<p>After reading one of the waitlist threads, it got the wheels turning on the psychology of admissions. At the beginning of this journey our D weighed the pros and cons of applying to a multitude of schools that had what she was looking for. There was a program at our State Flagship that was important to her, and we were very happy to hear they had rolling admissions. The State Flagship was an auto admit school for her based on her stats, but this program was highly selective or as some say a "lottery" type entrance. Through what I believe were extremely wise words of wisdom on these very boards, D made the decision to apply to this program early, be patient, waiting out the notification period preparing other applications (mainly via common app), writing essays, etc. She did fully submit one other application. When she received her acceptance to State Flagship program, she withdrew the other application, and never sent in another one.</p>
<p>Now with this said, and after reading the heartache, confusion and frustration with the waitlist process, I don't understand for the life of me why a kid who already has an acceptance in hand to their "#1" or "dream" school (and they can afford it), would not immediately withdraw from other applied to schools?? Ego? Trophy Case? Why? (Six months ago we considered doing the exact same thing, but now know, not doing so was in our best interest) The counter position of rejection, and waitlisting, in my very humble opinion, makes the student cast doubt on their abilities, creates "irritation" with the rejected/waitlisted university and if waitlisted, just drags this emotionally draining process on and on and on. This is spring of senior year. Proms, banquets, parties....who wants that hanging over their heads if it was never necessary in the first place?</p>
<p>I just hope parents of rising Juniors will read about the emotional toil of the waitlist, rejections, etc, and if they have a student that has an admission to a "favorite" school, encourages their own child to pull the plug on the process. Of course there are kids out there that are simply still waiting for any acceptance, and in no way does this apply to them. To those sweet kids....hold on tight and know it will be over soon.</p>
<p>Do you remember one of the students a pig from last year, who applied EVERYwhere, maybe to 24 different schools? She was a top student with an ego to match. She got multiple likely letters, all from super top schools. It wasn’t even a matter of FA, since she got full tuition at all places. She’s exactly the type you describe.</p>
<p>D2 is a raising junior. If she is so fortunate as to get into one of her top 2s via EA, we probably would only apply to 1 or 2 more of her top choices just in case if she should change her mind in 4-5 months. Applying to colleges is not trophy hunting. Students are compared with each other within a school and a region.</p>
<p>I know of a such girl. She collects admissions letters like Imelda Marcos’s collection of shoes…An ego and hobby? You just need one, for God sake!
Speaking of # of schools applied, it seems that the norm is 10. I have seen some students in CA applied for over 56 schools…I hate to be the school councelor having the job of sending so many copies of transcripts for one student…</p>
<p>For us, it was definitely a matter of financial aid. We learned with our first D that offers from schools can vary greatly. With three kids, two in college at the same time and one in private gradeschool, we need to be able to compare offers. S got accepted into his favorite school EA in December, but we’ve yet to receive the FA package, so we don’t know if he’ll be able to go. If we’d pulled everything else and the offer from EA school comes back less than adequate, we’d be in trouble. I do feel guilty about taking spots at other schools, but must say that other schools start looking mighty attractive when you have to wait so long for financial aid offers. I think it would behoove EA schools to get their FA offers, at least estimated ones, out as soon as they can after admissions. This might cut down on multiple applications.</p>
<p>good point momdoc. there is a hot thread over in the finaid section where a student turned down merit awards for a school which has now offered completely undoable financial package.</p>
<p>For families that need to compare financials, there’s a whole other element to this process which requires a certain number of apps. This whole thing is more complex than I ever imagined when my first was a sophomore in HS. That’s for sure.</p>
<p>GC at S’s independent school insisted he withdraw his other apps once he got into his top choice earlier this month. He was reluctant, but was convinced it was the right thing to do. He had friends whose first choices were some of the schools he wasn’t going to go to, so he could understand the issue from their viewpoint.</p>
<p>I agree to some degree. The process has evolved in one generation from about a 6 month process to a two year process. The acceptances are seen as some sort of award even though the actual award is completing a college degree. Kids are applying to too many places. You can only go to one place. Many families are playing a financial lottery hoping that if they apply massively some sort of financial fairy will drop the rare “free ride” in their laps. Too many kids think the college they attend will define them and not that they will define themselves. Kids apply places they can’t hope to afford regardless of all the data and advice. Finally, last year there was a college in these forums that waitlisted more kids than comprised the entering freshman class taking the concept of waitlist to the absurd. Fortunately I believe there are more families nationally like yours than the examples we often see here.</p>
<p>I think financial aid is obviously a reason for keeping other irons in the fire and it may be one that students prefer not to broadcast even to their friends. I also think that some students really do change from October to April. In October my younger son thought that Vassar was “big enough” by April he was sure it wasn’t. He also heard early from U of Chicago, but hadn’t visited. He wanted to wait till the spring to visit because he didn’t want to be swayed by dreary winter weather. He did choose not to apply to two schools that he was pretty sure he would like less than Chicago. Since he ended up with four acceptances and three rejections, I don’t feel like he overdid things.</p>
<p>I don’t think he did anyone at our school out of a Chicago acceptance, by waiting till the last minute to reject them. Most universities have a pretty good handle on what their yield will be and accept more students than they have room for deliberately.</p>
<p>^^^^^
Glad to hear that a GC had the sense and took the time to explain the ethic of the situation.
