Accepted but ZERO financial aid

Paying for College
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<p>And a savvy parent could turn that around and answer: “Because most schools make it impossible to know what the bottom line cost will be until the full financial aid package is received.”</p>

<p>For example, two small private universities, very similar “average” published financial aid stats, very similar entering student profile, actual packages offered:</p>

<p>University E: $39,500 sticker price; offered $3,500 need-based grant aid (all federal), $14,500 merit; net cost, $21,500. Not affordable for our family.</p>

<p>University W: $47,000 sticker price; offered $14,000 need-based grant aid (including federal and institutional), $18,000 merit; net cost, $15,000. Affordable for our family (although DD decided to go elsewhere, to an even less costly public).</p>

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<p>BU and American University do not guarantee to meet the full need of accepted students. In addition to the FAFSA, BU and American U require submission of the CSS Profile. The vast bulk of need based aid given by both of these schools comes in the form of institutional aid which they can award any way they choose to.</p>

<p>Neither school promises to meet your FAFSA need at all…they never have.</p>

<p>When you apply to a school that does not meet full need and is pricey, you should do so knowing that the financial aid might not work out. Sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn’t.</p>

<p>Honestly, BU in particular is VERY upfront about how they award need based aid…and the preferential packaging they do.</p>

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<p>I would like to see how OP would react to if his/her child had gotten into a school that meets need, and then deems them cheap.</p>

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<p>Thanks for all the replies, some sympathetic, others not so much. I want to clarify that I did not expect all financial need to be met by Boston Univ. or American U. Three other colleges my daughter applied to gave aid but not the full need either.
But… BU and AU didn’t provide anything but the Stafford loans ($5500), so that is ZILCH on their part. If they accepted my daughter, in good faith they could have offered something! So I interpret the offer of Nothing as they had no intention of seeing my daughter attend their school. (Unless they think I have that rich aunt or money stashed offshore). She padded their statistics that’s all. And those statistics will be on College Board and other sites for future students and parents to study in the next go around.
I just find it misleading. I did do the BU online estimator and if that read out came out as big as the fat zero in assistance my daughter received she would not have applied there, a waste of time and application money. We did appeal the aid decision, their estimator was cited, the appeal was denied. They responded that their resources go to students with better academics so… back to my original point -WHY ACCEPT SO MANY STUDENTS IF FINANCIAL RESOURCES COME BACK TO MERIT AND ACADEMIC ACHIEVEMENT?? Just don’t accept my daughter in the first place!
Another thing, not everybody qualifies for the Stafford loan, so one would expect an institution would know a student will not attend if that is all they will get.
As stated by others here in this post, private schools are a business. You know it by the amount of literature they send you.
To those who think I’m looking for some kind of handout or entitlement. If these schools (BU and AU) advertised that they accept many students (with obvious need, e.g. Stafford qualified) who will not receive a penny of assistance from them then they would not get as many applicants. People should know this. If we pay for SAT scores to be sent, and pay for CSS Profiles to be sent, and pay for applications, and these schools post misleading stats on College sites about this percent of need is met, and this is the average amount of aid given, then we consumers are being taken for a ride.</p>

<p>lakeawead -are you an adult?</p>

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<p>Just an FYI…how would you expect BU to know the difference between folks who somehow WILL pay and those who won’t? BU accepted your daughter. You have other options that are more affordable so your daughter will go there. If she received a merit award from Emerson or Ithaca , she was a more competitive applicant at those schools than for BU or AU this year. It is wonderful that she has those options.</p>

<p>I get it. You are disappointed that the aid at these schools wasn’t what you had hoped for. Time to move on instead of holding a grudge.</p>

<p>EVERYONE who completes a FAFSA is eligible for a Stafford loan…EVERYONE. The max stafford for a freshman is $5500 and anyone completing a FAFSA can get that loan. </p>

<p>I’m not sure what you mean when you say that all students are not eligible for a Stafford loan. The only ones who would not be would be international students…but they are not able to complete a FAFSA.</p>

