Appealing an appeal?

Paying for College
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<p>Some schools do include loans in their packages as well as work study, and some do not. I know that with some of schools here, the way it works for them to meet need is to give the PELL, TAP (state grant), unsub Direct Loan, Work study, subsidized Direct Loan, then go into SEOG and Perkins funds before finally going into university grant funds. There is often a set formula or procedure that is done, and though you can turn down the loans, you aren’t going to get grants to replace them </p>

<p>I agree with the OP if she is looking at the type of work that is not going to be making much or any money, that taking out $50K+ in loans for undergraduate studies is not a good idea. Perhaps a local school can be paid for with the PELL and state money, something very doable around here, with the SUNY school for those with a 0 EFC. One can so get a degree with no loans leaving that option available for graduate studies. I know that the loans my son’s SO is taking are palatable, to some degree, in part because she has no ug loans, and she is now borrowing as a mature adult with a college degree, having worked several years in a field and now knows the direction she wants to take career wise and has done the research and the numbers to show how the money she is borrowing, the income she is foregoing right now for her master’s will pay off in the future. Teenagers are not so able to make such a case for borrowing. So the OP might want to find some less expensive option for ug studies. I agree with her that over $10K for freshman year is a lot. My guess is that the full Direct Loan amount is in there which means the interest will start adding up the instant that is disbursed on the unsub part , and she will get the same and more each subsequent year which may mean that she will owe more than $50K with interest by then. Plus with costs going up each year, she can expect her student contribution to increase too. </p>

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<p>So much we don’t know here. If 1500 is the parent contribution, and OP has some loans, isn’t there also a “contrib from student summer earnings” and a work study expectation? So it may not really be costing only 1500 plus the perfunctory loans- and OP may not have a way to earn on behalf of his parents’ part.</p>

<p>Plus, we’d need to know, as asked, if the 10k is two years of loans or some other calculation. And, is that offer from another college current? Because many schools don’t offer the same to transfers. OP needs to lay this out for the thread.</p>

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<p>Whatever the situation, if the bottom line cost in loans and out of pocket, whether it’s $1500 or $15K or more, if the OP and family feel it’s too much and there are less expensive alternatives, then go for them. </p>

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<p>Agree, but I would also add that many student must work during the summer or during a semester to earn a few thousand dollars to make up differences in aid packages. If you are taking the maximum in loans you should be able to pay that off over time after you graduate. You’ll have the opportunity to adjust the payments based on income (for the federal direct loans.) </p>

<p>But, no matter where you attend you really can’t afford not to work one semester every year (generally summers). You should be able to clear $2000 - $3000 after expenses even at a minimum wage job 20-40 hours per week. During the school year you can do work study, or less hours for your spending money. Even “middle class” kids sometimes need to do this to make up the gaps between what their families can afford and what the colleges are willing to discount through grants and institutional aid. </p>

<p>But yes, if the bottom line cost is simply too much for you to bear or too much for you to work out, you’ll need to either stop and work a year and save up money or find a lower cost alternative. </p>

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<p>@hinatauzamaki You say that $1,500 is a lot and you feel that because of your high achieving 3.5 GPA and other factors that you have a right to more money. Do your parents have $1,500, or will you need to drop out or transfer? Also, do you have an answer to my earlier question on how your credits will transfer to the cheaper school? Will you lose credits in the transfer process that in effect will increase the cost to you of the transfer school?</p>

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<p><< I want to live my life out of service to others so I’m taking the steps now to make sure I stay responsible about my financial circumstances. Besides, they offered me less than what I requested when I compared the package to the other school I said I might transfer to. All in all, it’s a poor package and I’m trying to fight for my right for better aid.>></p>

<p>I’m sorry but I have to be harsh here. NO ONE HAS A RIGHT TO RECEIVE SOMEONE ELSE’s MONEY! You can’t see the forest for the trees! Are you really so naive to think the money comes from the air? It has to come from someone and your FA office has done a pretty good job of keeping your costs very reasonable.</p>

