advice on getting into UK universities? (questions)

Student Lounge International Students
1

<p>I am an American student wanting to apply to University of Kent for an undergrad in Archaeology and Anthropology or Classical and Archaeological Studies. I had a few questions on how to improve my chances of getting accepted.</p>

<p>1) What SAT subject tests should I take? I am going to be a senior and have the chance to take three. I was thinking Math 2 and Literature, or should I go for a history/science course instead?</p>

<p>2) My SAT score was 1990, 630 reading, 670 math, 690 writing. Is this good enough to get in? They don't accept ACTs. </p>

<p>3) Also, I have a 4.0 GPA (my school doesn't have weighted GPAs) and have never gotten anything but an A in a class. Should I mention this in my personal statement even though it doesn't have much weight for acceptance? And my class rank, 1 out of 580?</p>

<p>4) I have taken 5 AP tests, Spanish, I got a 2 (should I even report this???) and Euro History, US History, Eng Lit, Eng Lang all 4s. I am taking Calc AB, Psych, Environmental Science, and US Gov and Politics next year. Is this enough if I pass all of them, which I am pretty sure I will?</p>

<p>5) Also, I know that there is no place to put a HS transcipt on UCAS, but if the university is interested in you, will they ask for it? Or should I mention in my Personal Statement the hard classes I have taken?</p>

<p>6) In the US, archaeology is a pretty small field, is it the same in the UK, so less people apply for that major? Does that mean there is a greater chance I will get in?</p>

<p>7) Lastly, as an international student, is it easier to get into college in the UK because of the higher tuition rates we have to pay or the need for diversity on campus? Or are we subject to the same qualifications as UK students? </p>

<p>Thanks!</p>

2

<p>Most of your questions should be addressed directly to admissions folks at the University of Kent. They will be able to give you reliable answers, instead of the opinion of a random stranger on the internet.</p>

<p>But this random stranger would guess that you are already doing very well with all of your “4” scores on AP tests. I think perhaps having four "4"s already may qualify you for the University of Kent, at least in SOME subject.</p>

<p>The concept of a GPA is a little alien to the UK (although someone in college admissions will have probably heard of it from other applicants from the USA). But the fact that you have never gotten anything below an “A”, and that you graduated at the top of your class will both be clearly understood.</p>

<p>Talk about the classes you have taken if they relate to the subject you are apllying for. I don’t see any point in trying to convince the University of Kent that you are someone who takes hard subjects just for the sake of taking hard subjects, this will not impress them. They are looking for applicants who are committed to the subject they are applying for, and your personal statement should reflect this.</p>

<p>I would imagine that there is much more interest in Archaeology in the UK than there is in the US–but that is just a guess. The British seem to take their museums of archaelogical treasures (such as the British Museum) very seriously. British people in general seem to be much more connected to their history and prehistory than Americans are. Remember that civilization (eg cities, writing) was brought to Britain by the Romans almost 2000 years ago, long before civilization came to America, which some might say leads to more interesting archaeological discoveries within Britain itself. (At least I find British archaeology more interesting than American archaeology)</p>

<p>I’m a little concerned that the University of Kent seems to combine Archaeology with Classical Studies. I think that’s going to mean that a lot of the other applicants, from the UK particularly, will already have studied Latin and Greek extensively, and this may give them an advantage over you. Do you have any Latin or Greek? Is there an AP test in Latin or Greek? You don’t seem to have any foreign language apart from your 2 in Spanish, which doesn’t look very good.</p>

<p>And I don’t think you should expect that you are going to be given a “bonus” merely because they will be able to charge you more tuition for being a foreign student. On the other hand, the University of Kent is now an international University, with campuses on the continent as well as in Britain, and something like a quarter of their student body are foriegn students.</p>

<p>KEVP</p>

3

<p>I don’t have any background in Latin or Greek, sadly, my school only teaches Spanish, French, and ASL. I took three years of Spanish up to College Spanish 101-102, but it wasn’t geared towards an AP test, which is why I didn’t pass it. I took it on my own. So, should I even report the 2 in Spanish AP?</p>

<p>Also, I will email the university to get answers to some of these questiongs (thanks for the advice), but do you have any opinions as to what SAT subject tests I should take (i.e. world history, lit, math 2, chemistry?)</p>

4

<p>1) What SAT subject tests should I take? I am going to be a senior and have the chance to take three. I was thinking Math 2 and Literature, or should I go for a history/science course instead?
**Try to pick subjects that are as closely related to your subject as possible. In your case, history would be a good option, along with languages such as Latin or Ancient Greek. **</p>

<p>2) My SAT score was 1990, 630 reading, 670 math, 690 writing. Is this good enough to get in? They don’t accept ACTs.
**Have you contacted the university to get their opinion? They will be willing to give advice to those with international qualifications, such as yourself. **</p>

