<p>Get me out of high school, fast! And I do mean <em>me</em>! To see these kids with their sense of self just forming, subjected to one contest, competition, stress, after another— I just can’t stand any more of it! I know they learn from it, I know they usually become stronger, more confident and able beings through this, but…I feel too much of what FallGirl says, what everyone has said above! They are all working hard, doing their very best, and searching anxiously for recognition and validation. And they deserve to get that it-- without having to wish ill on their classmates!</p>
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<p>I can’t speak for my kids, but the day in which they both got accepted to their colleges was the day in which it all mattered. I was of course proud of them at honor ceremonies and the like, but I just can’t invest a lot of emotional energy in that kind of thing when I, like Gwen, am of the “get me out of high school, fast” variety. </p>
<p>I don’t have a problem with declaring a val, sal and so forth. What I don’t get is parents living so vicariously through their kids. I was in a situation last night where someone expressed “surprise” that someone else who went to the same hs as her kid hadn’t known her kid because “he was so popular” and I wanted to gag. Well, maybe he was popular among the kids who care about that kind of thing, and maybe most other kids didn’t really care about him, just because you think he’s the greatest thing since sliced bread. Get over yourself, already!</p>
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<p>Lenient standards? Puleeese! You parents who are thinking back to the “good old days” are not seeing clearly. If you honestly think that a HS education in the 80’s was better than it is today…well I just don’t know what to say to that. Kids are taking on much more demanding classes than our parents did. We also do community service, something the 80’s could have used a little more of.</p>
<p>As far as the race for val/sal, it doesn’t bother the kids. It only bothers the few that have those annoying parents that are into everyone’s business. We shouldn’t get rid of a high honor just because the parents think it is unfair (and then tell their kids to whine about it). </p>
<p>I think the posts about being gracious to the top earners and not worrying about exactly where you stand provide the best advice. Parents…this top award is not for you and your amazing parenting skills. If you feel the need to fight the “system” for your kid (and your kid let’s you) then they don’t deserve the award in the first place.</p>
<p>For the record, I HATED the 4 years D was in HS. </p>
<p>My point was that everyone likes to get recognized sometimes. D spent 4 years being extremely gracious to other students and recognizing others. She was always happy to see other students shine. Really. But she was still happy to get her own moment in the sun.
Nothing wrong with that. And yes she was thrilled when she was accepted to her first choice school.</p>
<p>My impression is that most kids and their parents could care less about who is val, who is sal, and who is top ten. Most people find out who the val is at graduation. It is only a handful of push, push, push types who make themselves and a few others miserable. I try to ignore people them, but I know it is difficult. I breathed a sigh of relief when my D graduated, and I’m waiting again for my sigh at the end of this year. It actually won’t be a sigh that the competitiveness is over - my S really has not experienced any of that - but that he’s going to a college (we all think in the fall of senior year that they won’t get in anywhere!!!) and he’s well launched. That’s a happy feeling.</p>
<p>On another thread, i was annoyed at another student “stealing” credit for an idea from another student. Here, however, O.P.'s student has done fantastically, will either be number one or number two in the class, and his grades and classes will speak for themselves. College admissions officers will treat the weight of schedule accordingly. Missing the accolade of valedictorian due to arcane rules about how grades are weighted, schedules chose etc., is a bummer, but not much of one and one that I doubt will have any effect whatsoever (unless there is some sort of honorary scholarship involved - sorry did not read the whole thread). High school is just a step on to college.</p>
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<p>The student ranked number one right now started high school in another country at an international school that allowed kids to take multiple AP courses in 9th and 10th grade, which you can’t do at our school. There is really no way that anyone could have equalled or exceeded her gpa because of this. DS is currently ranked third but I don’t worry about it. It would be unfair for the school to penalize this girl for having started high school somewhere else. It is what it is. A ranking system can’t possibly cover every contingency, every advantage or disadvantage. What about the kid who had the teacher who never gives an A on principle versus the one who gives them liberally? What about the kid who is brilliant but got mono one semester? No school can make everything absolutely fair in a ranking system. It doesn’t matter. In the scheme of things, it just doesn’t matter. What matters is that your kid did well, that he has endless opportunities open to him, and that he’s graduating high school and has an exciting future ahead of him.</p>