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<p>* She padded their statistics that’s all. And those statistics will be on College Board and other sites for future students and parents to study in the next go around.*</p>

<p>Well, she only padded their stats as one who applied. Since she’s not accepting, she hurts their yield. </p>

<p>Have you contacted BU and asked them why their NPC gave such a different result. I think that if a school’s NPC gives out very wrong info, the school should be called on that to determine if your situation is just a fluke, or if their NPC is (purposely) misleading to get more applications. If it’s the former, then that’s that. If it’s the latter, then a school deserves to be exposed. If there’s something wrong with their NPC, then the school needs to know that. NPCs are going to have some small margin of error.</p>

<p>The NPCs aren’t going to be perfectly accurate, but if you have a straightforward situation and BU’s NPC is spitting out very generous estimates, then that’s unethical. </p>

<p>BTW…did the NPC suggest any kind of merit scholarship? If so, did it ask for stats?</p>

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<p>cavendar - You’re back asking all the same questions that everybody has already answered! Especially this one:</p>

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<p>Their admissions are need-blind. They decided to admit your daughter. Even if she’s not competitive for the aid, how are they to know for sure that she doesn’t have the resources to attend if she wants to? In fact, they know that some students will attend with zero aid. You want them to shut the door on those folks?</p>

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<p>Hi mom2collegekids: The Boston University Net price calculator gave a BU need based scholarship, not any merit scholarship.</p>

<p>Thumper: I have moved on. My daughter is extremely happy. My disappointment is that I felt mislead and look at this as ways some colleges mislead students (and parents) into applying. If you like this system then good for you.
By the way, only demonstrated need based on FAFSA qualifies one for a Stafford subsidized loan so not everyone qualifies.</p>

<p>MisterK: I’m not asking any questions.</p>

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<p>Cavender…your post 64 mentioned Stafford loans period…no mention of subsidized only. It is misleading.</p>

<p>You felt misled…but really BU never has stated it will meet the need as shown by the FAFSA…never has.</p>

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<p>Okay, it’s late, perhaps I’m overtired, but I don’t get it . . . if BU (or any other school) uses “preferential packaging” for their need-based aid, then the net price calculator can’t possibly be reliable. If the amount of aid depends not on need, but on how much the school wants that student . . . then the NPC is useless. What’s it going to measure?</p>

<p>It’s going to spit out a number that equals the family’s FA “eligibility” . . . which, in such cases, bears NO relationship to what the family might or might not be awarded, since that’s dependent not on eligibility, but on desirability. Sure, you can add a disclaimer (in small print, of course!), saying that this is an estimate only and not a guarantee . . . but that doesn’t come close to telling the truth, which is “Your award will be whatever we want it to be.”</p>

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<p>* The Boston University Net price calculator gave a BU need based scholarship, not any merit scholarship.*</p>

<p>then if this bothered me, and the amount was more than a couple thousand, then I would ask why the NPC greatly differed from the actual. If your situation is “cut and dry”, and you didn’t submit your FA paperwork late, then the numbers shouldn’t be off very much. </p>

<p>Frankly, since this may be BU’s first year using the NPC, the school may have something in place for people to report “bad estimates” so that they can improve their calculations. If a school doesn’t have the means to provide some feedback, then shame on them. They implemented these things last year and they should have the means to hear some feedback to work out any kinks.</p>

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<p>*Quote:
if . . . BU’s NPC is spitting out very generous estimates, then that’s unethical.</p>

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<p>Okay, it’s late, perhaps I’m overtired, but I don’t get it . . . if BU (or any other school) uses “preferential packaging” for their need-based aid, then the net price calculator can’t possibly be reliable. If the amount of aid depends not on need, but on how much the school wants that student . . . then the NPC is useless. What’s it going to measure?*</p>