<p>3) Also, I have a 4.0 GPA (my school doesn’t have weighted GPAs) and have never gotten anything but an A in a class. Should I mention this in my personal statement even though it doesn’t have much weight for acceptance? And my class rank, 1 out of 580?
**This is something that your referee should mention in your reference, if you can’t fit it into the qualifications section of the UCAS form. Your personal statement should be concentrated on why you want to study the subject, with an absolute maximum of 30% spent on any extra curriculars (which will, ideally, be relevant to your subject). **</p>

<p>4) I have taken 5 AP tests, Spanish, I got a 2 (should I even report this???) and Euro History, US History, Eng Lit, Eng Lang all 4s. I am taking Calc AB, Psych, Environmental Science, and US Gov and Politics next year. Is this enough if I pass all of them, which I am pretty sure I will?
**You must declare all exams taken, no matter what the grade is. Failure to do so could be regarded as fraud and result in your offer being withdrawn. **</p>

<p>5) Also, I know that there is no place to put a HS transcipt on UCAS, but if the university is interested in you, will they ask for it? Or should I mention in my Personal Statement the hard classes I have taken?
**Again, this is something for your referee to mention. **</p>

<p>6) In the US, archaeology is a pretty small field, is it the same in the UK, so less people apply for that major? Does that mean there is a greater chance I will get in?</p>

<p>7) Lastly, as an international student, is it easier to get into college in the UK because of the higher tuition rates we have to pay or the need for diversity on campus? Or are we subject to the same qualifications as UK students?
**It’s a bit easier for two reasons

  • you pay higher fees than UK students
  • the government places a cap on the number of places the university is allowed to offer to UK / EU students, but international students are not capped (because the government isn’t funding them!)</p>

<p>They generally have very little interest in diversity (although they have come under political pressure to admit more UK students from poor backgrounds) - being an American will not help you per se. </p>

<p>I suspect you need to brush up a little on what needs to go in a personal statement. The Student Room (sorry, it won’t let me link to it) has lots of useful info, including a wiki specifically on personal statements, and a personal statement help service :slight_smile: **</p>

5

<p>Actually so few people study Latin and Greek at (high) school in the UK anymore that Classics at Oxbridge is now a 4 years course with intensive Latin and Greek offered in the first year (most undergraduate courses are 3 years in the UK). So I’d be very surprised if they didn’t teach Latin and Greek from scratch if it’s necessary at uni of Kent. They probably just require A-level Classical Civilisation, for which no Latin or Greek is required to pass, for UK applicants. This is more like a history course. Do you know any non-US history, specifically the history of the classical world?</p>

6

<p>I’m now curious to know what area and period of Archaeology Naheem is interested in. Having only English and not-very-good Spanish is not going to be very helpful for an aspiring Archaeologist.</p>

<p>Even if he goes to a school that doesn’t offer many languages, he still should probably demonstrate he has the POTENTIAL to learn foreign languages, which I don’t think he has done.</p>

<p>Where does his interest in Archaeology come from? (Do you know you don’t REALLY get to use a whip, like Indiana Jones?) Maybe he should be considering a different subject?</p>

<p>But I could be completely wrong.</p>

<p>KEVP</p>

7

<p>To KEVP - </p>

<p>Ancient Egypt and Classical Roman history are the periods I would love to study. Believe me, if my school taught Arabic or Latin I would have taken it. The ONLY reason I didn’t pass Spanish was because my class was geared towards an actual college course, not a high school course to take a test for college credit. There is a huge difference. I got an A in College Spanish 101-102, which believe me, is hard to get in that class. I am actually quite good at Spanish, just not at taking the Spanish AP test because we didn’t have practice.</p>

<p>I love languages, they interest me and I am a quick learner, and I will take Ancient Greek and Latin courses at University of Kent (which they have), assuming I get in. I also have a reference from my College Spanish teacher saying I am one of the best students he has had, even though I didn’t pass the AP test.</p>

<p>And yes, I do know that you don’t use a whip (sarcasm is not becoming, by the way). I am interested because I love history of human culture and understanding how we have evolved over thousands of years. Archaeology is not an easy or clean job, but I want to do it. I have been volunteering at various digs, spent many hours at museums, visited Roman cities in Italy, done research projects on ancient civilization, and read multiple books on ancient cultures since I was little. THAT is where my interest stems from, not Indiana Jones. So, I assure you, I am completely devoted to my subject, and will not change no matter where I go to university.</p>

<p>Cupcake -
I took AP Euro history which covers all Euro history from the time of William the Conquerer to present (give or take a few years). Actual AP tests covering the classical world, there are none, but I know a lot if UK schools consider facts and history I have learned from books, Archaeology magazines, and museums/lectures. If I can put this in my PS, then they will be able to see that I know a good deal.</p>

8

<p>I don’t know anything about Kent, but you certainly do not need to know Latin for the subject you’re interested in. Oxford and UCL (arguably the two best places in the UK to study Classics, Archaeology and Egyptology) do not require any knowledge of ancient languages; they teach you that on the course. If those universities do not require it, I doubt Kent will.</p>

<p>OP: Why are you so interested in Kent? Sure, apply to Kent but you should aim higher in my opinion.</p>

