<p>Well said, M94!</p>
<p>ExieMITalum: you said your student was disappointed to not find people at bs gifted as her? And only found hard-workers? I’m convinced that those are the only people that get anywhere-hardworkers, no matter how gifted they are. This makes them even more qualified for bs, having to be challenged and overcoming those obstacles with an unfathomable determination. Maybe I didn’t understand what you were saying, but I was surprised that it was odd to have that kind of person at a boarding school. Did you mean that they were behind and always having to catch up?</p>
<p>I’ve been trying to stay away from the fireworks here, but I do think this statement of Exie’s (“One quote from a recent student at a HADES school ‘I thought I’d find kids like me but instead I just found kids that worked all the time to keep up. It’s a grind.’”) is pretty insulting to kids who continue to attend those schools. She does point out that it’s not everyone’s experience but the “I just found kids…” statement paints the entire student body with the same brush (this quote and the one in her earlier post say, in effect, “Those HADES kids are all average schmoes who just “grind” unhappily away at their studies to make themselves appear smarter than they really are.” )</p>
<p>In fact, from what I’ve seen, most HADES students work very hard, and complain about the work whenever they can, and nonetheless are smart enough to fully appreciate the challenge they are offered. Some of those kids feel at home for the first time at school precisely because they’re actually respected rather than mocked when they say something intelligent, in or out of class. To me, the quote from Exie’s ex-HADES student is a return to that mocking attitude.</p>
<p>And, lest ifax accuse me of going off-topic, all of this is really just to say…While I agree it’s all about fit, and that other schools can also provide challenge, etc, those top tier schools ARE the right fit for the right kind of student, and they offer unique opportunities, and, OP, judging from your description of yourself I think you might consider adding a few more to your list. How about SPS, Groton, Exeter, Andover? All have solid music programs and excellent, challenging academics.</p>
<p>@Classicalmama you’ve known me long enough to know that is not what I meant and certainly if I thought that I wouldn’t interview or recruit for them. So why even go there? Really.</p>
<p>People need to look at the process realistically - especially young students about to make an extremely important decision about their next years of high school.</p>
<p>We have SOOO many students on this board who are chasing dreams pretty much created by adults based on stats and ratings and (fill in the other intangible blanks). We have them convinced that every student getting into HADES is some superhero nerd with amazing stats and out of this world credentials. Then they get there and find out these are normal, smart kids who work hard. No magic. No mystique. Just hard work and perseverance. Or worse, we’ve created a frenzy of applicants who are about to be rejected come March 10 (the vast majority in fact) and then we spend months managing the disappointment, the feelings of failure and the inevitable “someone took my spot because of a hook” rants. All because the students didn’t bother to consider a broad range of options only schools within the same range.</p>
<p>Schools are “better” when they’re a good fit. Not because someone else liked it, graduated from it, or had a good experience. It’s not a one size fits all scenario. </p>
<p>But when I try to say that, then I get bricks thrown at me as if I have “insulted” some vast group or the kid of a parent who happens to attend the same school.</p>
<p>What really burns me is that people throw bricks at any school that is not HADES and don’t bother to read far enough to know that I am talking about some of the students burning out, dropping out, or being counseled for suicidal tendencies because they’re trying to live up to an image.</p>
<p>Hence - a kid who went to the school thinking he’d meet a school filled with super genius nerds and discovering they’re just normal smart kids who work hard. That’s not an insult to the kids who are there, but it does say that applicants need to manage their expectation.</p>
<p>Although - if you do remember, we also spent a lot of time counseling a kid last year whose father asked her to forgo humanities and double up on AP science courses in her first year so she’d get into a good school.</p>
<p>So good grief. We need to try to give this original poster some perspective. Even with good stats his chances of admissions is low given the pool unless he stands out in some way beyond grades and test scores. Hence - apply to a wide range, love the school that loves you. Don’t apply to any school you wouldn’t be happy attending if you don’t get your first choice.</p>
<p>@baystate: Good for you for having a good college experience but @823491’s comment is still valid. Based on past and recent conversations with parents and students who entered thinking BS would make them “IVY eligible” there does seem to be a trend about college advisors “steering” certain populations of high performing students towards non IVY colleges. I had the same experience and ignored it so I’m saddened by not surprised to see not much has changed. Glad your situation was better. That doesn’t mean it is not happening to others.</p>
<p>WillemS,</p>
<p>Classicalmama has given you good advice. With your high scores and A range grades, you should consider adding more reach schools to your list. Of course, you should manage your expectations because getting into top prep schools is a reach for everyone. But don’t give up on your dreams either. As Wayne Gretzky said, one hundred percent of the shots you don’t take will never be goals.</p>
