Looking at schools that would be a best fit for my younger son, Carnegie Mellon seems to be the only one we’ve found with very limited humanities requirements. Most, whether for a BA or BS, still have 2-3 writing classes and a long list of humanities courses. I’m not saying that’s a bad thing for most students, but it isn’t a great fit for this kid. My older one is doing great as a third year math major at Cornell. The younger seems a perfect fit for CMU, but I’m wondering if we’ve missed any other interesting choices?
I feel like I’m reading this wrong because I don’t see any, but…Case Western?
https://engineering.case.edu/eecs/academics/undergraduate-program/computer_science/bs-curriculum
Edit: I guess the freshman seminar would count. I feel like most schools have that, though.
Allegedly Brown has an “open curriculum” where you can take literally whatever you want to.
Cooper Union requires only 12 credits in “Humanities & Social Sciences”. Their “CS” may be more computer engineering within EE though.
The CS major at Cornell can be taken in either the Arts &Sciences college (where math also is) or the engineering college. The engineering college will have fewer humanities-type requirements than CAS, but still some. Here they are,
http://www.engineering.cornell.edu/academics/undergraduate/curriculum/requirements.cfm
Their # of free electives for engineers will probably be pretty typical, but schools will probably vary about what they make their students use them for.
At some (? or lots of?) schools, certain distribution requirements can be filled by appropriate AP courses taken in high school, Where that’s the case. My D1 came in with tons of APs, went to an LAC that had relatively loose distribution requirements, and had most of them filled before she showed up there. IIRC.
Thanks. We just visited there, too (he’s actually waitlisted at Case and priority waitlisted at CMU at the moment (for math), but he’s only 16 and could take a gap year and do this all over again - right now, he only wants CMU because of fit). Case seems to have many more humanities requirements in comparison. I know. it seems like there should be many more similar choices. Waterloo in Canada is the one that I know of, but it’s a bit far for our taste (though an excellent option for many). Also, he’s less certain about CS than math. Olin would have CS within the options for engineering, but there’s no math major at Olin. He’s going to start with math and keep CS as a possibility (among others).
Thanks. Brown is definitely on our radar if we have to do this all over again in the fall. He never took humanities AP classes. It’s his weak area. He has AP CS, AP Physics C (both), AP Calc (AB and BC, since he was so young when he started), AP Micro and Macro and AP Stats. He has 8 college classes, half community college and half from Rutgers, but they won’t get him out of many humanities requirements.
I’ve sat in on those Cornell admissions sessions at least a few times where they explain that CS can be achieved though engineering or CAS. I wish he would look harder at engineering. It would probably be good for him.
With Case Western, it will depend on what degree(s) he wants to earn. I’ve linked to pages that describe the breadth requirements.
[College of Arts and Sciences](http://bulletin.case.edu/undergraduatestudies/casdegree/#bachelorofartsdegreetext)
B.A. Computer Science
B.A. Mathematics
B.S. Mathematics
[Case School of Engineering](http://bulletin.case.edu/undergraduatestudies/csedegree/#bachelorofscienceincomputersciencetext)
B.S. Computer Science
Basically, the first three degrees will have more humanities requirements. CWRU is good with AP and transfer credit, so he can avoid some of the requirements if he has college credit from high school. Everyone has to do the SAGES program, which involves three seminars (the first-semester seminar and two “university seminars”). The seminars are divided into the categories of “natural world,” “social world,” and “symbolic world.” You’re required to take one of each, in any order. In my experience, these classes are fluffy and not a big deal.
Each student is also required to take a department-specific seminar. For the first three majors I listed, you can take a seminar in any department. (For example, I’ll probably take a philosophy seminar even though I’m a math major.) The engineering school requires a specific departmental seminar, which is called Professional Communication for Engineers.
A problem for your son is that, at US multi-college universities, mathematics is almost always located in Arts & Sciences colleges, which typically have the widest range of humanities-related distribution requirements, not engineering colleges.
FWIW, Cornell’s engineering college offers an “Applied Mathematics” minor jointly with the math department. Maybe some others offer something close enough to mathematics too.
One strategy, which you are already familiar with but perhaps could pursue more deliberately, would be to look into colleges that are largely engineering (or CS) colleges. Or universities that have “good” engineeering (or CS) colleges with “less good” humanities departments. Because then, even if there are just as many humanities requirements, the humanities courses at such universities might not be very hard, comparatively speaking.
Something that might be worth checking out would be the feasibility of going to college in Europe. Maybe places like Imperial College London, University College-London, etc don’t have gen ed requirements ? Not necessarily such a great idea if he’s going to school very young though.
Canada might be different too, but you’re already clued in to that.
Alternatively, he could try to fill those requirements over the summer at local community colleges, or something.
Or during a gap year, but then he’d be coming in subsequently as a transfer student.
The Case tour guide made it sound intimidating (all the writing). He talked about his excessively long paper that he wrote for SAGES. I know my son could come off the wait list there if he wants to, we’re just not certain whether he should. Thanks for your perspective. The only student we spent time with while visiting was an econ major and didn’t give much insight for our needs (other than general love of her campus). I grew up in northern Ohio, so plenty of people would be there to look out for him. We’ll keep it in mind. The head of the undergraduate math department at CMU was particularly fond of Case’s math department. He was less supportive of Brandeis (for math), where my son has been admitted.