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<p>Thanks for the advice. I am applying to Kent because I feel as if it is a great fit for me. I would love the opportunity to go to Oxford or UCL, but I am aiming to go to those school for grad school. Start lower and work my way up. </p>

<p>Kent’s archaeology program is great as well, it has a lot of the classes I want to take and gives more chances to go on actual digs and research opportunities than schools here in the U.S. And I can actually afford it, always a plus.</p>

10

<p>“I took AP Euro history which covers all Euro history from the time of William the Conquerer to present (give or take a few years).”</p>

<p>OP, I’m sure you didn’t mean it to come across this way, but this made me laugh! Please don’t write anything in your personal statement that suggests you know <em>all European history</em> from William the Conqueror onwards!</p>

11

<p>Do be sure to talk about your passion for archeology and all the archeology-related work you have done in your personal statement, so they will definitely see that you are not just some guy who’s into whips. Before you told us that, we certainly had no way of knowing how interested you were in archeology, but now we do.</p>

<p>I really have a friend who used to say “Maybe I should go back to college and get a degree in archeology. I’ve got my own whip!” (He was joking).</p>

<p>I am concerned about your lack of languages, but maybe that’s not important. I don’t think realistically you can expect the admissions folks at the University of Kent to believe your claims to be good at Spanish or to be someone who learns languages quickly when your only grade on a language AP test is a “2”. You will not be able to make up for this by getting a teacher to write you a nice letter. Your only hope is if Kent seriously says they don’t need any languages for their program.</p>

<p>KEVP</p>

12

<p>Laylah - totally didn’t mean it that way. I just meant that the test covered all Euro history from William the Conquerer on, not that I know it all. Believe me, I wish I did. That would make my life a whole lot easier.</p>

<p>KEVP - Will do. They do not say anything is needed for languages, and the college international administrator said build up English, math, and history most to have the best chances to get accepted. </p>

<p>Tell your friend that it takes a lot more than a whip to be an archaeologist. He definitely needs to know how to outrun booby traps in tombs, defeat aliens, and kill some crazy Nazis as well. All part of the job.</p>

13

<p>Don’t worry Naheem, I got it :slight_smile: It was just the phrasing I thought was funny!</p>

<p>But as an aside, the AP course won’t have covered all European history from William onwards. It will have given you a very brief overview into a small number of events during a limited period of European history. </p>

<p>I am a mentor for students applying to Oxford. If one of my students told me they’d done a course that covered all European history from William the Conqueror onwards, it would be like a red flag to a bull. For a start, what’s the definition of Europe? Who defined it and what was their motivation for doing so? What’s <em>your</em> definition of Europe? What’s history, and specifically what’s European history? Etc.</p>

<p>I know you’re not applying to Oxford, but don’t forget that your Personal Statement will be read by people who have probably spent the last 30 years researching a few aspects of archaeology and history. They are not going to be persuaded that you took a 1 year course that covered all of European history.</p>

<p>Lecture over ;)</p>

14

<p>Laylah, Naheem said he earned a score of “4” on the AP test for European History.</p>

<p>I think this would be equivalent to a “B” on a British “A”-level History exam. “A”-levels are just like AP tests, they don’t give different tests that break the subject of “History” down. At “A” level you could take “History” or “Ancient History” (or even “Art History”).</p>

<p>So for this particular case, the British system is the same as the American.</p>

<p>Getting a “4” on the European History AP test does NOT mean that he spent only one year studying History, it represents the same level of study and effort as a “B” on an A-level History exam represents. In other words, the culmination of a LONG period of study, probably starting in childhood.</p>

<p>KEVP</p>

15

<p>That’s all fine, KEVP. I’m sure he worked extremely hard, as do all students who get good scores whether on APs or A-levels. Perhaps his AP course was the culmination of 10-15 years of study.</p>

<p>But Naheem is saying he took a test (and so presumably a class/classes) that covered all of European history since William the Conqueror. That is, the history of dozens of states for the last 1000-ish years. </p>

<p>I’m not saying that Naheem is not intelligent or that he didn’t work hard or that AP courses are not rigorous. I am saying that there is no way he took a class/classes that can have covered <em>all of the history of the last 1000 years of events in Europe</em>.</p>

<p>What he studied was, like A-Level History, a small selection of key events in a small group of countries over that time period. And that’s just fine, it’s what you’d expect. But it’s a totally different thing.</p>

16

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<p>APs are not comparable to A levels and a 4 is certainly not comparable to a grade B - what gave you that idea? A level history courses are nowhere near as broad as the AP; a student might spend an entire two years studying just two or three areas e.g. the industrial revolution, Imperial Russia or Chartism.</p>

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<p>In that case, what “A” level grade would a “4” on an AP test be equivalent to? A “C”? Less than a “C”? What?</p>

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<p>It did say on the University of Kent website that a 4 on an AP test basically is a “B” on an A level test. Maybe this is not true for all universities, but it is for U of Kent.</p>