thank our lucky stars for the wonderful opportunities presented.
@menloparkmom at #1421 - this simply contradicts what NMSC told me last year. But if USC specifically has funding availabiity to that extent, more power to them. However, they have also been getting more selective with NMF’s in recent years - perhaps that’s how they are managing their funds. So I’m curious about the date of that communication from Dean Brunhold - is it recent or from several years ago?
And doubly curious in light of recent admission and selectivity trends for USC and other competitive schools - May 1 is, after all, National Decision Day, when you would think that an overwhelming majority of USC admits have their decisions wrapped up. So you are saying that currently USC is cool with NMF’s specifying them as first choice AFTER National Decision Day? This is getting even more interesting.
My D was in this exact situation. She notified NMSC that USC was her first choice by March 1. March 23 she was awarded the $2500 NMSC scholarship. She was accepted to USC. She accepted the $2500, as she was not 100% going to USC. First week of April the $2500 showed up on USC’s Financial Aid. The next week the $1000 scholarship and the half-tuition benefit showed up. So even though USC was her first choice school, she was awarded the $2500.
D decided to attend UT, so she did not try to change her scholarship with NMSC.
^^wow. So @ollie113’s post corrects both what I was saying earlier about not getting a $2500 if you specified a college sponsor by 3/1 AND what NMSC told @dowzerw. And totally supports what @menloparkmom was saying about giving the recipient a choice of scholarships. And - she was offered the $1,000/yr (by USC not by NMSC although wondering if that matters?) AFTER accepting the $2500! So I humbly stand corrected. Now I wonder if it’s a USC thing or applies to all college sponsors in reality. Is the $1,000/yr. a “college sponsored” award administered by NMSC? How can you be offered one type of scholarship when you’ve already accepted another? I guess part of the answer is that the college itself - not NMSC - notifiies you - that wasn’t the case for my daughter’s college award sponsored by UChicago which totally came from NMSC (and, in fact, NMSC cut the check to UChicago). In fact, both UChicago and NU (two very elite schools that still sponsor NM) make it very clear that you get what you get and if you are already offered one type you can’t switch. So maybe individual colleges work out their arrangements with NMSC.
@ollie113 - would you mind sharing your D’s stats and NMSC application highlights ? (no problem if you feel that’s inappropriate) - also what state - Texas? It would be helpful to understand how these $2500 awards are determined.
@ollie113
congratulations on your DD’s $2500 NM Scholar award . I hope she enjoys and makes the most of her UG years at UT!
“So I’m curious about the date of that communication from Dean Brunhold - is it recent or from several years ago?”
It is from March of 2017. Satisfied now?
“However, they have also been getting more selective with NMF’s in recent years”
As has been the case recently at ALL highly competitive colleges, including USC.
“So you are saying that currently USC is cool with NMF’s specifying them as first choice AFTER National Decision Day? This is getting even more interesting.”
Oh god… USC has ALWAYS been “cool” with WHENEVER they receive NM first choice notifications from NMSC. Read the quote from Brunhold again…
NMSC gives ALL students time after May 1 to notify them of their FINAL first choice decisions. NO one at NMSC expects students to notify them FIRST THING , by no later than 12:00 AM May 2, after finally making the decision where they will be spending the next 4 years of their lives.
What is so surprising about that?
What you seem to not understand is that NMSC is NOT rigid as you think they are, or out to deprive students of $$ that they could use. Yet you seem to not want to believe me, despite all the attempts to convince you otherwise.
Look, I understand that NMSC “rules” are opaque and hard to understand. It has been a HUGE frustration for new CC posters for MANY years. Time and time again some of us have asked NMSC to PULEEZE make their rules and procedures more clear cut and understandable, to no avail. That is why some of us CC old timers are still here- trying to explain how NMScholarships are actually awarded .
“What you seem to not understand is that NMSC is NOT rigid as you think they are, or out to deprive students of $$ that they could use. Yet you seem to not want to believe me, despite all the attempts to convince you otherwise.”
It’s not a matter of thinking NMSC is out to deprive students of $$$‘s. There are plenty of college sponsors that operate under protocols that are consistent with NMSC’s. I mentioned two above. Again, I wouldn’t apply USC’'s procedures to other institutions and anyone assuming these sponsors all work the same is simply naive. They aren’t.
