<p>Programs like JSA, Stanford National Forensic Institute and even NYLF are not scams. NYLF gets a bad rap simply because of the way that it markets itself to students, but as long as students get value out of it, more power to NYLF.</p>
<p>As long as students and families are satisfied with the return on their inve$tment, these programs are not scams, just expensive (too expensive for most of us) ventures that we others may not have an interest in.</p>
<p>I've done a few summer programs, mostly science related.</p>
<p>I've paid for two science programs. One was a 3 week selective science day camp ~$800 at SUNY-Stony Brook the summer before 8th grade. It was mostly focused around forensics -- my favorite part was our second to last day, spent entirely on a "murder mystery" about who killed our instructor-- but we did a little bit of everything. While there, two of the campers mentioned CTY, so I did that the summer before my freshman year. It was really expensive ~$3000, but a worthwhile experience. I did the Fast Paced Bio class, and I think I got more of the social aspect than the academics. I changed a lot that summer for the better because of being around different people. (I had never been away from home without my parents before.)</p>
<p>Last summer, I attended the Howard Hughes Medical Institute Summer Program at SUNY-SB, which I found through my science coordinator. It was a selective 4 week program, room and board completely free (all you had to do was go home on Friday and come back to campus Sunday evening) and we had $75/week for meals. At the end of the program we received a $300 stipend. We basically surveyed lab techniques for two weeks, and then worked on our own research projects for the rest of the program. On our free time, we were able to use the campus facilities, and we attended scheduled lectures by notable professors. HHMI was targeted towards minorities and special needs districts, and our "sister program", Biotechnology, was essentially the same thing. The only differences were instructors and the fact that they had to pay about $2000. </p>
<p>Comparing CTY and HHMI, I got so much out of both programs, academically and socially. Personally, I liked HHMI better because I felt so much closer to my classmates than at CTY. At CTY, we tended to be very clique-y (our hall divided itself into four groups), but at HHMI we all sat together at meals for the whole program, not just the first day. So if I had to choose one to repeat, I'd pick HHMI.</p>
<p>I've also attended the George Parks Drum Major Academy -- which was a great program, I'll admit, but expensive. Due to a scheduling conflict, I attended DMA instead of the FJM clinic (where the rest of the officers went). Their camp was 5 days and about $100 less than mine; DMA was a 4 day program, but because of HHMI, I had to leave in the beginning of the third day. So I didn't really get my money's worth, but I do think going to DMA instead of FJM really helped my conducting -- the style they teach fits in better with our school's. So in that case, I think paying more was worth it.</p>
<p>It really depends on how you take advantage of resources.</p>
<p>I could not find your site?????</p>
<p>I need more info...</p>
<p>
[quote]
I can't decide if the NYLC was a so called scam because I got a full scholarship to it. does that make it more legit?
[/quote]
Nope, it just means that the students who paid full price paid your way as well...</p>
<p>i wish i had the money to go to any of these programs</p>
<p>SIG- is pretty awesome</p>
<p>P2P isn't a scam but they do over-reach when they speak of being 'nominated" for an "ambassadorship" and how you must survive the "interview process". Basically if you're a good student with a valid passport and a bunch of cash and want an overseas vaca WITHOUT YOUR PARENTS, this is the opportunity for you! My 2 kids have gone and had AWESOME experiences. One returned to Europe for a work/study program which directly led to a great job in DC. The other wants to go back to Australia for her Jr year. Overseas travel of ANY kind adds a little luster to a student's resume & shows a willingness to travel outside of his/her comfort zone. And that's not a bad thing at all.</p>
<p>I do summer programs at colleges. These represent two instances of the OP being wrong.</p>
<p>1) Cornell U's--this is primarily for money I'll admit, but is stunted by the fact that . . .
-the instruction is wonderful (from actual professors there with insane credentials)
-they give you college credit
-they allow you to 'network'
-they consider it demonstrated interest if you attended a summer program</p>
<p>2) Stanford's debate camp (also good for money, but . . . )
-the instruction is nationally ranked
-they give you thousands of pages of evidence to take back to your school
-you learn to be a nationally competitive debater
-It's policy debate (actually, they have LD, too, but policy debate is the shiznit by far)</p>
<p>Both also give you free food at their eating areas, and considering Cornell ranks nationally in food, that's a pretty sound deal.</p>
<p>. . . never mind, you said accredited universitys weren't. But I'll keep my args up as ads. The topic name should reflect that key fact, though, cause a lot of programs are at colleges. On top of that, while summer programs may not necessarily make adcoms go 'woah', they at least show involvement in something.</p>
<p>honestly it depends. There were some parts of the NYLC thing that I enjoyed; however, I failed to account for the fact that Congress went on break so that kind of bummed me out, and the fact that NASA was under lots of pressure we didnt get to see that either. (sadface) That said you get what you expect out of it. If you think you're going to RSI or one of the numerous summer programs that are hard to get into, you're going to be sorely mistaken. If you want to see if the field is "right for you" then it's great, and i do not regret it in that sense.</p>
<p>The major problem though is that this is a "anyone can get in" sort of venture, so at times you'll probally be bored, or you might have to deal with people that you'd rather not want to.</p>
<p>NYLF really is a scam. They send you papers making you think you're somehow "special" for being nominated, when they really just sent it out to you because they asked your teacher to name someone. You pony up the cash and then go to a week of seminars. No "honor" there. At the forum on medicine, I saw only two MDs the entire time. The rest were massage therapists, horse doctors and meditation specialists.</p>
<p>We were at the Sheraton, and that was enjoyable, but the program wasn't anything especially informative or useful for college.</p>
<p>I think we all need to adjust the way we use the word scam. </p>
<p>A scam is when you pay and get little or nothing in return, like having a star named after you, or contributing to some of these fundraising con artists that pop up every time there is a natural disaster. </p>
<p>These so-called nonprofit organizations that promote leadership, ambassadorship and enrichment opportunities are managed like a profit making business with very slick marketing. They thrive because status conscious people are so willing to pay big bucks for something that sounds selective and prestigious. </p>
<p>As long as people are willing to pay for prestige and status, they will exist. They're just running a good hustle!</p>
<p>i got nominated for nslc and cslc and i cant decide which one to go to.