<p>I had been low income and a barrio kid throughout my college career. I lived a thrifty and meager budget in college and it was really difficult but I worked my butt off with two jobs to pay what I owed and 30 years ago I owed 3k. We had food co-ops and used books or copies of section chapters and we tried to bring home leftovers from friends who worked in restaurants. It can be done.</p>

<p>You want to appeal a really good deal because you have a right??? You feel that you deserve a free ride because you are going to serve the people? </p>

<p>PULLEASE! You ain’t getting more money. If You try to appeal again you’re going to get the same response and they may flag your file. They won’t care if you threaten to go to another school because it will be one less entitled student to fund.<br>
The staff is composed of people who generally care about students and if you aren’t accepting what they have tried to give you, they won’t make an effort to search for extra monies for you and will know what your priorities are. So you may not be able to register for classes.
The financial aid office wants you to invest in yourself by helping to pay a reasonable amount. If they had found a scholarship for you, don’t you think they would have given it to you by now?</p>

<p>Fast forward 10 years and you’re working helping people and not making a whole lot of money. Where will you live? How will you get to work? I work in an agency with people who have “service” majors; they are always complaining about a lack of money. Get real and grow up or find another affordable school. You are looking a gift horse in the mouth! </p>

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<p>What is your major and career goal - just curious in what fashion will you be serving others? Maybe there are some outside scholarships you could dig up depending on this life of service goal.</p>

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<p>Okay this is going to be pretty long…so brace yourself! :))</p>

<p>@Madison85, I was hoping to major in something related to medicine so that I could one day travel across the globe on medical missions and help out people, especially kids, who don’t have access to good or even any form of health care. I know where my parents come from, there isn’t much of that and I really want to give back to my people. I’m not 100% sure on the credits but I think most of them will transfer and I also have AP credits so I think that it would be okay. I don’t want my parents to pay at all ( they already have a lot on their plate!) so honestly the expenses would be all on me and while I am working now, It’s just so difficult to have all that money at once, especially since I have to factor in other expenses, such as, transportation and textbooks. </p>

<p>@lookingforward…
Btw to be clear to everyone else, this $1500 is a direct tuition bill-not a side cost, like transportation!!/</p>

<p>I have over $10K in loans already from one year, which is why I’m trying to find other alternative options from my school so that I don’t graduate with over $50,000 in debt (this is greater than the national average student debt D:) I agree with what @billchso said about not really considering loans as financial aid, since it is future out-of-pocket money. As you probably know, med school is also exorbitantly expensive and I don’t want the added stress of my undergrad loans burdening me when the time comes for me to think about how I’m going to finance med school.</p>

<p>@aunt bea, Hey, I’m glad to see someone who personally understands my struggle. I’m pretty sure back then working off to pay off that 3K was not an easy task…well paying off more than 10 times that amount is certainly not a picnic in the park either, lol.
Btw, I hope you understood that I was speaking in terms of scholarships…which are for people who have done well in school and let me tell you, despite all the family drama that I’ve had to go through and the stress I’ve had financially, I was still able to do well in school. I know my school offers some scholarships for people with high GPAs and I have worked hard to EARN those scholarships…not simply “receive” them out of an egotistical sense of entitlement. I feel that there are other scholarships that I am definitely eligible for (that I’ve worked hard for) and that the fin aid office didn’t consider me fully for such scholarships…which is why I’m going back to talk to them. This isn’t about me being a crybaby about having so many loans and not wanting to contribute a dime to my own education. Believe me, if I could afford it, I’d rescind all that merit and need-based aid so that other kids who actually NEED the money would be able to use it. My parents didn’t have a college education-I’m the first in my family to go to college and as a first-generation college student, I sincerely believe that there are more opportunities out there to help me out besides loans. I am simply trying my best to make sure that I don’t end up drowning in debt, which would contradict the whole point of my education to help bring my family out of poverty if its costs are putting me in that state in the first place. </p>

<p>@cptofthehouse‌, thanks for your understanding comments. I’m glad that you see where i’m coming from as to why I can’t continue taking out more loans and why I created this post in the first place.</p>