<p>Schools that are going to use prefential packaging need to ask for stats on their NPCs, otherwise they are being unethical. If they don’t ask for stats, and the calculation “assumes” that the student has merit-quality stats, then the calculation is going to imply that a much more favorable pkg would be awarded. Imagine a student is accepted whose stats are in the bottom quartile, but the NPC doens’t ask for stats, and the student gets a generous estimation.</p>

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<p>Do they in fact ask this? And even if they do, can it possibly be enough? Given all the intangibles that come into play, will the predictions be accurate? Or fairly accurate? Or anywhere remotely accurate?</p>

<p>Okay, I stand corrected . . . the BU calculator, in any event, does take GPA/ACT into account. And when those numbers drop, the projected award also drops. Like a rock.</p>

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<p>I think even then, one has to take the NPC results with a certain quantity of salt. My D is graduating from a school well known for significant grade deflation. At at least two places where we used the NPCs and that asked for stats, the NPC estimate was significantly less than the actual award offer.</p>

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<p>Cavender, you are totally incorrect on Stafford eligibility. There is NO need component for unsubsidized Stafford loans. You only must fill out FAFSA. Does not matter if your EFC is $99,999.</p>

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<p>Iron Maiden: I refer to the subsidized Stafford loans which are based on formula to determine unmet need.</p>

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<p>This is what the OP wrote in post number 64. Apparently the OP meant to put SUBSIDIZED in that sentence but didn’t do so. Just noting this for anyone else reading this thread wondering if they will/won’t be eligible for a Stafford loan.</p>

<p>And just an FYI…since the Boston University in NEED BLIND FOR ADMISSIONS…meaning the admissions folks have no idea what the financial circumstances are…there is NO WAY the admissions folks could make a decision whether to admit or not admit a student based on their ability to actually pay. The ability to actually pay is determined by the FAMILY.</p>

<p>As an FYI…if the admissions folks at my daughter’s university had used our ability to pay per FAFSA as the criteria for admitting her, she would not have gotten admitted. Schools that are need blind do NOT consider the ability to pay when ADMISSIONS makes an acceptance decision.</p>

<p>Once the admissions are made, the financial aid folks determine if or how need will be met…or if merit aid is to be awarded. The financial aid folks do NOT have the authority to rescind the admissions offer based on their determination of the amount of aid. </p>

<p>What happened in the OPs situation is that admissions made a decision that the student was to be offered an acceptance. The packet was then passed on to the financial aid folks who determined that need/merit were not to be offered. That is the way it happened. </p>

<p>This happens at virtually EVERY school that doesn’t meet full need. It probably happened to students who applied to Emerson and Ithaca who were not higher on the radar screen than the OP’s daughter. </p>

<p>Schools that do preferential packaging (like BU) or practice enrollment management (like my daughter’s college) are VERY up front about their practices. I have a kid who is a BU grad and there were NO SECRETS about their financial aid policies, and how they determined merit aid (very selective) and their inability to meet financial need for all students.</p>

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<p>I think even then, one has to take the NPC results with a certain quantity of salt. My D is graduating from a school well known for significant grade deflation. At at least two places where we used the NPCs and that asked for stats, the NPC estimate was significantly less than the actual award offer.</p>

<p>IMHO, if the NPC results were FAR more favorable than the actual offers, then I think families should bring this to the attention of the Directors of FA at each school. Obviously, the inputted numbers have to be correct, and the family’s finances shouldn’t have some odd component. </p>

<p>If the numbers are significantly off (by more than a couple thou), then that means that there is something wrong with their NPCs. Either they are suggesting grants/merit that they have little intention of awarding, or their calculators are just plain wrong. </p>

<p>When I played around with some NPCs earlier in the year, I was shocked that some indicated “merit awards” without having asked for stats!</p>