“That is why some of us CC old timers are still here- trying to explain how NMScholarships are actually awarded”
- Actually, it's how these work for USC specifically. If you were to use USC to explain, say, UMN's sponsor procedures you'd be mis-informing your audience. Best to check the individual websites and reach out to the NM liaison or equivalent to get a clear understanding of how your sponsor of interest works.
“It is from March of 2017. Satisfied now?”
- Yes. Thank you for providing the date.
“Oh god… USC has ALWAYS been “cool” with WHENEVER they receive NM first choice notifications from NMSC. Read the quote from Brunhold again…”
- yes, it certainly reads that way. I'm especially intrigued by this tidbit from the Dean: "I believe that NMSC allows students to change their designation anytime between now and the end of May." This is actually inaccurate when referring to switching from one college sponsor to another AFTER your name has already been released. NMSC is pretty clear on this. I know, I know, that rule doesn't apply to USC either (any college happy to place TWO NMSC awards in your portal - even for a little bit - isn't going to sweat the small stuff like switching sponsors late in the game). Just don't expect it NOT to apply elsewhere. One more time, best to find out what the individual sponsor is requiring. Not all college sponsors are as cool as USC.
Edit - just noticed that Dean Brunhold was referring to the 1/2 tuition Presidential NOT the college sponsored $1,000/year “raindrop in the bucket”. Obviously USC can set any procedures they wish to for their own administered awards. The question is whether the $1,000 is forfeited if the applicant switches from one college sponsor to another., as NMSC says it would be. Won’t even hazard a guess how that works out.
“The question is whether the $1,000 is forfeited if the applicant switches from one college sponsor to another., as NMSC says it would be.”
good grief. OF COURSE IT IS.
USC is the sponsoring college that PAYS for the USC OFFICIAL NM $1000 scholarship.
why in the name of god would you even think that they would pay for a scholarship for student that goes to ANOTHER COLLEGE???
“Won’t even hazard a guess how that works out.”
NMSC continues to send colleges updated lists of NMF’s first choice selections- the last arriving in Mid May. Colleges cross check those lists against their list of enrolled students. If a college has an NM award then the enrolled student would [theoretically] then receive it.[ given that the $$ has not run out]
That’s how it works.
“Actually, it’s how these work for USC specifically.”
why dont you stop making assumptions and try doing some research- like finding and reading my numerous posts on older NM threads from the past 14 years? My knowledge of NM policies is NOT just limited to what USC’s policies are. I read NMSC’s publication annually.
sheeesh… 8-|
@memloparkmom, I’m sure you useful info to share, but i find it ironic that you are berating people for not understanding the NMF process.
On multiple occasions you’ve presented as facts information about the program that is dead wrong. For example, your assertion in the thread linked below, started by you, that there are two ‘buckets’ of NM scholarships, and it isn’t possible to get both a corporate scholarship and one of the larger University scholarships, like USC’s 1/2 tuition Presidential or UTD’s full ride package:
http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/21471386#Comment_21471386
Or your assertion in post #1364 of the following thread that you can’t be a NM scholar unless you attend a National Merit sponsoring school:
http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/national-merit-scholarships/2008875-2018-national-merit-finalist-thread-p91.html
Everyone makes mistakes, especially me. Hopefully we are working together to give our kids the best information possible. It’s my opinion that the tone you’ve taken in some of these threads, including the extensive use of caps, undermines that purpose and is making this a less friendly place to hang out.
Good luck to all the NMF kids and parents.
@menloparkmom might be experiencing hurt feelings and for contributing to those I do apologize. 14 years of expertise is a lot, and she’s posted helpful things in the past. Totally concur that what’s important is to get good info. to the families reading this thread, not to dig in the heels. I, for one, have learned a ton about USC!
@kcheves
ahem,
post #1364 was strictly in reference to post 1363, in which a new user was inquiring about being a NM Scholar if he attended another school. It seemed pretty clear that he was NOT asking about one of the official NMSC $2500 awards or a NM corporate awards.
And what I said was completely correct- for this particular student.
" I got offered the USC 1k a year national merit scholarship through the national merit site. However, I will be attending another school. If I decline this offer will I still be considered a national merit scholar? If not, if i accept the offer and do not go to USC will I still be a national merit scholar?
