Advice sought: GED and college admissions

Parents Forum
1

A friend of mine has a depressed, anxious son currently a junior in college. The boy is brilliant, excels in school when he’s able to do the work. He’s recently had some anxiety-related health problems – missed a lot of school – he dreads going back even though academically he can do the work, but may not be psychologically ready. His parents share that worry. Local online schools are full, they’re not taking more kids this year, same with some of the “alternative” options.

My friend’s wife is considering the GED route, my friend is very ambivalent. He himself went through a similar crisis as a young man, but eventually overcame/learned to deal with his issues. He thinks his son, with time, can also eventually find a combination of treatment/meds/that will help… but worries the GED will be an obstacle in eventual college admissions, anything beyond our state U, which my friend thinks is too big, and too much of a party school.

What do you think, CC friends? Is a GED and some time off a barrier to the more respected LACs (say, Macalester or Reed) assuming high SAT scores/decent high school grades? Any experience with GED’ers applying to more selective schools?

TIA

2

Is there a mistake in your post. It says your friend’s son is currently a junior in college. Do you mean high school?

3

There is still some stigmatization of GED graduates not only among some colleges/universities. A few HS classmates who were considering dropping out to go the GED route were strongly discouraged from doing so by their GCs as doing so will give the impression to the respectable/elite colleges that they were “taking the easy way out” academically and thus, assess their HS stats accordingly.

Also, I tutored some students who were taking the GED and recalled the coverage of the HS curriculum only covered the equivalent of 10th grade in the NY state curriculum in math.

This isn’t limited to respectable/elite colleges/universities as the US Armed Forces also regards GED holders dubiously due to perceptions the academic curriculum is heavily watered down compared with a regular average US HS diploma, but also perceptions GED holders don’t the ability to “stick with the program” reliably.

The last was the reasoning a former colleague who was a former US Army recruiter and drill sergeant recounted as the reason why each branch of the US Armed Forces has strict maximum quotas* for GED holders seeking to join as enlisted personnel. One way to get around that quota is to enroll at a community college and accumulate 15 credits before enlisting.

  • Ranges from a max of 10% downwards.

https://www.thebalance.com/i-have-a-ged-am-i-eligible-to-join-the-military-3354077

4

Curious, but what makes you believe this student will be successful in college. The environment in college is such that the student is on his own more than in high school. I would think that college could be a disaster for this kid.

Don’t run to a GED program as a crutch. Fix his anxiety problems such that he can function as an adult. Then a regular high school program won’t be an issue and the concern about the GED program goes away.

5

@cobrat - thank you This is exactly the kind of information I was looking for.

@jonri - yes! The boy is in high school… that’s a typo but it’s too late to edit.

6

GED usually means community college which can be a stepping stone to a university

7

There are plenty of four year colleges where GED students are accepted.

8

@thumper1, even the more selective ones? Again, the issue isn’t colleges in general but the more selective, smaller schoolls. Do you know of any that have accepted GED kids?

@HPuck35 this child’s father thinks so partly based on his own experience.

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“This isn’t limited to respectable/elite colleges/universities as the US Armed Forces also regards GED holders dubiously due to perceptions the academic curriculum is heavily watered down compared with a regular average US HS diploma, but also perceptions GED holders don’t the ability to “stick with the program” reliably.”

I would love to see the actual evidence for this. I don’t believe it’s true for either college/universities, or the military. The armed forces have a terrible recruiting problem right now just to find recruits whose BMI is in range and do not have a criminal record. Plus pass a drug test- a perfect storm for our country.

@Cobrat, Please cite a source- a credible source- from the last three years. I’m calling hogwash on this.

OP- GED is a perfectly respectable way for a kid who does not “fit the mold” for whatever reason to get a HS diploma. In my neck of the woods I know a lot of kids who end up with a GED- talented musicians, dancers, actors for example- whose touring schedule did not allow for a conventional HS education. Yes- you have teenagers and young adults in prison who are getting a GED but you also have a lot of exceptional kids for whom HS does not work, where both parents need to be employed (i.e. no home schooling) to make ends meet.

10

A GED is fine for many colleges, but it helps to have something interesting in your application, as blossom implied: dancers and musicians get GED’s because of their commitment and passion, and several colleges have told us they love such “outliers.”

Getting a GED for high school without something like that can still be fine. I know one young man who was depressed, left school, got his GED, and spent some time with National Outdoor Leadership School and then got into college and thrived. I know another who WOOF’ed in Europe and then went to college in better shape. Service can be good too. One kid I know got his pilot’s license.

Some of the kids I know who get GED’s are the creative types who have less patience with high school. They are independent thinkers. And the kids with mental health challenges can be in this creative group as well.

