<p>… or Rice Owls.</p>
<p>Yep, them too.</p>
<p>Johns Hopkins is collaborating with private developers, universities, and local government as well as Shady Groves Life Science Center by combining it’s two Rockville Montgomery County campuses in order to create a world class science community that can rival Cambridge, MA and Palo Alto as well as international bioparks in Singapore, South Korea, and China.</p>
<p>Montgomery county is already ranked among the top 10 richest counties with FDA and NIH in it’s back yard. 20-30 million feet of retail, 60,000 high tech jobs, 6.5 million square feet of research space on Hopkins’ Belward campus alone (not including the many more million of ft of research space on the JHU’s Montgomery campus)</p>
<p>Hopkins is trying to combat talent drain from Maryland into Virginia and to places like Cambridge, MA and Palo Alto. The “DNA Alley” coined by New York Times is a 15 mile stretch of highway on I-270 in Maryland that is the third largest biotech cluster in the nation after Cambridge, MA and Palo, Alto.</p>
<p>Vision 2030, a Internationally competitive Science City from nothing. 
</p>
<p>“Based in Montgomery County, the Vision 2030 is a project to create a world-class science community that, embraces smart growth principles, features a mix of uses (education, research, retail, and residential) and promotes a research community that advances applied science.”</p>
<p>[Johns</a> Hopkins Hopes to Develop 600 Acres In Montgomery County Into Life-Sci Campuses | BioRegion News | Bioregionnews | GenomeWeb](<a href=“http://www.genomeweb.com/bioregionnews/johns-hopkins-hopes-develop-600-acres-montgomery-county-life-sci-campuses]Johns”>http://www.genomeweb.com/bioregionnews/johns-hopkins-hopes-develop-600-acres-montgomery-county-life-sci-campuses)</p>
<p><a href=“Home | Johns Hopkins University”>Home | Johns Hopkins University;
<p>Tenis,
When I saw this article about what’s going on in Michigan, I thought of you and your Michigan prophesy in # 7. </p>
<p>[Rural</a> Mich. counties turn failing roads to gravel | roads, mich, counties - Top Stories - WWMT NEWSCHANNEL 3](<a href=“http://www.wwmt.com/articles/roads-1363526-mich-counties.html]Rural”>http://www.wwmt.com/articles/roads-1363526-mich-counties.html)</p>
<p>The comments that follow the article are very interesting as well. </p>
<p>Bc,
With regard to your latest post, let me offer a technical response to your argument, </p>
<p>“Fiddlesticks.” </p>
<p>You clearly have not talked to the graduates of the college class of 2009. </p>
<p>Choose a school…any school you like…and do some digging. You will learn upon actual examination and interaction with students and college administrators and business people (we won’t bite you…much) that competition for jobs among 2009 college graduates has never been keener and more difficult. And geographical influences are having a larger effect this year than at any time in the last several decades. </p>
<p>This is not rocket science. Heck, it’s not even philosophy. This is common sense. People who need to find jobs go to where the work is and local economies will have a large impact on the ability to absorb these workers. Students who come from colleges in those regions have unquestionably been affected. </p>
<p>Two examples which might help you to understand the local economy’s impact on jobs:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>New York Metropolitan area today. It’s a mess. Tax receipts are down by nearly half and taxes may have to go up to meet the fiscal needs. That’s never a great jobs program. Meanwhile, Wall Street has cut hundreds of thousands of jobs in the last year. The regulators are gearing up to impose new terms that are sure to be less generous than in the past and will likely have negative implications for job growth for years to come. Talk to kids coming out of Stern today or even Columbia. It’s not a happy scene. The good Wall Street jobs are about a quarter of what they were a year ago. Can NYC jobs come back? Sure, but it’s going to be slow and there has been a tremendous amount of pain inflicted over the past year. </p></li>
<li><p>Texas. While energy is far less a part of the economy today than it used to be, it can still have a large impact on the state’s economy. If oil goes to $25 a barrel and stays there, the state suffers bigtime and jobs are lost. Of course, if oil goes to $75/$100/$140 and stays there, job growth is likely to be robust. When times are tough in the Texas economy, talk to kids coming out of UT or A&M or Tech or Baylor or TCU or SMU or even Rice and you’ll get an earful. In such times, the local economy tells the story on job prospects and not much of it is positive. </p></li>
</ol>
<p>There are dozens of other examples, but hopefully you get the point. Even a Cave Man should be able to understand that there are college winners and losers as an economy waxes and wanes. It is axiomatic that the less strong graduates, and particularly those coming from less selective universities in those areas, will be the ones most heavily impacted. </p>
<p>Phead,
With the increased funds that the Bethesda, MD-based NIH is going to have control over, southern Maryland should be a nirvana for many health care companies. I would think that this could further aid colleges in relatively close proximity to this area, including your Johns Hopkins.</p>