<p>I came to collegeconfidential because I believed it to be a place where kids who don’t know much about college, since their parents never went to any, can receive some helpful advice from others who actually have. Certainly, believed it to be better than my rude guidance counselors…but I’m not so sure now. </p>

<p>I’m looking for anyone who can give me advice as to how i’ll talk to my financial aid counselor. Yes, I know it’s a long-shot considering I’ve already done it once but as I’ve stated before, I still believe that there are more scholarships that I am eligible for that they still haven’t considered me for. I would also like to think that my school would like to keep me as a student instead of having me transfer, since I have done pretty well, thus far, and I know I can do even better without all this financial aid stress. >.< </p>

<p>Can anyone help me with what I’ll say? I don’t need to see more comments on how it’s a long-shot, I ALREADY know that. And please, stop saying I’ve already received enough and trying to change my mind by comparing me to other students. I am not other students. Every financial aid case is unique and I wholeheartedly believe that, for my case, I deserve more aid because I worked hard in school to get good grades and also, because I demonstrate high-financial need. There may be other students similar to me, and you may feel tempted to bring them up in a way to make me feel grateful so there’s no need for that, since I am very grateful for the amount. But, as I’ve also said…I am NOT ready to give up! There’s a reason why Obama tried passing a bill where college students wouldn’t have to take out any loans at all for school…because ultimately, it sets up many of us for failure and limits our paths into jobs with money instead of heart. (I’m not saying this applies to everyone but just for MANY undergrad college students). </p>

<p>Doth anyone here haveth the powers of persuasion?</p>

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<p>Just a quick suggestion, and don’t take this the wrong way, but in your appeal, don’t uses phrases like ‘I deserve more aid’ or anything about your ‘right to better aid’ because I think those would be big turn-offs to the financial aid officer re-reviewing your information.</p>

<p>Do you and your parents have the $1,500, or not?</p>

<p>Earlier you mentioned that you were not going into a lucrative career, but, do you plan on becoming a doctor?</p>

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<p>what school are you attending? We can give you a better idea as to their financial aid policies and how to best pursue an appeal.</p>

<p>how does your financial aid package break out? with a 0 EFC, the only things that we know that you go for certain is a pell grant and a loan. is there any state aid in your package? what kind of institutional aid did you receive; merit scholarship, or was in need based institutional aid. Does your school meet 100% demonstrated need?</p>

<p>are you living on campus or are you commuting.
Is there any way that you can trim your direct cost; taking a less expensive meal plan, leaving in a double in stead of a triple to lower your dorm cost.</p>

<p>Since you are out for the summer, while you may have a job, you may have to get 2; whether it is bussing tables, dog walking moving lawns, handy work ,etc. the net net is if you don’t have the $750 cash money to pay your bill, you will not be attending class. It is not to say that you cannot appeal, but you need a strong plan b in the event that you don’t get an appeal.</p>

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<p>"I deserve more because I worked hard in school to get good grades and because I have high financial need. . . " So what??? Your situation is NOT unique. You still don’t get it. Your attitude is elitist. You’re saying that you are better than others, and so you merit more and you don’t want others telling you their opinions. </p>

<p>Where is this money coming from? How do you know there are scholarships that you were rejected from? Do you work in the financial aid office as part of your work study? </p>

<p>I have a friend who is a financial aid administrator at a large UC. I could have asked her what to do in your case, but that’s not going to happen. You believe that somehow the financial aid office at your school has shafted you by making you pay a lot less than most students pay. They have a thing called computer programs, and they generally use logarithms to match your talents, income, etc. to the available scholarship monies. Take some responsibility. If you think you are being set up for failure because you don’t want to carry any loans or pay any money towards your education, then maybe you should fulfill that prophecy because there is even less money for medical school. It’s gonna cost you $300K. You need to look at another “service” profession because you can’t afford medical school.</p>