<p>According to an article in the Brown Daily Herald about Jim Miller, the dean of admissions at Brown, top prep schools such as “Andover, Exeter, and Milton” do well in college admission because they have “global reputations” that attract “exceptional students … from all corners of the world.” [Top</a> high schools find admissions success - The Brown Daily Herald - Serving the community daily since 1891](<a href=“http://www.browndailyherald.com/top-high-schools-find-admissions-success-1.2553620#.Ttjz87KVrUA]Top”>http://www.browndailyherald.com/top-high-schools-find-admissions-success-1.2553620#.Ttjz87KVrUA). Andover, for example, regularly sends about 1/3rd of its graduating class to the Ivies, MIT, and Stanford. Equally as important, 61.8% of its students attend Top 25 National Universities and Top 15 Liberal Arts Colleges, and an additional 17.4 percent matriculate to Top 50 National Universities and Top 30 Liberal Arts Colleges. [Boarding</a> School Stats : Matriculation Stats](<a href=“http://matriculationstats.org/boarding-school-stats]Boarding”>http://matriculationstats.org/boarding-school-stats)</p>
<p>Going to a top prep school does not guarantee admission to a top college. Most top colleges had record low admission rates last year. So, college counseling officers are prudently encouraging even top students to consider a wide range of options. But this has nothing to do with the economic status of applicants. Both for their students and themselves, all prep schools want to send as many of their students as possible to leading colleges. </p>
<p>There is always the possibility that attending prep school will decrease your chances of college admission. You simply have to balance that risk against the benefit of attending prep school and see where the scale falls for you. In doing so, however, don’t automatically assume that you will be a small fish in a large pond at prep school. There is no caste system at prep schools. Everyone has an equal opportunity to work hard, show passion, and excel.</p>
<p>At the end of this long and winding admission process, you will hopefully like the schools that like you. At this point, however, you should be open to all possibilities. One or more of the schools that like you on March 10 may be top prep schools. But you will never know unless you first apply to a wide range of schools.</p>
<p>Good luck!</p>
<p>That’s why I wrote “In my experience…” When I am trying to help students, online and in real life, I always stress that this (whatever) is what my family found to be true…your experience may be different.</p>
<p>Exie,</p>
<p>I do know you well enough to know what you meant, and that you’re just pointing out that kids need to broaden their search. that good schools come in all shapes and sizes, etc. I was just concerned about how other , newer posters, might read your words–particularly since the poster didn’t have the usual pile of “brand-name” schools that would have warranted your usual good advice to broaden the search. </p>
<p>It looked to me like Willem was already picking a broad range of schools and could, in fact, add some more reach/highly selective schools into the mix. I just didn’t want him scared off from making that choice should he so choose. </p>
<p>I could probably have worded things differently, however.</p>
<p>Point taken. Maybe the students coming here will finally get past perceived “prestige” to realize - for the most part - most of the BS’s (regardless of ranking) are pretty good compared to where many students are starting from.</p>
<p>Willem’s visiting and researching a range of schools, which is a good tactic for any applicant. </p>
<p>Willem, have you thought of Deerfield? If you’re looking at Hotchkiss and Choate, I’d think Deerfield would not be too far away from your home? And what about Kent or Northfield Mount Hermon? You should be able to see yourself attending any school you apply to. Don’t apply to a school you don’t like.</p>
<p>For my own purposes, I think of the acronym schools as “fetish schools”. They ARE great schools, but not all of the fetishistic behavior lauding them retains an appropriate degree of caveat emptor (let the buyer beware). If all the illustrious fetish grads of the past (mea culpa) have led us to this…perhaps we all need to be reconsidering the curriculum? This has been my perspective. I’m grateful to my fetish schools for the intellectual training; decades latter I still have to deflect both the scorn and adoration that people attach to me in terms of relationship to the fetish school “pedigree,” but after a number of years I’ve found my way outside of a fetishized world and find that I like the wide open spaces very much. For some, fetish schools will represent their life’s zenith; they will live the rest of their lives looking back at the brief 8 year window of high school and college as their halcyon days; for others, the journey unfolds one day at a time, and each new day brings its own challenges, pleasures, and lessons.</p>
<p>WillemS, you sure started a lively debate 