<p>Hawkette, unfortunately, I think that while the data you present is interesting, you are overplaying your hand as usual. The kids you are trying to reach are presumably kids in high school considering colleges. In 5 years time, when they graduate, the landscape may well have changed. For example, I agree that New York City is a more difficult job market than it has been. However, Wall Street has not had a bad year, and you might find that in five years, things have completed turned around and job opportunities are almost as good as before the financial crisis. There are huge unknowns out there–for example, if Florida is hit by devastating hurricanes, it might not be as attractive a place to go to school or work, regardless of population increases. A completely revitalized auto industry (which I think unlikely, but you never know), could lead to more jobs in the Rust Belt.</p>
<p>I think that both you and bclintonk are correct. As bclintonk has noted, kids who attend top schools and do reasonably well, wherever they are located, will generally be able to find a job, regardless of whether they went to Carnegie Mellon or Duke (and I certainly wouldn’t suggest making Raleigh-Durham’s population growth part of the decision-making process in whether to attend Duke or CMU). Kids who do not have choices of top schools might want to consider going to a school in an area that they want to settle/work in and their decision-making process could include the availability of jobs in the area.</p>
<p>Midatlmom,
Not sure what hand you are alleging I am overplaying, but this thread is not about the job prospects for students coming out of any specific school, prestigious/selective or not. Neither I in my opening post nor the article mentioned any colleges. </p>
<p>My point was/is that the geography (could be a city, state, or region depending on the area) that surrounds any college can often have an effect on the job prospects of its graduates. IMO, as some locales are growing and others are contracting, geography is a worthwhile consideration for many students. I think that this is particularly true for lower achieving graduates and probably even more so for those coming from less prominent universities. </p>
<p>As for your comment that “Wall Street has not had a bad year,” are you kidding?</p>
<p>Oh wow, I guess I must have been confused about the point of your thread. I thought it was that population growth was something to be considered when picking a school. Oh wait, that is the point of your thread.</p>
<p>Obviously, when I mentioned CMU and Duke, I was merely picking an example of two schools that were in regions with different population trajectories. However, my point, which I believe is also one of your points, is that top students do not need to be concerned about geography, except insofar as they want to go to school near home, near a beach etc. Other students might want to consider it, although they should be careful because things can change unexpectedly (i.e., how many of us would have predicted the financial meltdown 5 years ago). </p>
<p>My point about Wall Street was that the Dow Jones Industrial average is in the black for the year (see [Dow</a> Positive for '09 - WSJ.com](<a href=“http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124480435763009729.html]Dow”>http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124480435763009729.html)), many of the stronger banks are having surprisingly strong quarters and that the financial markets might be in better shape than anticipated within the next year or so (although I don’t believe that some of the systemic problems have been solved, but that’s a different discussion).</p>
<p>And of course, in my continuing attempt to be helpful, here are some of your other threads on the subject of geography and college selection in case unsuspecting readers/posters have missed any of your multiple postings:</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/722276-cities-good-job-growth-college-search-selection.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/722276-cities-good-job-growth-college-search-selection.html</a>
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/709572-post-grad-job-opps-college-search-process.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/709572-post-grad-job-opps-college-search-process.html</a>
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/549331-americas-fastest-dying-cities-implications-higher-education.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/549331-americas-fastest-dying-cities-implications-higher-education.html</a>
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/367512-economic-growth-future-college-graduates.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/367512-economic-growth-future-college-graduates.html</a></p>
<p>I don’t see why that should matter. where you go to college and where you settle down and find work are usually two different places.</p>
<p>Hawkette’s “theory” might be more convincing if this hasn’t happened before.</p>
<p>Let history be our guide. Some of you might recall a similar environment during the last months of the Carter era: the Misery Index reaching an all-time high at 21%; oil at $40 a barrel with the experts predicting it would soon exceed $100; Texas was booming and people were leaving the Rust Belt for the Sun Belt en masse for jobs…</p>
<p>Did it change the college landscape significantly? Did universities in the Sun Belt states gain in popularity and prestige at the expense of those in the Rust Belt states?</p>
<p>BananaSandwich is right - where you go to college and where you work are usually two different places.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Unless you are fortunate enough to go to school in an area you love, with an abundance of jobs available. People typically don’t leave the Rust Belt by choice after graduation; they do it out of necessity.</p>
