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. It's easy for a parent to overestimate their kids' actual abilities and strive to push them into the slot the parent is convinced is "right." Sometimes it might be better just to let the kid go to school, take the tests once or twice, and let the chips fall where they may.
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<p>Maybe its this type of philosophy that has US kids far lagging behind our international counterparts in academic achievement? Why so few of our terminal degrees in the hard sciences are gained by Americans. Why nearly 70% of Americans prefern college the humanities and the like? The huge academic gap between AA, latinos and other groups? All taking the paths of least resistance. I prefer the philosophy of some asian cultures that believe in hard work and diligence as opposed to innate ability. On many levels here it's hard to argue with the results, whether it is GPA, standardized testing, etc. Like my grandparents used to tell me, "hard work never killed nobody." </p>
<p>Excellent article. I've passed it on to many already. So many applications running through my head. I"ll definitely be looking at more of her work and books. Thanks.</p>
<p>Our students lag in hard sciences because the rewards are not there. A good car salesman or plumber can outearn your average science PhD from year one on. Pay biologists $500k and we will be up to our eyeballs in them.</p>
<p>madville my DH feels like you do in post #141; my feelings are more like the ones you quoted. I find it interesting that he is from Jamaica West Indies, and I am from Jamaica New York, two generations from my Carribean "roots". While I think hard work is a good thing, I'm just not sure the hard work should mostly be academic. There are so many ways people can have to "work hard", sometimes just to keep going.</p>
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Our students lag in hard sciences because the rewards are not there. A good car salesman or plumber can outearn your average science PhD from year one on.
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<p>There are always a few exceptions to the rule, but the avg college grad make about twice as much in lifetime earnings as compared to the avg hs grad who may one day be your plumber or sell you a car. But my dentist, doctor, and those working at top companies hiring those in the hard sciences such as P&G, GE, Abbott Labs, etc, may tend to disagree with you. My point being, the MONEY is there. </p>
<p>Skilled tradesmen, like plumbers & electricians, do very, very well. You can't lump them in with H.S. grads. I have a plumber and a realtor on my block, and both make more than the avg surgeon according to that US Career list. THat list had some very questionable figures anyway. Around here, there is a huge gap between the earnings of a surgon and a pediatrician, for example. And to list a generic job, such as sales manager, where the industry makes all the difference in compensation, is not very useful.</p>
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While I think hard work is a good thing, I'm just not sure the hard work should mostly be academic.
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<p>Reminds me of an interview with former NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue, who was quoting something his father told him, "Work you brain, not your back." That has been a mantra repeated among the "elites" for quite some time I'm sure, and is one I've shared with my children. Of course there is no shame in physical labor, but generally speaking there is more reward in academic pursuits.</p>
<p>Being a list of averages, the salaries seem "low" across the board. I know some very highly paid tradespeople (plumbers, especially those that own their own business), but then again there are some in the same business that make squat (those just starting out, for example). </p>
<p>Our area has fairly low salaries- but engineers who have been working in their field for 10 to 20 years are making at least six figures; most senior level are at least in the 130-150K range. It's the newbies that make 40-50K, which brings the average down.</p>
<p>Anyway, getting back to the SAT theme, the test is just the beginning. Once a student gets into college, it doesn't make doodly-squat difference anymore. They just need to get a high enough score to get in.</p>
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Skilled tradesmen, like plumbers & electricians, do very, very well. You can't lump them in with H.S. grads. I have a plumber and a realtor on my block, and both make more than the avg surgeon according to that US Career list. THat list had some very questionable figures anyway.
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<p>Ok, I'll wait for your list then. Anectdotal comparisons are too narrow. I'm sure that most realtors and tradesmen don't make as much as these guys. As a matter of fact, I'm certain of it. As for lumping tradesmen with hs grads, I would say most have no degrees, thus, they are in in the group according to census and dept of labor figures, some college, or less(hs/ged).</p>
<p>Madville, I think it is a mistake to make a career choice with earning power as one of the top considerations. A good plumber will make more than a weak lawyer. A good electrician will make more that a weak engineer. A good auto technician will make more than a .....etc., etc., etc.</p>
<p>This conversation about the value and efficacy of the SAT has been raging on multiple threads this week. I should note that professionally and personally I am not opposed to the general notion of developing and using selection type tests for the workplace and other uses. Indeed, I believe that once upon a time the SAT was a valuable tool. But now it is TOXIC for a wide variety of reasons that have been discussed here and elsewhere on CC. Here is a link to the latest controversy. Families are spending (more) money to help prep their kids for the Writing Test, and a majority of the top schools aren't even using it! Clearly the test prep industry hasn't let any grass grow under their feet on this one.</p>
<p>Finally, here is a quote from an interview with Anthony Marx, President of Amherst College, from last Sunday's Boston Globe Magazine that captures the essence of how many professionals and nonprofessionals think about the SAT as it currently functions in the admission process:</p>
<p>"There is a terrible irony that the SAT, which was created to help ensure access based on merit, has in many ways become a barrier to access based on merit."</p>