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<p>@Madison85‌ , thanks for the advice! As I’ve said, I’m not asking for more aid out of a pure sense of entitlement but because of the hard work I’ve put into trying to earn these scholarships my school has put on its website but is almost impossible to contact when it comes to finding out more information about them. This is why I’m going back to them-and at the moment, no they don’t
Have that money altogether. I am willing to pay for it in installments but it’s going to be hard with all the other college costs I also have (transportation and textbooks). My parents can barely pay the rent sometimes they even borrow from me, so money of definitely tight and I’m just trying to avoid adding more to their financial stress. I know it doesn’t look like a lot but for my family it is and I’m sick of having to see them suffer just because college thinks it’s an okay amount for us to pay. My parents are getting older and it’s getting harder for them to work at their blue-collar jobs-seriously, I don’t want them to have to strain themselves anymore when they could be saved that stress easily. They’ve already sacrificed their home and family coming here-I want to finally free them from this American Dream. Taking out loans just to fall back into an impoverished state also seems pointless. Yes, I want to study medicine but I want to work internationally and help out non-profit groups and expand public health care. I’d love to one day work for Doctors Without Borders, and honestly, it’s not a glamorous high-paying Job, which I’m A-okay with! Money’s not why I’m studying medicine anyways.</p>

<p>@sybbie719‌ , I don’t want to say the name of my school but it’s a pretty expensive private university. Yes, I have state aid and I’m a commuter. My school states that they try to meet everyone’s need but doesn’t provide any official percentage numbers. The thing is though, I know my school has also formally taken a vow of poverty and is dedicated to helping students of high-need come out of poverty. As a kid who grew up on food stamps, I feel like it’s reasons like these why I want to go back and talk to them in person once more and really tell them my story. </p>

<p>Also does anyone know how I can block or remove Aunt Bea from this thread? I put her on my ignore list but I don’t want her to comment on my thread anymore, seeing how at this point, she’s nothing more than a ■■■■■ to me. I’ve been very civil with her and have asked that I not be patronized for my thoughts on trying to get more financial aid and she downright attempts to invalidate my statements and my story by saying my story is not unique or as she is insinuating-not worthy of the extra help, while also fabricating lies about who I am. I would never think such self-supremacist thoughts. My dedication to helping others is the very reason why I’m here! So So that making (a lot of) money doesn’t become one of my ultimate goals but rather saving lives does (and for the people who can’t afford doctors otherwise). She is also being incredibly discouraging with her statement for my low-income status being a reason why I’m not worthy of going to med school. Her comments about her friend in the financial aid office are also very rude, since she isn’t here to help me, but rather spite me.</p>

<p>It’s pretty embarrassing to have an online argument, especially, here of all places. As the old adage goes, if you don’t have anything nice to say, then don’t say anything at all.</p>

<p>I still haven’t gotten the help I’ve been looking for. Can anyone help me construct a compelling argument with their persuasive powers?</p>

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<p>What happened to the idea to transfer to a cheaper college? Looks to me like you’re going to go to finaid and say, for my post-college personal goals and dreams, I need you to give me more money. I guess you will tell them what you said here: that you know they have more and you want some of that. </p>

<p>Any scholarship needs to have the money behind it, now. Some funds are already depleted, by awards to other students. We know you say you have worked hard. Some funds may require a higher gpa than 3.5, (which generally means half A and half B grades.</p>

<p>Med school is expensive. There are govt programs where, in return for a US service assignment, they will offer financial support of different types. But that’s for service in the US. You can see the requirements for DWB here: <a href=“http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/general-requirements”>http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/general-requirements&lt;/a&gt;. if you are thinking of a smaller program, then do research on those. </p>

<p>If you are set on telling them you need more, that they should understand your post-college goals and underwrite them, then you don’t need us. If you think aunt bea is ■■■■■■■■ you, you may as well “ignore” all of us. In college, as in life, it isn’t always about what we want. </p>

<p>An you can look up some financial aid data in the school’s Common Data Set. </p>

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<p>First of all Aunt Bea does not think a low income student is not worthy of med school. Aunt Bea is a very knowledgeable contributor, so dont discount her words. </p>