Yeah, it’s funny. He could just go to Rutgers. He’s admitted, of course. A huge percentage of his high school class will be there. He actually took his first class there when he was only 10 years old (intro to logic). It’s a very strong math department. However, the liberal arts requirements would not be optimal for him. The bonus for us would be the option to have him at or near home. When he was applying last fall, he really thought he was a liberal arts kid. CMU was not his first choice during the application season. Over the course of the past year, he’s come to understand himself much better. Not quite ready to send this one overseas…
Northeastern has two writing classes (one is technical writing, the other can be filled by AP), but other than that requires only two-three other humanities courses that can be satisfied with AP credit. Those humanities requirements also have lots of options, it’s not take X, Y, and Z but rather one social science, one art/humanities, one cultures one (which can be satisfied with study abroad options that only last a few weeks). Based on this thread, I think he could probably end up taking around 4 humanities courses total. NEU also has its own CS college and I personally have loved the program.
Thanks. We’ll check Northeastern out if we have to start over. My father went there for a time before ending up at Boston U. The Boston family has been disappointed that we haven’t sent them a kid yet for college (though who knows where the older will end up for graduate school). My husband actually went to MIT. For sure, nothing could cost us more than CMU.
Is it possible for somebody (and specifically your son) to self-study for one or more AP tests, and take them, before HS ends, without taking the actual course?
I don’t know if that’s even possible. IIRC my son self studied and took the European History SAT II exam without taking the course, but it wasn’t the AP exam.
Or could he get an incomplete in gym, therefore technically not graduate till the end of the summer, hence still be a HS student during the summer, during which time he could take several community college courses in humanities courses to place out of them?
Some schools have GE requirements which are somewhat flexible. For example, some number of courses in humanities or social studies. A student who does not like humanities can take social studies courses.
But also note that there may be humanities courses of interest, since colleges offer more different humanities courses than high schools do. The same for social studies.
He’s already self-studying for AP Stats (as his brother did), since the class was far too much time and effort for what it’s worth. He has no lack of interest in humanities courses. He just isn’t particularly fond of writing papers. He does it when he must, but a smaller burden would be better. He’s taken some very interesting classes between Rutgers and community college (two in philosophy, one in biochem, one in game design, advanced math classes, fine arts, etc.).
He skipped 7th and 8th, and he’s been in high school for 5 years. He’s graduating with this class in June (having already let the class he started with move on without him last year despite the fact that he really could have graduated with them). If he stays home next year, he will take classes locally at either the community college or Rutgers. Exactly what, is still up in the air. Hopefully, he will also find some sort of job, too. He can also help mentor his old math team and get involved with one of the local college teams again (depending on where he takes classes).
Since you are already outside the box with such a young student, I would go ahead and push the envelope further. I would ask to meet with schools that you are interested in and ask if your son can develop his own major? Some schools call it “interdisciplinary major” that combines several concentrations, but what if you asked about combining math and computer science and drop the humanities?
If your son has special interests and has wowed the admissions offices, maybe they want him enough to cater to his strengths. Doesn’t cost anything to ask!
“He’s already self-studying for AP Stats…”
Ok well that’s proof of concept at least. Then he can alternatively self-study one, or some, Humanities AP subjects that can potentially place him out of some distribution requirements, alleviating the need for him to take those courses in college.
Frankly it seems like that would be a better use of his time, under the circumstances, than studying for the AP stats exam…
Interesting thought, @powercropper . We’ll see. @monydad , it’s too late for this year. Too late both to study and to add a test at our school. I guess that could be an option if he ends up home next year. I’m not sure what the rules say for taking AP tests after graduating. Otherwise, he’ll definitely be taking some classes one way or another. We knew that AP stats was a really easy self-study with very minimal material. More than that, it wasn’t worth suffering a full year in the class the way it’s taught at our high school for the possibility of a semester of credit. To self-study for most courses would require a lot more time than he would have liked to devote to it this year. He’s been trying to have fun, too. His last round of many events. Today was the last NYU cSplash of high school. Soon, the last ARML as a participant.
More than a few people have suggested avoiding graduation (including a math professor at CMU who felt he could take advantage of another year of math competitions). He really wants to be done.
"He really wants to be done. "
I understand that. One of my own graduated early, yet still managed “National AP Scholar” designation and took about 6 (IIRC) college courses .
Frankly there may have been some advantages to staying on, if it could have been managed in a way that made sense. In terms of maturity. But no such way existed.
NJCornellMom
If he takes ANY classes at ANY college after he has graduated from HS, He CAN’T apply again to colleges as a Freshman- he can only apply as a transfer student! Colleges ask on applications if a student has ever been enrolled at any colleges, and there is a national clearinghouse that they all report to the names, SS"s etc of all enrolled students. Colleges check all names and SS #s of enrolled students with this clearing house and will expel students who apply under false pretenses.
Applying as a transfer student will GREATLY reduce the FA he may be offered, and more importantly, greatly reduce his chances of acceptance at many colleges. Most private colleges take few transfer students.
I caution you to think through any post HS gap year plan very carefully re: what he would do during a gap year. - college classes are NOT an option if he wants to reapply as a Freshman!!
I thought that only applied to matriculation and not to taking a class or two. I’ll double check, but he has no intention of matriculating anywhere other than the place he wants to go. We’re aware of the issue for FA. Thanks for the warning. I didn’t realize some schools didn’t allow any coursework.