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<p>Cavender, at a different time, with a different group of kids, your daughter may have gotten merit money from BU and/or AU. Some of this is due to chance. Until you apply and the application is processed, it’s impossible to know who will get in, much less get any money. My one son was deemed a good contender for certain merit awards that his highschool has had many kids get, so that the counselors there have as good of a handle as anyone to know who is likely to get those awards. Nope. He didn’t get a dime. Also got rejected from a program that kids from his school often attend, and his stats were right up there with those accepted. We didn’t think he had much of a chance for merit aid from one selective LAC where his stats were mainstream on average and his gpa downright low, and this school gives less than 10% of their kids merit money, and he got an award. A small one, but an award nonetheless and they increased it when he talked to them. </p>

<p>I’ve known many outstanding, truly amazingly outstanding kids not get a dime of merit from some schools around here that can get all the North East kids they want without having to pay for them. One year, a truly stellar young woman didn’t get a dime of merit money from a school; she’s from this area, and I knew another one who got one of the big awards who did not hold a candle in academic profile, but she is from the mid west and the school is looking for geographic diversity. </p>

<p>So, if the demographics, gender, and other things in her profile, not to even get into gpa/test scores, are not something the school has on the wish list, your kid isn’t going to get an “A” grade from admissions which is what you need to get the juicy packages that meet 1000% of need, full of merit awards and grant. The “B” package might meet need, or come close to it, but have self help in there, like loans and work study. The “C” package is: you can come but you gotta find your own money.
Until admissions examines the admissions package and measures it up to what it wants that year, at that time, no one can truly say what “grade” a given student will get. I know a school that hired a slew of high level econ professors one year, which meant if you were an economics major applying there, you were several levels up on the food chain for a financial aid feeding. If the school orchestra director is screaming for more oboes or violas, and your kid plays, the grade gets bumped up. If it’s the year for runners and there are so many of them applying, your kid is out of luck even though the year before he might be golden. Happened to a good family friend of us. Would have been the top tennis player all 4 years at her Ivy league school, but happened to enter the same year as an all time great did, so she was in the shadow the whole time. So timing and whoever else is in the applicant pool and how many of them are similar makes a big difference in admissions and certainly on the “grade” admissions gives the candidate for financial aid to come up with the package.</p>

<p>It’s getting tougher each year to get grant money for financial aid. As the cost of the schools rise, the aid packages often do not go up commensurately and for many school and students, it means major gaps. Unfortunately, it means MORE kids are accepted as the college has to accept more to make sure it has an optimal sized class since there is more uncertainty when there are greater gaps between need and aid. And yet, the schools want to get a good core of the top kids and know they have to pay merit money to get some of them as they will be courted elsewhere. I know a young man from my son’s school that turned down some more selective schools including some ivies to go to BU because he got an overly generous package from them. They bought him. He’s going for practically free and the colleges that met what his need turned out to be are asking about $30K from his family each year. THat’s an example of what BU is buying–someone who would go to a higher ranked school if the costs were the same, but would go to BU if the cost differential were significant.</p>

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<p>There is no way any online calculator can duplicate the thought process of a merit aid evaluator who has the entire student portfolio, knows the rigor of the high school involved and can evaluate the rigor of the course the student took, etc.</p>

<p>How would you fix a NPC to make the merit estimate more accurate? Ask the student/parent how rigorous the school was? How rigorous the course was? How the essay is going to be evaluated? What the recommendations are going to say? What the total pool of merit-potential students for the upcoming year is going to look like? Sorry to be ridiculous, but that’s essentially what it would have to do, at least at those schools that look at merit awards holistically.</p>

<p>The issue I have with the NPCs and merit aid is those that don’t distinguish between need and merit aid in their estimates but put them all together in an institutional grant category. Those make it very difficult to sort out what the actual picture is likely to look like.</p>

<p>I think a better approach would be to give a need-based estimate only, then perhaps a range of possible merit awards and a pointer to a list of the criteria that are used to evaluate merit applicants.</p>

<p>In the event, we were very pleasantly surprised by the actual award offers - though as it turns out, she’s not going to either place.</p>