I will say that it can be tough applying for even low level jobs and having to check the box whether graduate or GED. For that reason, I would also suggest looking into North Atlantic Regional High School, which grants diplomas that are legit but have less requirements than some high schools. http://www.narhs.com/ Colleges seem to view this as perfectly fine, and a transcript is provided to be included with the regular high school transcript.

Many kids I know or know of develop a mental health issue in junior or senior year and end up doing fine at college. I object to the attitude that this kid does not belong there or is somehow doomed to fail. Some of the anxieties are school-related, yes, but might be particularly related to pressure about doing well and admissions. Social media can be a factor. Many kids are “a mess” in later high school, get treatment, learn self-management and do fine.

I would also look into community college or community college online courses for the young person while at home, taken as dual enrollment. Other ideas: Virtual High School is a great outfit with a lot of courses online, and Aventa Learning is another one (google educere).

If this young person does not get on the 4 year residential conveyor belt, so to speak, there are many ways to do college (extension, continuing ed, adult learner, low residence, one class at a time in a regular program etc.). And a few paths for training for a trade, though there should be more.

With medication, therapy, and experience, this young person should be fine. He could take time out from school and return to finish, or do a GED or do a diploma. One caution is that if you do a GED and then want to return to high school for a diploma, it is at the principle’s discretion and he or she might say no.

Good luck to him!

11

@blossom, @compmom – your advice is very much appreciated, thank you.

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PM me if you would like to “talk” more.

13

My 19 year old son has taken two of the four GED subtests, and will soon sit for the final two. He was adopted internationally at age 16, and the traditional American high school route just wasn’t going to work for him.

About 2-3 years ago, GED changed the format of their tests. They are MUCH more difficult than they used to be. In fact, it was soon discovered that GED graduates were outperforming traditional HS graduates in college, so GED quickly lowered the passing score for each subtest. If you make a higher cutoff, you are now eligible for college credit at some institutions.

More anecdotally, my D18, who took the APUSH exam last year and is currently taking five AP classes, occasionally looks over her brother’s practice GED tests and claims they are just as difficult as her AP tests.

The stigma for the “easier” GED route may still remain, but that does not seem to be the reality anymore.

14

@katliamom

First…why are you asking about elite colleges? Is this student only willing to consider elite colleges?

Second…contact the colleges directly with your question. I’m not sure I see the difference between a GED and being homeschooled (some homeschoolers do not use purchased curricula).

15

The Common Data Set for each school states if they accept a GED. Of course they don’t state if it puts the applicant at a disadvantage.

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@thumper, to be clear I am not involved – this is on behalf of friends. The dad feels his son, a highly gifted and highly intellectual young man, would do better in smaller, more selective schools. The issue is whether a GED would make him less competitive for those schools.

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@blossom

That’s not what I’ve been reading/hearing from friends who are still serving in the armed forces. If anything, the military drawdown combined with the post-2008 economy has meant they don’t have a shortage of recruits as shown below.

http://money.cnn.com/2013/05/15/news/economy/military-recruiting/

The article I cited in my previous post was written by a retired USAF NCO who operates a site dedicated to providing information for prospective enlistees. The article states the maximum enlistment quotas for those who only possess a GED is 10% in the Army and lower for the other services. In the USAF, it’s as low as 1%. Moreover, GED holders who hope to be included in that strict quota must have higher ASVAB scores and other positive metrics above those of their regular HS counterparts to have a chance to be included.

One way around this is for the GED holder to attend a CC and accumulate 15 credits before enlistment.

All of this was confirmed by the ex-colleague who served as an Army recruiter and drill sergeant during periods when enlistment standards were relaxed due to increasing manpower requirements. With the current drawdown, those standards are being hiked.

18

We have a program in my state where students who are smart, but don’t “fit the mold” can get a referral to go to community college instead of the last year of HS. They wind up with some college credit plus a GED, I believe (not sure if it’s GED or HS diploma). A friend’s kid went this route & was much more successful in this program than in HS. His healthy curiosity was viewed as engagement with the material in CC rather than opposition to the teacher in HS.

Not sure if something like that is available in your state, but it was a real lifesaver for my friend’s kid! He wound up going to a LAC that had a program he liked, and a decent reputation, but it’s not a highly-selective school.

19

“The dad feels his son, a highly gifted and highly intellectual young man, would do better in smaller, more selective schools. The issue is whether a GED would make him less competitive for those schools.”

Yes, leaving high school early and getting a GED will make him less competitive for selective schools. As you may know, I have a GED (although I was enrolled in high school for four years), worked for two years, then went to Bryn Mawr and Harvard. I work with lots of bright kids who aren’t doing well in high school. PM me if you’d like my contact info for your friend.

20

What kind of high school is he enrolled in now? If it is a public school, given his serious health issues he may be eligible for home and hospital services. Your friend should check with the disabilities office at his school. Those types of services would make it possible for him to finish his coursework at home with supervision from the school district rather than going the home school or dual enrollment route.