<p>Secondly, and MOST IMPORTANTLY…you are going to have to take out HUGE loans for med school. Med School is not funded for low income students. Either you take out loans or family pays. Some top med schools will give some partial grants to low income students, but the students still have to take out seriously large loans.</p>

<p>So…my point is…you are never going to be able to devote your life using your medical degree to serve others and earning little. You will still have to work and pull in a good salary to pay off your big med school loans, and if you can, schedule some time to do things like Doctors Without Borders.</p>

<p>The reason that med schools do not provide much/any grant aid to low income students is this. As a doctor, your low-income status will soon end and likely you will be earning more than 99% of the rest of the country. Therefore, med schools really have no need to fund your education. And, they wont fund it just because you say that you are going to help the poor instead of earning money. After all, everyone could claim that, graduate, do their residencies, and then start earning big bucks. </p>

<p>It sounds like you attend a Jesuit university or another Catholic university that is run by an order who has taken a vow of poverty and has a mission devoted to the poor (maybe DePaul). </p>

<p>If you are a commuter, then it doesnt sound like this school really does meet need unless they dont compute any costs beyond tuition, fees, books for commuters. </p>

<p>If you need to make a point to the FA office, then the point that you are a commuter and even commuters have college-related expenses outside of direct college costs. Ask them what your aid would be if you were in a dorm or in an off-campus apt. If they say it would be the same, then this school does NOT try to meet need…at all. </p>

<p>I may have missed this…are you working lots of hours this summer? If so, how much have you been able to save? If not, why aren’t you working?</p>

<p>However, I suspect that the school really doesnt have a policy of meeting need or even really trying to meet need if you are a commuter and even your direct costs arent covered as a low income student. </p>

<p>Is this a FAFSA only school or does it also require CSS Profile. </p>

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<p>Whether or not you want to hear it, Aunt Bea is correct; you are essentially attending college through the kindness and generosity of other people’s parents. Where do you think your Pell grant state grant and institutional aid comes from; other people’s parents who pay taxes, contribute to their/ their child’s schools through the alumni/parent/grandparent associations and pay full freight so that money can be allocated to low income students.</p>

<p>I did not see anywhere that Aunt Bea said that you are not worthy of extra help. One of the caveats of asking people for advice is that everyone is not going to fall lock step with you and take your position. People are going to tell you perfectly rational things that you may not want to hear. On an online forum you don’t get to say who can or cannot post on your thread as long as they are meeting the TOS (which she has not violated). </p>

<p>I totally believe and support affordable educations for low income students because it is the only way to help them end the cycle of poverty. However, it does not entitle you to a $30-50k private education.The great thing amount this country is that there are over 4000 colleges are various price points. If you started at community college, I am 1000% sure that your school has articulation agreements with 4 year public universities. It sounds as if you did not do your due diligence and build a list where you were 100% certain that you had affordable options.</p>

<p>From your posting, even through there are loans in your package, the school has met your need with the exception of $1500, which is the responsibility of you and your family. Even at schools that meet 100% demonstrated need have a student contribution. It sounds as if the $1500 is yours. If you are unwilling to have some skin in the game are letting $750 come between you and attending college, that says very little about your resolve to take on the long haul because there will always be challenges and obstacles. </p>

<p>Sorry, but yes, your response about what you deserve and how hard you work does sound a little entitled (and I am saying this as a person who at your age also had a 0 EFC and put my own self through college because my parents were deceased and I have 3 younger siblings to help care for). I work with students for a living and have seen many smart, hard working kids to go to community college and the local public 4 year school because it is what they can afford. There are plenty of parents here who have smart hardworking kids who are not going to private schools although they had the grades and stats to get in because it was not a financially feasible option for the family.</p>

<p>The expectation is that you make this money through summer earning and if you don’t get your student contribution, the school will not make up the difference.</p>

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<p>At this point, the scholarship money that you were eligible for has been given out. That’s probably why your package is as it is.
In addition, if your school is not a 100% need school, they don’t consider that you have a “right” to funding at all. They are under zero obligation, not being a 100% need school, to cover your financial need with grants or loans. Whether you work hard or have high need doesn’t matter if your school doesn’t promise to meet need.</p>

