*** 2020-2021 Medical Applicants and Their Parents

[threebeans]

@grtd2010 this is what DS is thinking by taking a gap year rather than going through the application process with a major piece of the puzzle missing. He wanted to take it early enough to retake it if necessary but that idea flew out the window in March. A gap year will only help his application though in terms of work and volunteer experience and more time to shadow (and save some money hopefully!)

[texaspg]

I was reading the description of shortened exam and it does not look like the main exam is any shorter.

The exam time will be reduced from a total “seated” time of 7 hours and 30 minutes to 5 hours and 45 minutes. The number of scored questions remains the same. Other elements of the exam have been reduced or removed to shorten the seated time, such as the tutorial and end-of-day survey.

https://students-residents.aamc.org/applying-medical-school/article/covid-19-changes-mcat-exam-administrations-may-29-/

[WayOutWestMom]

^^Also the all the experimental/development questions have been removed from all sections.

Typically the MCAT has up to 15% of questions in each section that are “under development” and are being piloted for inclusion in future MCAT exams. MCAT takers provide statistical reliability & validity data on these unscored questions

[icuinNm]

@grtd2010

A lot of students may be doing risk mitigation here by taking early even though they might take a GAP year or two. At least, they will know their MCAT score before applying. Right now, if you submit your application, MCAT score may be a big unknown. How do you determine your good application list to apply without a MCAT score ?

Applicants will submit AMCAS and apply to one throw away school that they don’t ever plan to attend. Then once the MCAT score comes back, they will add more schools and will be able to target schools based in their stats including their MCAT score. If they want to do a retake and apply next year instead, they can withdraw their application. Then the following year they won’t be considered a reapplicant for the schools on their target list.

FWIW, people should not take the MCAT until their practice scores are in their target range. Someone getting 504, 503, 506 505 on practice tests are not likely to score a 520 on the real deal a few days later. Of course sometimes the practice scores are in the target range, but then test anxiety, an illness, or family crisis causes the score to be lower. When my D took her MCAT her first AMCAS practice test 3 weeks before test date was not where she wanted to be, so she delayed the test. It was too late to reschedule or get a refund so she sat for the exam just to get the practice and then voided it at the end. She knew going in that she would void, When she did sit for the actual exam to be scored she was better prepared and had a much better score.

[grtd2010]

@icuinNm

@grtd2010

A lot of students may be doing risk mitigation here by taking early even though they might take a GAP year or two. At least, they will know their MCAT score before applying. Right now, if you submit your application, MCAT score may be a big unknown. How do you determine your good application list to apply without a MCAT score ?

Applicants will submit AMCAS and apply to one throw away school that they don’t ever plan to attend. Then once the MCAT score comes back, they will add more schools and will be able to target schools based in their stats including their MCAT score. If they want to do a retake and apply next year instead, they can withdraw their application. Then the following year they won’t be considered a reapplicant for the schools on their target list.

FWIW, people should not take the MCAT until their practice scores are in their target range. Someone getting 504, 503, 506 505 on practice tests are not likely to score a 520 on the real deal a few days later. Of course sometimes the practice scores are in the target range, but then test anxiety, an illness, or family crisis causes the score to be lower. When my D took her MCAT her first AMCAS practice test 3 weeks before test date was not where she wanted to be, so she delayed the test. It was too late to reschedule or get a refund so she sat for the exam just to get the practice and then voided it at the end. She knew going in that she would void, When she did sit for the actual exam to be scored she was better prepared and had a much better score.

So take away here is, applying to a throw away school does not tag one as re-applicant to other schools. One can use a different throw away medical school each application cycle as per strategy detailed above. No limit on number of withdraws allowed by AMCAS.
Similarly, take MCAT and void it, if one does not feel good about the outcome. No limits on how many times one can void MCAT test. Are the voided MCAT tests reported by AAMC to medical schools ?
Usual advise for MCAT is once and done. One’s chances of a medical school admission diminishes as a subsequent re-applicant.

[grtd2010]

@grtd2010

@icuinNm

@grtd2010

A lot of students may be doing risk mitigation here by taking early even though they might take a GAP year or two. At least, they will know their MCAT score before applying. Right now, if you submit your application, MCAT score may be a big unknown. How do you determine your good application list to apply without a MCAT score ?

Applicants will submit AMCAS and apply to one throw away school that they don’t ever plan to attend. Then once the MCAT score comes back, they will add more schools and will be able to target schools based in their stats including their MCAT score. If they want to do a retake and apply next year instead, they can withdraw their application. Then the following year they won’t be considered a reapplicant for the schools on their target list.

