<p>Rads, glad to see your second post mention money. Depending on your family financial situation you may want to consider some schools which would provide merit aid (there are lots of threads on this). These might buy down the difference between your state Uni and the privates.....that said, since the state Uni is a good one it might be a good bet since you are wise in noting that grad school may be in the future.
Not saying that your son shouldn't apply all over but it is important that finances figure in early on.
If I read one more thread on the financial aid board about someone who got in their "dream" school and now can't afford it or someone who is going to borrow $80K to complete their undergrad degree.......</p>
<p>OP: For MIT or Caltech; your son should do the following by the end of Junior year.
Courses: AP Physics C, AP Chemistry, AP Comp Sciecne AB, AP Calculus BC, AP Statistics (If possible).
Math Competition: AMC10/AMC12 and should qualify for AIME.
Olympiads: He should try to be at a semi-finalists for either Chemistry, Physics, Math or Comp Science.
Quiz Bowl: If possible do physics, science quiz bowl.
PSAT: Your son should score more than 220 to be eligible for applying to RSI
SAT1: Your son need to score above 2200 to have an excellent shot.
SATII: Again need to be more than 750 on Math 2C and either Chemistry or Physics.</p>
<p>ECs:
If interested in Robotics should do a summer camp this summer, participate in FIRST competition
If interested in Math/Science should do JETS.
If interested in research do research in junior year and send your project/paper to ISEF, Intel or Siemens.</p>
<p>^^Good heavens. The student at son's HS who will attend MIT next year did not accomplish one-tenth of what's on that list.</p>
<p>parentofivyhope, that is quite a list. Now I'm not sure my son ultimately will have any interest in applying to MIT, but I do know a young lady from his high school who just finished her freshman year at MIT and (aside from attaining presumably very good test scores) did none of those things, except that she took AP Calc and AP Physics -- but in her senior year, which is when our school offers them. </p>
<p>Truthfully I don't even know what AMC10/12, AIME, RSI, FIRST, JETS or ISEF are. Can you fill me in? Perhaps these are regional competitions not popular in the midwest?</p>
<p>I'll support my son getting involved in any available academic competitions that interest him, and any ECs that interest him, too, but I'm also completely fine with it if he tells me he'd rather read and contemplate his navel. It seems to have worked for him so far. If a kid has to go through all of that to have a shot at MIT or Caltech or similar schools, well, yikes. As the fellow said in Risky Business, "looks like the University of Illinois!"</p>
<p>
[quote]
what AMC10/12, AIME . . . are
[/quote]
</p>
<p>MAA</a> American Mathematics Competitions - AMC </p>
<p>Very good math competition programs specifically mentioned on the application forms of MIT and Caltech, which my son has learned a lot of math from.</p>
<p>I can make a case for commercial test prep services for my kids, anyway. We used Testmasters. It was expensive ($700). But, as advertised, my kids showed even more than the 200 point (old SAT) and 300 point (new SAT) gain in their scores. I think S1 started with about a 1050 and ended up with a 1310 on the old SAT. S2 started about 1100 (maybe 1150, I'm not sure, and I don't remember the original score on the 2400 scale) and ended up with 1420/2160. S1 had done some work with Kaplan software which improved his scores a bit but nothing like Testmasters did.</p>
<p>My kids are pretty undisciplined and I believe that was the key factor that made the course worthwhile for them. They had to go to the class 3 times a week, had to do the practice tests, etc. They just wouldn't have put that kind of focus into doing it on their own.</p>
<p>Also, some of those tricks were very helpful. Both my S's were having trouble finishing many of the sections. The tips (and the practice) helped them to speed up so that they could reliably finish each section.</p>
<p>RE: List of things to do to get into MIT or Caltech</p>
<p>My son was accepted to both schools and ultimately attended Caltech. He did some of the things ParentOfIvyHope mentioned but by no means all. He knew about the Intel and Siemens competitions but wanted no part in them. He also was nowhere near qualifying for any of the Olympiads.</p>
<p>These admission departments at these schools are very good a assessing a student within his or her own context. They will usually know if AP courses are available to these students or if tests like the AMC or the AIM are administer in their schools. I am sure that in the absence of some of the items in POIH's list they can find ways to determine if the student has the aptitude in math and science and the love for the subjects needed to be successful. I would not go out of my way to search for these tests or competitions unless the student really wants them. My 2 cents...</p>
<p>Rice- I have heard of nice merit awards and it seems like a perfect fit for this student. (agree with Mammall) Not a big sports focus (except for baseball and that pretty much happens in the summer), good math and science, fun city and the right size.</p>
<p>
[quote]
OP: For MIT or Caltech; your son should do the following by the end of Junior year.
Courses: AP Physics C, AP Chemistry, AP Comp Sciecne AB, AP Calculus BC, AP Statistics (If possible).