<p>Regarding medical school, my middle son was ranked number four when he graduated high school. He is currently applying to medical school. Nowhere on any application to date has he run into the question of what his rank was in high school. Out of all the secondaries he’s filled out, only one school asked him to self-report his SAT score (I had to go digging through drawers to find this information as it is so long ago). None of the rest asked. High school is irrelevant to medical school applications. Let that concern go.</p>
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<p>If that’s the case, why is it that many old-school Prof who started his/her academic career in the '50s-70s and is still teaching as of a few years ago/currently has bemoaned the noticeable decline in the preparedness of college first-years over the decades? Why do we have so many remedial courses/programs for such unprepared/underprepared college first-years…even at some elite colleges/universities? </p>
<p>Why is it that several international grad students who TAed undergrad writing/math courses at an Ivy remarked that if a high school junior/senior exhibited the degree of unpreparedness that they witnessed in their undergrad students, they wouldn’t even be allowed to graduate high school…much less allowed to apply/enter university back home.</p>
<p>. If you honestly think that a HS education in the 80’s was better than it is today…well I just don’t know what to say to that. Kids are taking on much more demanding classes than our parents did.</p>
<p>While it’s very true that those who are in the IB or AP or honors tracks are taking more demanding classes, the rest of the students are getting a substandard education. But, those kids aren’t really the subject here when talking about Val, Sal, and top ten.</p>
<p>"Why do we have so many remedial courses/programs for such unprepared/underprepared college first-years…even at some elite colleges/universities? "
Because a MUCH greater % of US HS graduates are now going on to college than was the case decades ago. And not all are as prepared for college as the “average” college student of by gone days, who was more likely to be white, male, smarter than most of his HS classmates, and from wealthier families than todays average college student.</p>
<p>And to add, that sheer volume of work and preparation for AP exams does not equal preparation for critical thinking in approaching texts and problem-solving at the undergraduate level. </p>
<p>Among the law students I teach, there are still first year students who struggle with the notion that there is not a right answer they are searching for but rather more effective arguments, based on precedent. They are good test-takers, but not critical thinkers, at least not in their first year at law school.</p>
<p>CD-Is she applying for the Foundation Fellows scholarship as well? She shouldns like an excellent candidate.</p>
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<p>I don’t know is there data to show this or if it is more of “the good old days” Every generation claims to have been better educated than the one before (man, my kids are going to get nothing, I’ll bet they won’t even learn to read properly!). The “Old-Prof” probably only remembers the good and i’ll bet he/she said the exact same thing in the 60’s, 70’s, 80’s,… It is a wonder any of the modern day graduates can even find employment.</p>
<p>I’ll bet the old prof fixed them right up before they left his/her class (or does he just flunk them all?)Then when they move onto the next professor its the same story. I don’t buy the anecdotes at all.</p>
<p>Although there is much hand-wringing, the massive increase in the percentage of graduates going on to college is also probably the primary reason SAT scores have dropped. It used to be that only top students (and wealthy ones) went on to college. Then gradually more and more students began enrolling. Now it is the rare student who doesn’t pursue some form of post-high school education. Well over 95% of the kids in our moderate-good suburban district took the SATs. That means only the absolute bottom of the class isn’t taking the exam. The broader the spectrum of kids taking the test, the lower the average score will be.</p>
<p>We’ve had 2 out of 3 of our children as valedictorians. Many HS’s are opting out of this tradition lately, and I don’t think it really matters any more. Don’t fight the HS school, you will look bad (sour grapes). Be gracious and stop stressing out over it. In my opinion, colleges wouldn’t count this against your student. They look at the overall application and it sounds like your student’s HS resume is stellar. He or she will stand on their own merits. Good luck.</p>
<p>I don’t understand the fuss over valedictorian. In our school it is not determined until right before graduation, as all the grades are not yet in & it is always very close. By then, the college acceptances & decisions are ancient history. </p>
<p>The valedictorian has to spend several days before graduation writing a speech, while his/her grandparents etc are visiting. The salutatorian gets to enjoy that weekend with the family.</p>
<p>My oldest was salutatorian! I like it far better!</p>
<p>Our county doesn’t even recognize Vals or Sals anymore. So it didn’t even matter.</p>