i'm sure that some people think they're not worth it but i think that i
would gain a lot from either one. they also seem extremely similar and i
havent come across anything that compares the two programs.
has anyone been to these both and can compare?</p>
<p>People, please be aware of the programs which are affiliated with a University and the programs which are housed at a University. Some programs rent housing and classroom space from Us including UCLA. That does not mean the program is affiliated with UCLA. There are other programs which are run by Universities. The way you know the difference? Is your contact someone who works for the University or not??</p>
<p>I loooved my NYLF/Med experience. I met some amazing people and since at the time I didn't know if I truly wanted to go into medicine, it helped me a little bit.</p>
<p>And I can say I've seen cadavers.. which seems to be what everyone asks me. "OMG how are you going to deal with the dead people?"</p>
<p>summerbreeze,</p>
<p>These programs aren't so much "useless," but don't expect that by simply attending them you're boosting your admissions chances to a school. These programs could possibly lead to a great essay which in turn, could boost admission chances.</p>
<p>My D's were both 'nominated' for People to People. The first D didn't go, and the second did. They were very clear about it being an honor, and competitive. It is neither. It was horribly expensive...more than $5K for 3 weeks. It was a poorly run teen tour. They did France, Italy and Greece in 20 days. When my D came home, she couldn't remember which ruins belonged to what country! A huge amount of time was spent on the bus, and the thing was badly run overall---as in, they spent hours on the bus to get to Pisa, and got only 10 minuts at the site itself before reboarding for the next destination. Very poorly chaperoned, also. Several times the kids were left to fend for themselves on the streets of various cities, and when problems arose, the cell phone numbers they were instructed to call were not working. Also, besides the brief homestay, which D loved, the 'dignitaries' that the kids were supposed to have access to or meetings with (they had shown slide shows with kids meeting the pope and the queen, etc) degenerated quickly into, 'we were gonna meet some monk, but he wasn't there that day'. Also, the one day they scheduled for shopping in Paris was Sunday--when stores close. In retrospect, my D enjoyed it, but would never do another one. She's now a finalist for a Governors school program, which seems like a much better deal all-around. Free, one month on a college campus, and very competitive.</p>
<p>from all the posts throughout these forums, it is pretty clear
that these programs will not boost my chances of getting into
a great college. however, i was just wondering which program
was a better experience for people since i can't decide
which one to go to. does anyone know which one is a better
program? nslc or cslc?</p>
<p>As for NSLC vs CSLC, they are both owned by the same for-profit company.</p>
<p>You should consider a nonprofit like Presidential Classroom or Lead America. I went to a Presidential Classroom program and they had Bill Clinton speak to us... obviously a special treat, but it was amazing.</p>
<p>As for these programs being a scam... that's really not fair as some of them clearly have a good name. I know that Presidential Classroom has some high profile alums like:</p>
<p>[url=<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melody_Barnes%5DMelody">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melody_Barnes]Melody</a> Barnes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia<a href="now%20working%20for%20the%20Obama%20administration">/url</a>
[url=<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Barrasso%5DJohn">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Barrasso]John</a> Barrasso - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia<a href="Senator">/url</a>
[url=<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chet_Edwards%5DChet">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chet_Edwards]Chet</a> Edwards - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia<a href="United%20States%20House%20of%20Representatives">/url</a></p>
<p>Obviously, these programs aren't for everyone, but I had a good time and made some great contacts.</p>
<p>Trip programs and international travel that is paid for are for the experience, not prestige at all. Its just paying for an easier way to do international travel. The one I went on to Costa Rica which was an adjusted EF tour was great and I'm almost sure it would have cost more to do the same thing myself. As for academic ones, I would personally look for a Governor's school if your state has one or just taking classes instead. Esp. Governor's schools, as they are usually both free and more substantive academically. And they are super-fun also. And I hate to say it because it shouldn't be what matters, but they are actually prestigious.</p>
<p>I think almost all of the ones that cost money are scams, especially the travel ones. Why not just go on a vacation? But I'm only applying to ones that are free and to an internship that pays me.</p>