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<p>To Whom it May Concern:</p>

<p>Thank you for re-evaluating my financial aid package and increasing my grant/scholarship money for the 2014-2015 school year. I am writing to ask if I can meet with a financial aid officer to further discuss the merit and need award components of my package. I am especially concerned over my existing student loan debt and the remaining out-of-pocket cost of $1,500. As a first generation college student from a poor immigrant family, I am feeling overwhelmed by my debt and the need to come up with $1,500 when my family is already struggling to make ends meet. Some months, my parents cannot pay the rent and I need to help them pay it. </p>

<p>As a commuter student, I live at home as frugally as possible; and it is difficult to see my parents and family suffering through our version of the American Dream while I try to earn a better future in college. You see, for most people, an additional $1,500 would not seem like much money but for my family, that is more than my parent’s life savings! </p>

<p>I have considered transferring to a lower cost school, but I believe that the education I am obtaining through your generosity at ________ school, with its ideals and mission of _______________will help me best meet my future goals. I am working diligently toward becoming a health care professional who will have the ability to joyfully work with under served people in the area of public health at home and around the world; working to improve lives. </p>

<p>I am very grateful for all ____________university has done for me. I am asking you earnestly to reconsider my situation one more time. An additional grant of $1,500 or more would go a long way toward relieving some of the financial burden on my supportive but very poor family, and allow me to continue to concentrate on my academics.</p>

<p>Thank you for considering my request. I look forward to hearing from you at your earliest convenience,</p>

<p>Sincerely,</p>

<p>@shehangsbrightly‌ </p>

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<p>Does your school require a student contribution? In the vast majority of cases, when required, the amount increases as the student progresses through college. So, perhaps what you are seeing is an increase in that student contribution requirement.</p>

<p>I am a bit confused. You took $10,000 in loans for one year? Is that correct? How much did your family have to pay out of pocket (and this might include loans they took to do so ) LAST year? If you had out of pocket expenses from last year, were they less than $1500 (including amounts funded by loans)?</p>

<p>Has your family financial situation changed since last year? Or was your EFC per FAFSA about the same?</p>

<p>Also, remember that schools using other forms like the Profile look much deeper at finances.</p>

<p>Are you working this summer? Do you work during the school year? Any chance you could have saved the. $750 for the fall term through summer earnings or school year earnings LAST year?</p>

<p>What is the reason for your second appeal? You need a reason…a change in circumstances since you filed your financial aid forms and first appeal, or something similar. </p>

<p>Maybe this will work out for you. But the expectation that a full need school will be totally free is not realistic. Those schools often do require that student contribution. And many include Direct and Perkins loans in the packages.</p>

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<p>Since I’m probably being ignored by OP, may as well say there is a touch of un-realness here.<br>
Over a year ago, the original finaid offer came through. OP made this choice to attend this college with its aid. OP said the original year 2 award was basically a copy of year 1. And that the hard work, poor circumstances, and dreams of working with the poor in his parent’s native country and a 3.5 gpa should get him/her more aid than the college calculated for freshman and soph years. </p>

<p>If OP now has more than 5500 in debt (standard stu loan,) maybe it IS from adding in a Parent Plus. (OP doesn’t explain.) He/she went through this process a year ago and one could think, would have smelled the coffee then. All this sounds emotional, rather than some rational research into how these things work.</p>

<p>Did OP really expect year 2 aid to be better? Based on the dream and a 3.5? If truly driven to do this work, OP can look into (should have looked into) the less expensive college choices. </p>

<p>I don’t think OP even realizes how his/her words come across here. </p>

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<p>

No, I don’t think OP does realize. I haven’t commented in this thread yet, but in reading through it am having a difficult time understanding OP’s sense of entitlement in believing he/she has the right to more finaid $. He/she seems to think they are unique and deserving of more generosity than they have already gotten from their school. Why?</p>