FWIW, people should not take the MCAT until their practice scores are in their target range. Someone getting 504, 503, 506 505 on practice tests are not likely to score a 520 on the real deal a few days later. Of course sometimes the practice scores are in the target range, but then test anxiety, an illness, or family crisis causes the score to be lower. When my D took her MCAT her first AMCAS practice test 3 weeks before test date was not where she wanted to be, so she delayed the test. It was too late to reschedule or get a refund so she sat for the exam just to get the practice and then voided it at the end. She knew going in that she would void, When she did sit for the actual exam to be scored she was better prepared and had a much better score.

So take away here is, applying to a throw away school does not tag one as re-applicant to other schools. One can use a different throw away medical school each application cycle as per strategy detailed above. No limit on number of withdraws allowed by AMCAS.
Similarly, take MCAT and void it, if one does not feel good about the outcome. No limits on how many times one can void MCAT test. Are the voided MCAT tests reported by AAMC to medical schools ?
Usual advise for MCAT is once and done. One’s chances of a medical school admission diminishes as a subsequent re-applicant.

There are restrictions on the maximum number of attempts for MCAT.
Remember that one can take the MCAT up to three times in a calendar year, with a lifetime max of 7 attempts, and the scores from each test date are reported separately. A voided exam and “no show” do count as one of your attempts.

[grtd2010]

@grtd2010

@grtd2010

@icuinNm

@grtd2010

A lot of students may be doing risk mitigation here by taking early even though they might take a GAP year or two. At least, they will know their MCAT score before applying. Right now, if you submit your application, MCAT score may be a big unknown. How do you determine your good application list to apply without a MCAT score ?

Applicants will submit AMCAS and apply to one throw away school that they don’t ever plan to attend. Then once the MCAT score comes back, they will add more schools and will be able to target schools based in their stats including their MCAT score. If they want to do a retake and apply next year instead, they can withdraw their application. Then the following year they won’t be considered a reapplicant for the schools on their target list.

FWIW, people should not take the MCAT until their practice scores are in their target range. Someone getting 504, 503, 506 505 on practice tests are not likely to score a 520 on the real deal a few days later. Of course sometimes the practice scores are in the target range, but then test anxiety, an illness, or family crisis causes the score to be lower. When my D took her MCAT her first AMCAS practice test 3 weeks before test date was not where she wanted to be, so she delayed the test. It was too late to reschedule or get a refund so she sat for the exam just to get the practice and then voided it at the end. She knew going in that she would void, When she did sit for the actual exam to be scored she was better prepared and had a much better score.

So take away here is, applying to a throw away school does not tag one as re-applicant to other schools. One can use a different throw away medical school each application cycle as per strategy detailed above. No limit on number of withdraws allowed by AMCAS.
Similarly, take MCAT and void it, if one does not feel good about the outcome. No limits on how many times one can void MCAT test. Are the voided MCAT tests reported by AAMC to medical schools ?
Usual advise for MCAT is once and done. One’s chances of a medical school admission diminishes as a subsequent re-applicant.

There are restrictions on the maximum number of attempts for MCAT.
Remember that one can take the MCAT up to three times in a calendar year, with a lifetime max of 7 attempts, and the scores from each test date are reported separately. A voided exam and “no show” do count as one of your attempts.

Cancelling a MCAT test does not count towards the limit of 3 per year and maximum life time limit of 7 attempts for MCAT.

[grtd2010]

@grtd2010

@grtd2010

@grtd2010

@icuinNm

@grtd2010

A lot of students may be doing risk mitigation here by taking early even though they might take a GAP year or two. At least, they will know their MCAT score before applying. Right now, if you submit your application, MCAT score may be a big unknown. How do you determine your good application list to apply without a MCAT score ?

Applicants will submit AMCAS and apply to one throw away school that they don’t ever plan to attend. Then once the MCAT score comes back, they will add more schools and will be able to target schools based in their stats including their MCAT score. If they want to do a retake and apply next year instead, they can withdraw their application. Then the following year they won’t be considered a reapplicant for the schools on their target list.