For students who are waiting to hear about the FA piece, it is a different dynamic. I wish more guidance departments took the time to reinforce this message of compassion and generosity.</p>
<p>I don’t get it either. Especially things like SCEA Yale, EA Georgetown or EA Chicago. You hit the jackpot – be done with it! I, too, am not a fan of wait lists. Love me or don’t, but don’t string me along. If I had kids who got into really good schools and were wait listed at others, I’d strongly encourage turning down the wait list and moving on.</p>
<ol>
<li> Financial Aid: I am from middle class family so FA matters.</li>
<li> I applied for many reach schools.</li>
<li> Uncertainty of college admission.</li>
<li> College Confidential: It seems that everybody has more than 10 schools on their list.</li>
</ol>
<p>However, I start feeling guilty after few acceptances.</p>
<p>I don’t think waiting until the last minute to reject is adverse since I, too, believe the colleges have a pretty good handle on yields. I have often advocated limiting applications. Ten seems like a reasonable number (and not just because there are 10 spaces on the FAFSA LOL) to compare aid offers and most kids can get it done with 5-7 or less well thought out applications.</p>
<p>There have been varying reports on this…CollegeBoard says 10-15% apply to more than ten and there are some reports that it is as low as 3%. Frankly at some point too many colleges shows a lack of focus on the part of the kids whether it is ego driven or not. There has been debate whether colleges can “see” the other apps via Common App, FAFSA or the Profile. But thankfully it is a small percentage of all kids that are not capable for whatever reason of culling a list.</p>
<p>I think there are a number of reasons to apply to a larger number of schools (see below) but I can’t stand those who do it for ego and then express outrage on CC about how they were waitlisted by their “safety.” As if that school had a obligation to satisfy those egos.</p>
<p>As to other good reasons, beyond financial aid, I’ve seen among kids I know:
A strong record with one weak spot. At least one top school may overlook it.
A strong focus on one area with an interest in many. For my son, there were a few schools specialized in his main interest area, but without the broader liberal arts. There weren’t really any broader LACs or universities that also had such strength in his main area of interest. He wasn’t sure in the fall which way he would go, and so he essentially applied to two sets of schools. In the end, it came down to a choice between one from each group. (He chose the liberal arts and sciences university with the strongest showing in the specialized area, and with an option for an interdisciplinary major.)
Being a generally strong student without a standout characteristic. There are just so many of them and each year you know one who doesn’t get into any match/reach schools. It is just logical to want to increase the chances somewhat.
Early decision rejection, and the panic that produces. </p>
<p>That said, i’m impressed by the guidance counselor who insisted on withdrawal of applications after the first choice acceptance (and the student who agreed). And to some degree, the high use of Early Decision is cutting into this at our school. </p>
<p>In the end my son applied to 20 schools (!) and my daughter to 1, so I guess we evened out!</p>
<p>However, I don’t understand the rationale behind withdrawing applications following an early acceptance. I was accepted to my top choices early last fall. I’ve left my other applications in the ring. It isn’t emotionally stressful because they aren’t my top choices and I therefore don’t care that much about acceptance or rejection. If I get in, I get a little ego boost. If I don’t, my situation is no different than if I had withdrawn my app.</p>
<p>BTW, one reason some students apply to a large number of schools is because of parental pressure to do so. Not because that’s how they want to do it.</p>
<p>^the point of withdrawing is that the process isn’t about boosting your ego. If a student isn’t sure which school is his/her top choice, of course keep the applications in. But if he/she is sure, those acceptances about which you don’t care (except as it helps your ego) are rejcetions for someone else who does (and in some cases, who might be a classmate at your school).</p>
<p>Exactly.
Noimagination, your post indicates that it’s all about you. What about the other kids out there who might be dreaming of those schools? How about a little empathy?</p>
That’s exactly why the waitlist does exist - so that students who really want to attend a school but weren’t initially admitted can still have a chance to go, and so that schools can still meet their enrollment goals even with sub-100% yield.
See above. If I thought my slot would literally go unfilled instead of being taken by a deserving waitlisted student, of course I would withdraw my app. But that’s not the case.</p>
<p>Very few kids submit or hold out applications for ego. As noted by several, applicants have a lot of interests in keeping applications out there, including financial aid, being undecided, uncertainty as to schools or the weighting of criteria, timing of responses, wanting to visit, etc.</p>
<p>In the end, when applicants submit applications to a range of schools, they are entitled to let the process play out, and have no obligation to other applicants to create space and new spots for those who otherwise didn’t and wouldn’t make the cut by virtue of receiving a host of acceptances. It is misguided to suggest that a successful applicant should accelerate their process to create a spot for someone (“MAYBE EVEN A CLASSMATE!”) where even the colleges themselves understand that the acceptances at all but a half dozen or so schools will yield more declines than candidate acceptances. </p>
<p>With all the time and money that has gone into this process and with how much my daughter has changed over the last 3/6/12 months, she would be doing herself a disservice by not taking as long as she can to make her decision. The schools have had the applications for months- these kids have 30-45 days to weigh the differences between the schools and make the best decision for them and that is where their responsibility lies.</p>