<p>Grinnell is a great suggestion. Wonderful school for bright kids, a little easier to get into because it’s in Iowa, and good money!</p>
<p>I totally understand that the OP is shell-shocked right now. Been there!
But one thing OP said: " If you save more, you unquestionably pay more"
–this is not really accurate. I don’t think you’d pay more if you’d saved more–the school is basing your est cost on your income and your EFC. What you think you can pay and what they think can be quite different.</p>
<p>My coping tip–don’t feel bad about the past. Use this as a teachable moment, show your kid how you deal with a difficult situation and make something great of it.</p>
<p>Your kid has great stats–there are LOTS of schools where she’ll likely get merit. You are fortunate. Embrace that–you have a good income, and you have a great student. This gives you options. </p>
<p>I was in a very similar situation a few years ago. My D thought she wanted a LAC–guess what, some of them were not affordable. But because we realized (thanks to research here) that some schools would offer merit–she had several LACs to choose from. In addition, she applied to some larger Uni’s . In the end she chose an OOS flagship/honors college with merit & is SO happy. It is within what we could afford. This can be where your story goes–she’ll find a school where she’ll thrive that you can afford.</p>
<p>Yes, financial aid is based much more on income than whether you have large amounts of college savings. It always pays to save for college and for retirement (and to minimize your debt). As noted above, just make sure that most of your savings and investments are in a designated 529 account, coverdale account or IRA. </p>
<p>In many cases, college savings will avoid the need to take out unsubsidized loans or avoid the need for a student to work during the school year, but not reduce the amount of direct aid that a college provides.</p>
<p>Have you run NPCs for Bryn Mawr and Haverford? I was thinking of Earlham as a safety for my D, but was shocked by their NPC. They are not a full-need school, and their NPC clearly reflects that. There is a list of around 60 schools that say they will meet full-need (as they define it, but if your income is basically salary and you have few investments need is fairly predictable). </p>
<p>I know many families here have had different experiences, but with a similar income and number of children we found full-need schools to be more reasonable than any other option (well, except Community College). You should also run the numbers and see if you would actually be better off not working with a child care bill that large. As far as not borrowing, many people have become very debt adverse, but if you have a plan for repayment, some borrowing can be reasonable.</p>
<p>Cast a wide net is the best advice in your situation, I think. There are many full-need LACs that your daughter would be a candidate for, and many other LACs that have merit scholarships she would be eligible for.</p>
<p>Savings most certainly do affect EFC! It is especially bad with multiple kids spaced out in age. I will have at least one child in college for the next ten years, so at 5.6% of savings per year I’m expected to contribute more than 50% of my savings to college.</p>
<p>OP, don’t give up on Bryn Mawr for your daughter just yet. They meet full need and also offer nice merit–best of both worlds. It may be possible.</p>
<p>Also, St. Olaf is another nice school that meets need and might appeal to a student like your daughter. I second someone else’s suggestion of Mount Holyoke (and maybe Smith). All of these “meets-full-need” schools are somewhat easier for admissions than Haverford or Swarthmore, and still provide a great environment for a serious student.</p>
<p>
Maybe I missed it in the previous posts, but… is this what your daughter wants?</p>
<p>What is her input? Maybe she would prefer a larger, public school instead of a LAC.</p>
<p>Regarding Ship: I know several bright Shippensburg grads (my sister is one) with successful careers and happy lives. And minimal college debt, if any.</p>
<p>Loading up on AP courses can help knock a year off the college tuition. That’s like getting a 25% scholarship.</p>
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<p>Grinnell is NOT “easier to get into” (than what??) “because it’s in Iowa.” And the word is out about its generous endowment. They have had a huge jump in applications over the past few years, I am guessing in part because a lot of families have hoped the Warren Buffett-funded largesse would magically trickle down to them.</p>
<p>I think your daughter may be at the top of the stats range for schools like Earlham, which will mean she stands a better chance of merit money (which has nothing to do with EFC). Your strategy should be to build a list of colleges that she likes and that a) meet full need or b) where she would be a “prize” worth having (and offering merit aid to) because her stats would help improve the overall admissions profile. We followed this approach with our son and ended up with six schools that came in at less than our state flagship.</p>
<p>I think my parents felt the same way. They promised my brother and I that they would be able to afford a State school. But when it came time, they were not able. Neither my brother and I begrudged our parents. We knew they were doing everything they could and we joined the ranks of countless other students in the same situation. We are better off for the experience and respected our parents more because of it. Putting a child through college is no small thing and should be viewed as such.</p>
<p>This is but a small chapter of your long lives.</p>
<p>Many of the best schools in the country will cover full financial aid. You may consider using each of the colleges financial aid calculators on college board to see how much aid your daughter will get.