FWIW, people should not take the MCAT until their practice scores are in their target range. Someone getting 504, 503, 506 505 on practice tests are not likely to score a 520 on the real deal a few days later. Of course sometimes the practice scores are in the target range, but then test anxiety, an illness, or family crisis causes the score to be lower. When my D took her MCAT her first AMCAS practice test 3 weeks before test date was not where she wanted to be, so she delayed the test. It was too late to reschedule or get a refund so she sat for the exam just to get the practice and then voided it at the end. She knew going in that she would void, When she did sit for the actual exam to be scored she was better prepared and had a much better score.

So take away here is, applying to a throw away school does not tag one as re-applicant to other schools. One can use a different throw away medical school each application cycle as per strategy detailed above. No limit on number of withdraws allowed by AMCAS.
Similarly, take MCAT and void it, if one does not feel good about the outcome. No limits on how many times one can void MCAT test. Are the voided MCAT tests reported by AAMC to medical schools ?
Usual advise for MCAT is once and done. One’s chances of a medical school admission diminishes as a subsequent re-applicant.

There are restrictions on the maximum number of attempts for MCAT.
Remember that one can take the MCAT up to three times in a calendar year, with a lifetime max of 7 attempts, and the scores from each test date are reported separately. A voided exam and “no show” do count as one of your attempts.

Cancelling a MCAT test does not count towards the limit of 3 per year and maximum life time limit of 7 attempts for MCAT.

From other popular website for pre-meds:

AMCAS Instruction book:
If you have a processed AMCAS application from a previous application year, you are considered a re-applicant to those medical schools. This is regardless of whether or not a secondary application was completed.

Processed=verified.

So if anyone is thinking of withdrawing this year remember that you will not be considered a re-applicant if it’s done prior to verification (withdrawing from the process after verification is a whole other story).

===========================
If processed means verified, then submitting to a throw away school may make one a re-applicant.

Please call AMCAS for an accurate definition of “re-applicant”.

Does withdrawl actually means it should be done prior to verification ?

Please call AAMC for any information related to MCAT.

[grtd2010]

@grtd2010

@grtd2010

@grtd2010

@grtd2010

@icuinNm

@grtd2010

A lot of students may be doing risk mitigation here by taking early even though they might take a GAP year or two. At least, they will know their MCAT score before applying. Right now, if you submit your application, MCAT score may be a big unknown. How do you determine your good application list to apply without a MCAT score ?

Applicants will submit AMCAS and apply to one throw away school that they don’t ever plan to attend. Then once the MCAT score comes back, they will add more schools and will be able to target schools based in their stats including their MCAT score. If they want to do a retake and apply next year instead, they can withdraw their application. Then the following year they won’t be considered a reapplicant for the schools on their target list.

FWIW, people should not take the MCAT until their practice scores are in their target range. Someone getting 504, 503, 506 505 on practice tests are not likely to score a 520 on the real deal a few days later. Of course sometimes the practice scores are in the target range, but then test anxiety, an illness, or family crisis causes the score to be lower. When my D took her MCAT her first AMCAS practice test 3 weeks before test date was not where she wanted to be, so she delayed the test. It was too late to reschedule or get a refund so she sat for the exam just to get the practice and then voided it at the end. She knew going in that she would void, When she did sit for the actual exam to be scored she was better prepared and had a much better score.

So take away here is, applying to a throw away school does not tag one as re-applicant to other schools. One can use a different throw away medical school each application cycle as per strategy detailed above. No limit on number of withdraws allowed by AMCAS.
Similarly, take MCAT and void it, if one does not feel good about the outcome. No limits on how many times one can void MCAT test. Are the voided MCAT tests reported by AAMC to medical schools ?
Usual advise for MCAT is once and done. One’s chances of a medical school admission diminishes as a subsequent re-applicant.

There are restrictions on the maximum number of attempts for MCAT.
Remember that one can take the MCAT up to three times in a calendar year, with a lifetime max of 7 attempts, and the scores from each test date are reported separately. A voided exam and “no show” do count as one of your attempts.

Cancelling a MCAT test does not count towards the limit of 3 per year and maximum life time limit of 7 attempts for MCAT.

From other popular website for pre-meds:

AMCAS Instruction book:
If you have a processed AMCAS application from a previous application year, you are considered a re-applicant to those medical schools. This is regardless of whether or not a secondary application was completed.

Processed=verified.

So if anyone is thinking of withdrawing this year remember that you will not be considered a re-applicant if it’s done prior to verification (withdrawing from the process after verification is a whole other story).

===========================
If processed means verified, then submitting to a throw away school may make one a re-applicant.

Please call AMCAS for an accurate definition of “re-applicant”.

Please call AAMC for any information related to MCAT.