As an “outsider” - a parent who is not as immersed in the nuances of the east coast elite – I’d like to offer an additional variable to what seems to be a status-oriented thread. To a large degree, fit depends on where you are from, not just where you want to go. SSAT scores probably provide the only information on a student’s rank that can be applied across geographic, socioeconomic and social backgrounds that is predictive. Grades vary too much from school to school and region to region. An “A” student from Podunk is usually not the same as an “A’” student from a Dalton. If you are coming from an urban private or very good public school system you will be better prepared for a top tier school. I can say with some certainty that 99.999 % of kids from my geographic area (rural west) would be overwhelmed by a top tier school – even kids with “fetish”-school level SSAT scores. If you feel you are prepared to compete with the best prepared kids in the country or world, then go for the reach schools. But if you think it will be culture shock, by all means consider a school where you will feel comfortable. That is when you will shine. Of course, there is no replacement, here or anywhere, for visits when classes are in session. All we can do here is some very emotional speculating apparently.</p>
<p>Ah, I have reservations about referring to schools as “fetish schools.” </p>
<p>How about “trophy schools?”</p>
<p>teenagers ought to apply where there parents judge best. the parents know the child and what is best for him better than strangers on the internet. parents driving the process will have the best result possible.</p>
<p>^^Since, if successful, the process will end with said teen spending fewer nights under your roof than somewhere else, it should <em>at least</em> be a conversational process. Boarding school attendance marks a major transition out of childhood and into young adulthood. If your best judgement and your child’s opinions differ, this is a critical opportunity to discuss and learn from each other’s perspectives. Don’t miss it!</p>
<p>yes, a conversation with one’s parents, in which all perspectives are shared and discussed. peicandad has expressed this well! posters on this board frequently bog down with banter about “fit” and “tiers” and “hidden gems”. The actual applicant is an individual who’s social and educational needs are best understood by his parents.</p>
<p>Thank you all for your replies! I’m sorry I can’t respond to all of you personally, but as I’m sure you can see I’ve had an overwhelming number of responses! I would like to assure you all that fit is a huge factor in my choice. The fact is that of all the schools I have visited so far (Taft, The Gunnery, Loomis, Kingswood-Oxford, and Chase Collegiate) the only one that I didn’t like at all is Chase. I’m a very adaptive person (I was home-schooled through 6th grade and came to public school for 7th and 8th so I had to adapt!) and I believe that I will be comfortable at most of the schools I’m looking at. Sadly, I don’t believe that I will be looking at Choate, Exeter, or Andover. I wanted to look at these schools, but it did not seem to be working out. At the moment, the schools I seem to be applying to are Taft, Loomis, St. George’s, The Gunnery, Lawrenceville, and Berkshire. I have been told that Taft is the hardest to get into out of all of these. Loomis is almost a definite in because two of my siblings are applying there with me, and are both being scouted for sports reasons. Rest assured that all of my choices are being debated with my family! Thanks to all of you who are discussing the “top-tier vs. lower tier” issue, you all have some good information. There seem to be some of you who have children at the aforementioned schools. If you could share some of their experiences with me at these schools I would greatly appreciate it! Thank you all again!</p>
<p>@tetus - Maybe. But not always. The happiest families are ones where there is collaboration. But I’ve also seen the flip side where parents made the decision (in isolation) on where to send the child and it’s not worked out well. We referred to those students at “warehoused.” Some adjust, others do not and don’t fare well.</p>
<p>The students who seem to enter the culture easiest are often the ones who are full partners in the search. The ones who interview best are the ones who - the family having made the decision - step up and take the lead.</p>
<p>Willem - surprised you took Exeter and Andover off the list. Don’t let us dissuade you with our raucous debates here. Despite their history and proximity, Exeter and Andover’s cultures are different from one another.</p>
<p>Good luck, though! You seem like you have a good head on your shoulders. Our family had lively debates about schools too. It made the process easier with everyone feeling like they got their “opinions” in even though D made the final decision on where to apply and which offer to take.</p>
<p>Exie- Quite frankly I did want to apply to Andover, Exeter, and also Choate. I have raised the issue with my parents several times, but if I were to board, my two siblings would need to apply to these schools as well (hence I am applying as a boarder to Loomis, St. George’s, Lawrenceville, and Berkeshire). the schools I mentioned above are very competitive, and my parents and my siblings believe that the rest of my family would have a tough time getting admitted. As a result, we have decided not to apply to those schools since we would not be able to afford them unless I was given a large amount of financial aid, which would not be likely unless all my siblings had been accepted there.</p>
<p>Willem,</p>
<p>I’m not sure that’s true. Schools will take into consideration the cost of tuition at all of the schools siblings attend, not just their own. And Andover and Exeter (no experience with Choate) are typically among the most generous schools for FA and have tuition rates that are lower than average. Unless your parents are calculating in other costs like travel, I don’t know that they’d necessarily save by having all three of you go to the same school. I think the schools base aid on the PFS and their own formulas, which take into consideration the tuition paid out for all students at their various schools. </p>
<p>I’m curious, though, to know if anyone has any direct experience with this as we may be in this boat ourselves in a few years.</p>