Math Competition: AMC10/AMC12 and should qualify for AIME.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Yes, because there's a recipe for admission. @@
And clearly if you're just a really bright student who may not have all these AP's available to you, you need not trouble yourself, because MIT only wants rich kids who have these things available to them. Another @@</p>
<p>Rads, </p>
<p>It's nice to talk about this AP or that AP or this contest or that competition. But in reality, your son needs to do what makes him feel most comfortable. My son goes to a rural high school. We have seven APs (that will drop to four next year). We have limited resources, so Intel is not an option. Neither is a well-known math or other subject contest.</p>
<p>So what can a kid do? Well, he could play sports. That never interested my son. Instead, he did the stats for various teams, and those teams and their coaches love him. Some joke that he keeps them in line. He got involved in student government, academic team, tutoring, volunteering, FCA. Everything we could offer him. And he was the only guy on the prom committee.</p>
<p>My son says that he always hears that there's nothing to do at our school. Obviously he never believed that. Sometimes you need to make the most of the opportunities presented. Your son will find his way, and he will do what makes him comfortable. And he will land up at the school that most wants him and that he most wants to attend.</p>
<p>First of all, congrats for raising such a wonderful child. I am sure that he will do very well where ever he goes to college, since success is determined nearly entirely by the student. There are ever so many colleges to choose and if he continues his current trend, he certainly could apply to the most selective schools with as good of a chance as most in getting admissions.</p>
<p>The part that caught my attention is your financial situation. A good friend of mine worded his situation in almost the exact words. He was doing well, but the way his livelihood and retirement were positioned were a bit shaky, and it was not going to be a good financial decision to pay for private college. HIs son, an outstanding young man was accepted to Harvard, and did not get a dime of financial aid despite the uncertainties that existed for the family. So, you may want to run your financial numbers through some of the calculators and see if the colleges consider your family as needy. Many of the most selective schools, including all of the ivies do not give merit money, only financial aid to address what THEY, not you define as need. </p>
<p>There are also any number of schools that have full rides and are also considered top schools. Look at the CC merit award threads. Do keep in mind that getting these prestigious awards at the top levels is as difficult, maybe more, than getting into Harvard. But if your son is a top student, it is certainly worth a try and you should put some of those schools on your list.</p>
<p>Then there are other schools that are not as selective for merit awards, where your son might get a nice piece of change. UPittsburgh, Arizona are some examples. I believe UOklahoma gives national merit finalists full rides. ALso your state school may have some good merit awards. </p>
<p>From what I have seen, getting a generous award is indeed difficult. My one son got many awards under $5K which barely put a dent on private college costs. My son this year got some awards in the $20K range, but again when the cost of attendance is over $50K, you still have to cough up some serious money.</p>
<p>My son was a lot like your when he was in high school. His grades were not quite as stellar, but he was smart, pretty quiet and chose not to join any clubs or activities. He wanted to attend a private college, and cost was definitely a factor for us. Are you familiar with "40 Colleges That Change Lives"? There's a book, as well as a web site by that name. It was a great resource for helping to find a college that was a good fit for him. The college he chose offered him a merit scholarship that was nearly 2/3 of first year tuition. A friend of his, who is a year behind him in school, also chose the same college. He had a 4.0, and good, but not great SAT's. He received a full tuition merit scholarship. Both are happy with the education they are getting, and with the college experience as a whole. My son, who will be a senior next fall, is no longer quiet and uninvolved. As a freshman, he joined a fraternity and a sports team, and he has taken on leadership roles in both. It's a pleasure to watch him "bloom".</p>
<p>If you are in Michigan ("public Ivy") you will be in the same boat we were in here in Wisconsin- why bother to apply to schools with less to offer than your own flagship U? This eliminates many schools from consideration from a cost/benefit standpoint. It is nice to leave the area and gain OOS diversity, but the elite schools have a surplus of excellent students to pick from.</p>
<p>The AMCE and AIME are national tests offered in high schools- by invitation from the math teachers. Your son may even have taken one of them and not bothered to tell you. </p>
<p>Now that you have many suggestions from us at CC you can hit the library/bookstore to research the college process. Do be sure to let your son continue to enjoy his childhood without undue pressure on getting into the "right" college. This summer is an ideal time to expose him to the college search process, I'll bet he takes ownership of it and you will be able to follow his lead.</p>
<p>The most important word in selecting the best college is "fit"- let your son do the research via books and online so he can determine his list of priorities and use those to come up with his colleges worth visiting.</p>
<p>@momreads: Intel doesn't require any resources. It just requires you to be in driving distance of anyone that does research (i.e., a university or research lab of a company.</p>
<p>Collegealum314,</p>
<p>Thank you so much for the information about Intel, but still, it would be very difficult to participate. We live in the middle of nowhere -- the closest four-year school is nearly two hours away. And to be honest, my son does not have a license yet. But that's all right. His world is busy enough. </p>
<p>But I can pass the Intel information on to others.</p>
<p>I would agree that the "List of things to do to get into MIT or Caltech" is not accurate, at least as far as MIT goes. I am an alumni interviewer for MIT, and from my experience interviewing and seeing around 20 of my interviewees get accepted at MIT over the recent years (and seeing MANY with better test scores not accepted), I am covinced MIT is looking for well-rounded applicants (especially those who combine strong academics with fairly high-level athletics or other significant pursuits). CalTech might be a different story. My older daughter had very high SAT scores at a young age (1520/1600 in 7th grade) and had high SAT and SAT II scores and a large number of university courses with perfect grades and was accepted to CalTech (did not apply to MIT), with essentially no extracurricular activities other than playing piano and involvement in our chuch. She chose to attend Case Western (with significant scholarship), which is another option for a midwestern kid who is a good student. Many, many of the better students at Case receive academic scholarships that make it cost about the same as or less than many state colleges.</p>