Does withdrawl actually means it should be done prior to verification ?

From AMCAS FAQ:

Am I a reapplicant if I withdrew my previous AMCAS application?
No. You are not considered a reapplicant if you formally withdrew your application through AMCAS.

Your application may only be withdrawn prior to the verification process when your application is in one of the following statues: “Submitted to AMCAS - Ready for Review,” “Submitted to AMCAS - Waiting for Transcripts,” or “Returned”. See the application withdrawal FAQ for more information.

[grtd2010]

@icuinNm

@grtd2010

A lot of students may be doing risk mitigation here by taking early even though they might take a GAP year or two. At least, they will know their MCAT score before applying. Right now, if you submit your application, MCAT score may be a big unknown. How do you determine your good application list to apply without a MCAT score ?

Applicants will submit AMCAS and apply to one throw away school that they don’t ever plan to attend. Then once the MCAT score comes back, they will add more schools and will be able to target schools based in their stats including their MCAT score. If they want to do a retake and apply next year instead, they can withdraw their application. Then the following year they won’t be considered a reapplicant for the schools on their target list.

FWIW, people should not take the MCAT until their practice scores are in their target range. Someone getting 504, 503, 506 505 on practice tests are not likely to score a 520 on the real deal a few days later. Of course sometimes the practice scores are in the target range, but then test anxiety, an illness, or family crisis causes the score to be lower. When my D took her MCAT her first AMCAS practice test 3 weeks before test date was not where she wanted to be, so she delayed the test. It was too late to reschedule or get a refund so she sat for the exam just to get the practice and then voided it at the end. She knew going in that she would void, When she did sit for the actual exam to be scored she was better prepared and had a much better score.

A few clarifications one may want to have, after reading the above.

From AMCAS FAQ:

What does withdrawl from AMCAS means ?
Your application may only be withdrawn prior to the verification process when your application is in one of the following states: “Submitted to AMCAS - Ready for Review,” “Submitted to AMCAS - Waiting for Transcripts,” or “Returned”. See the application withdrawal FAQ for more information.

Am I a reapplicant if I withdrew my previous AMCAS application?
No. You are not considered a reapplicant if you formally withdrew your application through AMCAS.

Your application may only be withdrawn prior to the verification process when your application is in one of the following states: “Submitted to AMCAS - Ready for Review,” “Submitted to AMCAS - Waiting for Transcripts,” or “Returned”. See the application withdrawal FAQ for more information.

Are there any limits to number of attempts for MCAT ? Does a voided exam counts towards an attempt ?

There are restrictions on the maximum number of attempts for MCAT.
Remember that one can take the MCAT up to three times in a calendar year, with a lifetime max of 7 attempts, and the scores from each test date are reported separately. A voided exam and “no show” do count as one of your attempts.

Does a cancellation of MCAT counts towards number of attempts ?

Cancelling a MCAT test does not count towards the limit of 3 per year and maximum life time limit of 7 attempts for MCAT.

For further information, please call AMCAS and AAMC.

[grtd2010]

– duplicate deleted

[icuinNm]

I want to clarify a couple of things from my post upthread about applying to a throwaway school. Let’s say the application has been verified, and let’s say the applicant gets their MCAT score back that he/she is not happy with and it’s too late to retest. The applicant will not get an interview from the throwaway school if he/she applied to this one school wisely by applying to a state school as an out of stater that only accepts in-state students. The applicant can withdraw their one school application and still have the AMCAS verified application open.

On the other hand, if the MCAT score is good, the applicant can withdraw from the throwaway school and add more schools in their target range without the long wait of getting the AMCAS application verified and having a late application.

If an applicant decides to apply the following year, they can mark “no” on each school application that asks if they are a reapplicant to that school because they would not reapply to the one throwaway school and they would be a first time applicant to all of the other schools.

As for the MCAT, a voided test counts as one of the 7 allowed tests. The applicant does not have to report the void and the schools do not know the applicant voided. So there is no consequence other than the money spent.

When D made the decision to move her test date, the test sites were all full for the next round, and after that there weren’t any more tests until January. D was not applying that cycle, so she just waited until January to retest. Since the January test dates were not going be posted online until October, she had no choice but to either take the MCAT for practice and void, or be a no-show. Either way, there would not have been a refund, so she took it for the experience and voided. She ended up with 10 interviews and a few acceptances last year, so this void didn’t impact her application whatsoever.

I hope this clears up any confusion.