<p>
Neither did the families who moved in the early 1980’s, but it didn’t affect the college landscape then.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I’m not trying to argue that schools areas that are experiencing a significant economic downturn (i.e. California, Michigan, Ohio, etc) are any worse off…I’m just saying that people who go to schools in areas that are economically healthy have an advantage during and after school.</p>
<p>I went to school in Philadelphia. Now I work in India, and I had summer internships in Korea, Singapore, and China</p>
<p>It’s a good thing Philadelphia is just an hour’s train ride away from Asia, or I’d never have gotten these opportunities, no matter how prestigious my school…</p>
<p>When we go into global drought conditions, we in Michigan with our Great Lakes access are going to be beating the masses back with sticks. We just have to wait it out.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Only until we can figure out how to build cheap and efficient desalination plants. :)</p>
<p>“I’m not trying to argue that schools areas that are experiencing a significant economic downturn (i.e. California, Michigan, Ohio, etc) are any worse off…I’m just saying that people who go to schools in areas that are economically healthy have an advantage during and after school.”</p>
<p>Very few regions have not been severely impacted by the current downturn. Outside of a few oil states I can’t think of any.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Two states cited as being relatively healthy economically (Texas and North Carolina) have loads of highly-respected universities and tons of college-age people ready to enter the local job market each year.</p>
<p>Texas==oil state</p>
<p>I don’t think NC is doing very well. Major losses in banking around Charlotte, idustrial production down, and high tech not booming. Also major crop of tobacco in decline.</p>
<p><a href=“Unemployment - Google Public Data Explorer”>Unemployment - Google Public Data Explorer;
<p>
</p>
<p>NC is actually doing very well, particularly central and southeastern North Carolina. Raleigh is the fastest growing metro area in the country and is projected to double its population by 2025; it has also been ranked the #1 place in the country to do business for 2 years straight now. Apple just announced plans to open a $1 billion technology center in North Carolina, and the Fayetteville region is booming due to BRAC and the relocation of US Army Forces Command from Atlanta to Fayetteville (Fayetteville was even featured in Parade Magazine for having one of the best housing markets in the country). Further to the east, the coast is always benefiting from tourism. North Carolina as a whole is supposed to gain a couple million more people by 2025 as well; it is already one of the ten most populous states according to the most recent data.</p>
<p>^ Yeah, NC has taken it in the chops in this economic downturn. As of April, 2009, North Carolina’s 10.8% unemployment rate was sixth-worst in the country—close on the heels of Michigan, Oregon, South Carolina, Rhode Island and California. And there’s no particular reason to think this is short-term; much of it is structural. Once-booming Charlotte has gone bust and is now pretty much relegated to being a scaled-down, second-tier, back-office banking center. Tobacco’s dead in this country as a job producer; the tobacco companies will do fine but with most of their production and consumers offshore, in developing markets still vulnerable to being hooked. No job prospects there. North Carolina is one of the nation’s most manufacturing-dependent states, with nearly as many manufacturing jobs as Michigan before the current recession, on a lower population base. But like Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio, and others before it, North Carolina is learning that even low-wage U.S. manufacturing labor (the kind NC specialized in) is very costly by global standards; as a consequence, its manufacturing sector is in a deep secular decline, and is not likely to recover once the economy picks up. Coastal Carolina has been doing well with tourism and second homes but its days are probably numbered due to rising sea levels and hurricanes which will make this, along with coastal Florida, one of the most vulnerable parts of the country in the age if global climate change—and likely one of the first in line demanding federal handouts when the inevitable disaster strikes the ill-advised and poorly-prepared. The Research Triangle appears to be on pretty solid footing, but will find it increasingly difficult to be the only bright spot holding up an otherwise pretty bleak state and regional economy. With the exception of the Research Triangle, North Carolina is still on the whole a pretty low-income, low-education, low-skill state; not where you’d want to be positioned in the economy of the future. </p>
<p>Notice also that all these population “projections” are pretty much just straight-line extrapolations from the last few years of pre-recession trends. About as reliable as the estimate you’d get based upon flipping a coin five times and coming up with three heads, and projecting that out to 60% heads over the next 20 tosses. North Carolina is now suddenly flipping a lot of tails. Its luck is going to have to change drastically to get back to that 60% heads ratio it’s been counting on.</p>