As a college student who just went through the process, I will offer you two very important pieces of advice. 1) Talk to your daughter and tell her what you are able to pay. She will probably understand and will certainly not hold it against you in the long run. 2) She should apply to colleges that she likes with that in mind. This means that if she wants to apply to a Haverford or a Swarthmore she can, but she is going to need to get a certain amount in financial aid to make that a possibility. Additionally, she should look at state flagships, or places she is likely to get a merit scholarship.
Trust me, my mother did not have the finances talk with me until after I sent out many applications and I was heartbroken because I had my heart set on schools I found out we could not afford.</p>
<p>Re: Net Price Calculators</p>
<p>I would not rule out (or rule in) a school based on NPC numbers. In my limited experience, they are useless. My daughter’s 1st choice school showed she would get really decent merit aid on their NPC based solely on stats…SAT scores, GPA, # of AP/IB classes, the usual. I’m think it projected $15-$18K in merit aid. Guess what — she was rejected outright from that school. Obviously NPC formulas have nothing to do with admissions, but I thought the “fact” that they would offer her good merit money based on NPC meant it was a good fit for her. Remember NPC is simply a calculator. Admissions, scholarship, and financial aid decisions are made by humans and you never know what will happen.</p>
<p>Two other schools where our NPC merit number was much lower did admit my daughter and offered her MORE merit money than their NPC projected. </p>
<p>Financial aid is a whole different can of worms than merit $.</p>
<p>I would not tell your daughter she can’t apply to her dream schools. I would be upfront with her about what you are able to pay, and let her know that some schools may give her enought merit & FA to make it possible and some won’t. </p>
<p>My last piece of advice is to make sure your child meets and keeps in contact with her regional admissions rep for the schools she loves. When you make an appointment for an interview, make sure that is the person your child will meet with – if they love your kid, they will advocate for them. If they don’t even know who your kid is, you are at a disadvantage.</p>
<p>Good luck. You might think about Allegheny, Wooster, Beloit, Lawrence, Knox…the list of schools that are likely to offer merit money to your daughter is huge.</p>
<p>*would not rule out (or rule in) a school based on NPC numbers. In my limited experience, they are useless. My daughter’s 1st choice school showed she would get really decent merit aid on their NPC based solely on stats…SAT scores, GPA, # of AP/IB classes, the usual. I’m think it projected $15-$18K in merit aid. Guess what — she was rejected outright from that school. *</p>
<p>Wow…What school is this??? I’ve never seen a NPC that asks about number of AP/IB classes. Many/most don’t even ask about grades or test scores. </p>
<p>Frankly, I think the most misleading NPCs are the ones that will include a suggested merit award when stats weren’t even given. </p>
<p>Merit awards should not be included in NPC estimates unless stats are requested and the awards are assured. To put them in estimates when the awards are “iffy” is “bait and switch”. </p>
<p>Another time that NPCs are misleading is for Pell students. It will often indicate a larger grant assuming that the student will also get SEOG, a grant that is very limited and can’t be assured. The awarding of Perkins loans and W-S are also “hit or miss.” Last year a 0 EFC student sadly found out that the only aid he was given was his 5500 Pell Grant and 5500 student loan ($11k total award). However, the NPC had indicated that he’d get 9500 in grants (Pell + SEOG), 7500 in loans (Stafford + Perkins), and 2500 in WS (nearly $20k). The difference was obviously huge since the expected amount would nearly cover his instate COA, while the actual award made the school unaffordable.</p>
