"Academically so strong that their admission is without doubt"

Applying to College
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<p>There are many students who are guaranteed admits into even HYPSM. Most often (in math and science), they possess a high placing in an international olympiad. For a numbers game, there can be at most 24 IMO participants (not medalists) in a graduating class. 6 freshmen, which is unheard of, who swap with 6 others for sophomore (more probable, realistically zero) year, 6 more for junior year, and 6 more for senior year. Out of an applicant pool of tens if not hundreds of thousands (inclusive) of students applying to top tier schools, these applicants really stand out. There are many olympiads, such as biology, chemistry, physics, and informatics, and finalists and semifinalists often coincide.</p>

<p>It is also exceedingly common for these students to graduate with 3.98-4.0 GPAs unweighted, 35-36 ACT scores, 2300+ SAT scores, and multiple 800s on SAT IIs. Students of this caliber are often well versed in the admissions game, so they also realize the value of extracurriculars (ranging from volunteer work to business starting). Again, more often than not, they are extremely proficient art and music students.</p>

<p>Keep in mind this is the collective case of 1-time participants, or medalists. In math, qualifying for the USAMO for all 4 years of high school while never making the IMO team is not unheard of. Students who qualify many times but not continuously have made the team. Think of how many students out there collectively have achieved commendable stats in addition to multiple finalist and semifinalist accolades. Then, there are students who participate in the numerous science fairs around the US. In addition, there are international students who’ve done the same thing within their respective countries. </p>

<p>The concession I make is that the absolute number is small, but the statement that Ivies are reaches for everyone is realistically unsubstantiated. I also realize I really only used the math culture example, as it is the one I’m most familiar with, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the same “elite” theory permeates the arts.</p>

<p>If you want a reference of kids like these, google search “Davidson Fellows” and read through some of the scholarship winners extracurriculars and other honors. Search for international olympiad participants (not necessarily medalists), and see how often their names pop up.</p>

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<p>I’m pretty good friends with this guy (US student, not foreigner) who went to IPhO soph year, IMO and ILO junior year, and also won the International Eastman competition junior year. Damn…</p>

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<p>Some of us aren’t into science and math. I’m a lawyer. I’ve never heard of some of the “medals” and “olympiads” referenced on this thread. What are these “superstars” doing? Do they make a lot of money? Are they famous? The people I know making seven figures a year are public college grads and entrepreneurs and lawyers (I’m not one of them :slight_smile: ). None earned any science or math medals or olympiads or even heard of them. </p>

<p>I guess it depends on how each individual defines “superstar.” Math and science geeks to me aren’t superstars unless they discover a cure for a killer disease or have become one of the world’s renowned brain surgeons, or something along those lines. How many people do that? Otherwise, it seems like they just labor in obscurity. I work for a Fortune 50 that employs hundreds of scientists. They don’t seem like superstars to me. They make less money than I do.</p>

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<p>Philip Streich. When I was applying to college, this guy had already gotten a good bit of media attention and his name was bandied about on CC as the ultimate college applicant.</p>

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<p>To people who claim that no one has a safety at HYP, see T26E4’s post on page 1. Academic superstars do indeed exist.</p>

<p>While I realize academic superiority in High School may not translate into later success, this thread is in the column “College Admissions” and I thought my epiphany would be of interest to college applicants. </p>

<p>On the matter of coming up with an definition, so it seems that the academic superstar is most likely a Math or Science kid with superb test scores, GPA, national/ international recognition (national science competitions, Publication in Journal, acclaimed research, International Academic Olympiads)?</p>

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<p>To participate in these elite contests like the national science and math olympics, you first have to know that they exist – and early enough in your high school career to prepare for them. At my kid’s school, no one has ever heard of these events – and neither did I until I started reading CC (but two years too late, unfortunately). </p>

<p>I hope the real standard is “what have you done with the opportunities you had available?” rather than absolute comparatives with kids who have had the benefit of tens of thousands of dollars of special training as well as family connections.</p>

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<p>Nor did anyone suggest that it did. Whom or what are you responding to? Please remember that this is a forum for college admissions, as jasonInNy pointed out. </p>

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<p>Indeed, top colleges label some students as “academic superstars” (those who have a strong combination of grades, test scores, and other honors). This does not, however, translate to those schools’ being safeties for those students; it merely means that, barring any salient deficiency otherwise (e.g., especially poor essays or recommendations), the student will almost certainly be accepted.</p>

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<p>Yes, this is the case at my high school (as well as others in the area) also. With little to no awareness of any major competitions, the opportunities to make oneself stand out beyond the typical extracurricular achievement and top scores and grades are limited.</p>