[SincererLove]

Another applicant here and I feel that I am the only clueless parent. D is rising CS premed senior from Vandy, getting her app together now. Oh, I am not sure why I am even here, because she usually only half-listens to me:-)

Anyway, D hasn’t submitted yet. She didn’t use projected hours. She feels that with pandemic, it is hard to predict whether she is going to continue some of the ECs in the fall. She did project her internship, which she is currently working FT. How did your student handle Completed vs. Projected hours? She said that the schools are not just going to automatically assume that she will quit those activities. But what if they are?

Is there a deadline in submission? Does she need to submit by July 10th, or does she need to get all verifications done by July 10th? That might be a tall order. I am still very confused about the process myself.

[texaspg]

The app has expected activities during senior year and how many hours one might contribute in those activities. Whether one truly works on these activities probably comes across during interviews if schools are serious. Otherwise it is primarily based on what one did in first 3 years in terms of grades and activities and extrapolation from there.

The primary reason to take a gap year is because one’s performance was not that great during first three years and they still need to make up grades/ECs during final year and also some in gap year.

It is important to submit ASAP because the application is not released to colleges until verification is complete. The more apps they have in pipeline, the longer the process takes. If they sit on your app for 30-40 days because of a big backlog and then you have to wait for colleges to release their secondary and then work on those, it might be August or september before colleges have your full app. By then they receive a bulk of their apps that are they are already in the process of reviewing and the only thing that makes your app jump to the top of the pile is 3.9/522 from Vandy. With those numbers. completing apps by early September still gives an interview shot.

[GoldenRock]

@SincererLove

You are blessed that your D half-listens!
Natural parental anxiety overwhelms us.
Trust your D, she is smart and they know what they are doing.
Learning that parental instinct wants the best and wants to interact and know.
But it is back firing because we are ignoring their perspective (I am in steep learning curve!), that ‘I am mature and I know what I need to do, why are you not believing in me that I have grown up’.

As @texaspg said, complete the app sooner with at least 1 dummy college. In that way AMCAS verification is done and or at least in the queue at the top for verification.
Later once the complete school list is finalized, add them in the AMCAS update. GL.

[icuinNm]

Schools don’t pay much attention to projected hours because they know that things change. When your D fills out her secondary apps there will be questions asking what she’s done since she submitted her primary application. She can then add updates about her EC’s since her submission date. Some schools (like Mayo) LOVE updates and pretty much require them as selection date draws near. On the other hand, some schools don’t allow updates at all, and some will allow an update if an interview has been scheduled or if the applicant already interviewed. D had a publication a month or two after submitting her secondaries. There were some schools that she was never allowed to update which was a bummer.

As for submitting the primary, the sooner, the better. Some applicants who aren’t complete with secondaries until September often don’t get interviews until January. By that time, many spots have been filled at schools with rolling admissions. The longer one waits to submit, the amount of time to get verified increases which is why some will get the primary submitted with a throwaway school before they have an MCAT score. It’s also important to have a good app with essays that have been polished. It doesn’t help to rush an app that is not well put together.

[WayOutWestMom]

MSAR Advisor Report of Interview Procedures for 2020-21 cycle

https://aamc-orange.global.ssl.fastly.net/production/media/filer_public/6b/a6/6ba6ac0c-4087-45c7-9345-aa0d5faf57af/msar_interview_procedures_2020-2021.pdf

List tells whether the school is holding virtual vs in-person interviews and the format (MMI vs traditional; open file vs closed file). Also lists the date when the first IIs will be sent out.

The following schools have already announced they will be offering virtual interviews only:

Alabama
Arkansas
USC/Keck
Loma Linda
UC-Riverside
Central Florida
Georgetown
George Washington
Loyola
Northwestern
Rush
Kansas
BostonU
Harvard
UMass
USUHS/Hebert
Maryland
Michigan
SLU
Mississippi
Rutgers
Columbia
Hofstra
Mt Sinai
Case Western (for military personnel stationed overseas only)
NEOCOM
Toledo
Oregon
Puerto Rico
Vanderbilt
Baylor
UT-Houston
Texas A&M
Washington State
Wisconsin

[rockyboston]

Khan academy MCAT prep videos will not be available after September 2020.

[grtd2010]

Do medical schools have access to MCAT scores of the future applicants from AAMC ? How do they do target marketing to desirable applicants based on MCAT score ?

[texaspg]

Medical schools buy lists for the ranges they want to target. One can expect to receive letters from WashU and Case Western if they have a score above 518 as an example.