<p>I’ve just skimmed through this thread, so I’m not sure if someone has already made this suggestion, but since you are in PA, have you considered Muhlenberg? I grew up in Allentown, and so never considered it for myself, but when my oldest daughter was looking at schools (including UPenn and Franklin and Marshall) I suggested she look into Muhlenberg. We were so pleasantly surprised! They are very generous with merit scholarships, and I believe they meet 100% of need. Yes, the sticker price is high (about 54K) but can really be brought down with aid. The other two schools I mentioned were slightly more and offered nothing. </p>
<p>I’m not sure what a “sweet Quaker vibe” is, (although I know some sweet Quakers!), but Muhlenberg feels very friendly and welcoming. We’ve also found that they put a lot of effort into educating students about the pitfalls of college life (partying, drinking, sex) and keep encouraging students to make good choices. They have a social code of conduct as well, which enforces responsible behavior. I felt very good about sending my daughter there. And there is a good amount of religious activity on campus, both Jewish and Christian (the school has Christian roots). We’ve been so happy with the school, I just wanted to throw that out there for you! Good luck, and it will all work out just the way it’s supposed to! We were very stressed about the college choice, but I believe my daughter is exactly where she needs to be!</p>
<p>Added: I looked back at your daughter’s “stats” and she looks like the kind of student that Muhlenberg would invite into one of their honors programs - comes with additional $, and the opportunity to tailor make unique educational experiences that include special internships. Seems perfect for someone with a heart for service! (My daughter will be traveling to Costa Rica as part of a sustainability project, for example) Muhlenberg also has a huge performing arts program! I think it’s worth a look, IMO.</p>
<p>I’m glad I applied to two schools that are safeties for both admission and affordability.</p>
<p>I’d like to second operadivasmom’s suggestion of Muhlenberg. Many graduates from my kid’s “sweet Quaker vibe” PK-12 school have gone on to Muhlenberg. And I have a friend whose daughter received some nice merit aid from them, and her stats weren’t nearly as impressive as your daughter’s. (She had some other great hooks though.)</p>
<p>While you’re adding to the list of PA schools offering good merit aid to the right students, check out Ursinus College in Collegeville, one of Loren Pope’s “Colleges That Change Lives.” Their VP for Enrollment is a Swarthmore grad and he’s a very innovative and progressive thinker.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.ursinus.edu/netcommunity/page.aspx?pid=408[/url]”>http://www.ursinus.edu/netcommunity/page.aspx?pid=408</a></p>
<p>Adding my voice into the others: there are many, many schools that are not quite Haverford, but aren’t no-name party schools. Look at small, private liberal arts schools that are a notch or two below Bryn Mawr; they may offer some excellent merit aid, provide your daughter with an intellectual, warm atmosphere, and allow you to keep your costs down.</p>
<p>Also, expand your geographical search. Some Southern and Midwestern schools may have lower COAs than East Coast schools.</p>
<p>I am right there with you.</p>
<p>Some tips:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>HAVERFORD is very generous for your income level. Try running their NPC. We also have 3 kids and similar family income. I ran over 50 NPCs. There was a $20,000/yr swing in our EFC depending upon the school.</p></li>
<li><p>Look for schools that are rolling admissions with early decisions and merit. For us, I told son he had to apply to either PITT or BAMA. Like you, we are a PA resident. Pitt and Millersville were the only state/state affiliated schools I’d let him apply to. I found many of the privates are cheaper for us than the state schools who give no aid for our income, provide very little merit and very likely would take 5 yrs to graduate.</p></li>
<li><p>Look out of region. Schools in the Colleges That Change Lives book out of region appeared to offer much more and had lower tuition.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>feel free to PM me. I did all the initial leg work for son to create a list (long list) of schools that we had hopes of affording. He narrowed his choices to apply to from this list.</p>