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<p>well, since 85% of the applicants to Harvard are without a doubt qualified, they can’t just look at academics, cause it’d be difficult to choose.
They’re looking for quirky, lovable people, who have something to be involved in outside of studies, and someone will want to be roommates with.
Seriously, they don’t want robots, and superstars might just be robots.
I remember last year i think, one of the national math team guys got rejected from Harvard.
(and I didn’t make the number up, The Harvard admissions officer for the state of Georgia told me that)</p>

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<p>Hi T26E4,
instead of letting people’s debating on their definition of “academic superstar,” please let us know what Yale thinks one is</p>

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<p>Interesting thread. A couple of years ago we had dinner with the brother of friends who had worked some twenty-five years in college admissions, most of it in the Ivy League. The questions came up about stand out applicants, and the assumption was made that we meant kids like these being discussed here. He said that the ones who really stand out are the “scary smart” kids. These kids don’t come through the regular admissions process – a high level faculty member, the development office, a trustee, brings them to the college’s attention. They haven’t won Siemens, etc., etc. They may or may not attend high school. They may or may not have taken SAT/ACT. They are deeply invovled in what it is they do - be it music or science or whatever. It is all encompassing in their life and they have acheived astonishing things without seeming to have played any kind of a game. The bad news is that schools will do almost anything to get these kids. The good news is he said in twenty-five years he had personally seen one kid like that and heard of two others. I would call those kids “superstars”.</p>

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<p>Someone who went to my school got a letter of assurance from Stanford. (He eventually chose Yale)</p>

<p>I don’t know all the details except for a few–he was nationally ranked in calculus and he taught himself AP Physics, walked on to the test, and got a 5 (in tenth grade).</p>

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<p>Just curious: What about “ordinary” smart kids? In other words, the kids with high test scores, 4.0 averages, and a well-developed extracurricular focus but no amazing achievements? Do these kids fill in the gaps in a class once a school runs out of the truly extraordinary ones to offer admission to?</p>

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<p>I imagine that the majority of each incoming class falls under that category (with a modification of “4.0 averages” to “near-4.0 averages”).</p>

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<p>*Rather than focus on the HS “superstar” who went on to get a Rhodes, think about all the non-*********s, or even the rejectees, who went on to do far more than the stars.</p>

<p>In my D’s HS class, there was one kid who was clearly the academic star at a tough HS. 10 APs, most self taught, second highest GPA, great ECs etc.etc. Got into every Ivy he applied to, including a trifecta of HYP. Went to H. Graduated two years ago. Where is he now? He’s a junior consultant, like so many of his classmates. No significant graduation honors or national scholarships during his undergrad years.</p>

<p>Contrast this with his classmate that was rejected by a number of ivies, went to another college where she was a junior year PBK, won a Rhodes (and other national level honors) and is now a DPhil student at Oxford.</p>

<p>So being one of these superstars may or may not mean anything in the long run. Stardom in HS is pretty one-dimensional. Later on, stardom depends on a lot more. *</p>

<p>newmassdad, you just made my day. :wink:</p>

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<p>Am I the only one who reads these threads and gets depressed at how much potential they squandered due to laziness and ignorance? If I found CC in middle school I would have been a ****ing star. Now I feel like some kids are so far ahead it’s almost impossible to catch up…I’ll still try though :p</p>

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<p>Our S wasn’t a “superstar.” He didn’t have a 2400 SAT or a 4.0. He wasn’t valedictorian. He was, however, an interesting applicant. He had a great debate record, was active in theatre, and was editor of his HS newspaper. The result: offers of admission from Deep Springs and Yale. (He chose Yale and had a fabulous four years - they knew what they were doing when they accepted him!) So it’s way more than academic cred. In fact, almost every school I’ve ever toured (and with child #3 now applying to college, I’ve toured quite a few) has mentioned that they have rejected 4.0 and 2400 students. They want people who will make their school more interesting and more diverse.</p>

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<p>DoinSchool. My thoughts exactly. I might not be a star, but atleast I know I’d tried.</p>

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<p>Yeah, it’s crazy how much some kids got their **** together. Then again, we should keep in mind lots of these kids were simply bred and groomed in a way to best foster their intelligence. We all come from different backgrounds and families where such excellence often just wasn’t an option. We might not all be ideal college applicants, but we are all experts at living our own lives. Now is still an excellent time to change, and move into the future with determination. Our “failure” to achieve may just as well be experience for motivation. Some of these kids don’t yet know the meaning of disappointment, hopelessness, heartache, etc…But they can make one stronger</p>

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<p>Then again, these grapes taste really sour :D</p>

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<p>Well here were my stats in the day:</p>

<p>2390 SAT, 4 SAT2 800’s, 4.0 GPA, val, got into every Ivy I applied to plus MIT/Stanford/etc. </p>

<p>Unfortunately, college is expensive and can ruin the best laid plans pretty quickly.</p>