"you will ONLY be considered a NM Scholar IF you go to a college , like USC, that sponsors National Merit Scholarship Corp AND you notify NM -very soon- that that college you will be attending IS your first choice.
You can ONLY “accept” the 1K offer from USC if you go to USC.
Yes, in the 14 years of being on CC trying to help newbies, like the poster in the above thread you referred to, i sometimes make mistakes. But I did not in this case.
As you just did , by not carefully taking into context what it was I wrote, but instead were only looking for a way to criticize me.
Somehow I dont find that “friendly”.
If the moderators and “powers that be” at CC had felt that my contributions to CC over the years were not valued and helpful, I would have been kicked off long ago.
@JBStillFlying,
thank you.
I think I’ll sign off on this thread, as any further posts on my part here will probably not be considered useful.
I don’t want to beat a dead horse, but your comment in post #1364 was factually incorrect.
“you will ONLY be considered a NM Scholar IF you go to a college , like USC, that sponsors National Merit Scholarship Corp AND you notify NM -very soon- that that college you will be attending IS your first choice.”
You don’t need to attend a NM-sponsor school to become a scholar. Clearly incorrect, regardless of context.
I think I’m done here. Flame away if it makes you feel better.
@kcheves,
I’ve put you on “ignore”. I suggest you do the same for me, as you obviously dont value my posts.
@JBStillFlying D was NMF from Texas, 227, 1560, 1/247. ECs average but lots of leadership positions. Essay was probably good but her recommendation was outstanding.
I’m sure there was some weird timing with USC. I imagine they downloaded the NMF list with the NMSC scholarships indicated and then just went through the accepted students to add the NMF package to their FA. My D had some health issues right in the middle of the acceptance round and we never followed up with the USC FA office.
@ollie113 thank you for sharing those NM application details. Doesn’t help resolve whether they are choosing these one-timers by state or nationally since she must be one of the very strongest overall. :D/
No doubt they did what you are surmising but schools tend not to be sloppy about bestowing then withdrawing awards. So that yearly amount was real - since she had listed them as a sponsor - and once the dust settled (student enrolled and accepted F/A and scholaships, etc.) the one-time offer would have been removed and likely bestowed elsewhere by NMSC.
The awkward timing results from the fact that a very selective school is waiting till regular round to notify high stats NMF’s on their admission decision. It absolutely makes sense to accept a $2500 under these circumstances if there’s a tight respond deadline (usually 2 weeks? Can’t remember). And apparently no harm in going elsewhere as she can take the $2500 with her and didn’t even choose another college sponsor - so no complications. #:-S
Now, I wonder what would have happened if someone in @ollie113’s situation (specified first choice by 3/1, gotten $2500, changed mind to go elsewhere) had, indeed, chosen another sponsor? NMSC procedures are pretty clear that if Sponsor College A has your name, and you decide to attend Sponsor College B, you basically forfeit both college awards. But . . . do you also forfeit the $2500? My guess is that it’s at risk. Thoughts?
Whoo! S18 got the official notification from NMSC that he will receive $500 National Merit Scholarship to FSU, qualifying him as a NM Scholar and for Florida’s Benacquisto full ride scholarship. Good to see it in print.
“NMSC procedures are pretty clear that if Sponsor College A has your name, and you decide to attend Sponsor College B, you basically forfeit both college awards.”
@JBStillFlying
NMSC DOES have an easy way around that situation.See below.
“Therefore, a Finalist who has previously reported a sponsor
college as first choice but is uncertain about it MAY CHOOSE to notify NMSC that he or she is
now “UNDECIDED” to prevent being made an offer from a school he or she is uncertain about
attending; such notification MUST be submitted online at osa.nationalmerit.org BEFORE May 1.
The Finalist can subsequently report a firm college choice that NMSC receives by May 31.”
this paragraph can be found on page 3 of the following pdf,
Requirements and Instructions for Semifinalists - National Merit …
https://nationalmerit.imodules.com/s/1758/images/gid2/editor…/merit_r_i_leaflet.pdf
I added the caps to make the most important instructions easier to see.
And just to add- it also confirms my earlier statements that NMSC does NOT want to make it hard for NMF’s to receive the scholarships they are entitled to. They are not inflexible, nor "stick by the rules "bureaucrats, as some have assumed.