<p>Don't you just love it how parents manage to sneak in how well their son/daughter is doing?</p>
<p>Heh, it sort of makes things interesting.</p>
<p>This is 2005 not the early 1900's where religion did play a role in admitance to many/all of these schools. It hasn't been that way for a long long time.</p>
<p>Mathwiz: The parents who participate in this thread are on it because they believe these schools provide a dimension of education that is simply not available in the public school system. There is a fine line to be drawn between sharing their experience with other parents and with students who might be interesting in exploring whether preparatory school is something for them, and safeguarding the privacy of their children. I agree with you about not sneaking in a reference to how well their children may be doing but wonder if this point could not have been made without the implicit sneer echoed by Spinach. Maybe I'm very old fashioned.</p>
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<p>That's right. Moreover, the schools talked about in this thread are mysterious to me, as I never attended anything but local public schools for my education (even for college and for professional school). So the whole process of boarding "prep" school application, in which the students are the applicants but the parents are much more involved than they usually would be for college applications, is a new process to me. </p>
<p>Pardonnez-moi for what apparently was taken to be a gaffe in my last post. (And, no, I am not offended nor do I feel flamed by anyone disagreeing with the appropriateness of that post.) Yes, I am new to this process, and it has taken reading a LOT of CC posts to get some idea of how much or how little test scores have to do with prep school admissions. Various posts in various threads have shared various levels of detail from applicants or from their parents about how applicants have scored this year or in the last few years. It appears, on the one hand, that if an applicant has faultless test scores the applicant can still not gain admission. That makes sense: there is much more to being ready for the prep school experience than just posting high test scores. On the other hand, it appears that some applicants can have test scores substantially lower than the mean scores of most students at the school they apply to, and still get in, as long as they have something else to add to the student community at the school. That makes sense too: the prep schools are looking to gather together an interesting, vital community of learners. </p>
<p>That said, my newness to this process causes me to resonate with the earlier posts in this thread and in other threads about prep school admissions that raise questions about test scores. One thing we can all be sure about is that the prep schools receive the SSAT scores of applicants before the applicants do. Another thing we can be sure about is that the scores don't tell the whole story of who gets admitted and who doesn't. But I was curious about just how my own child would score because of advice</a> I have recently given about how applicants who speak a language other than English (like my son) might make sure that their English verbal abilities develop as well as they can. I hope that applicants with a similiar background, whether applying to college or to prep school, thrive in their study of English. </p>
<p>Best wishes to all of this year's prep school applicants. The application process isn't easy, but it does come to an end. :) And congratulations to the current prep school students who post in this and other threads and who are so helpful to families like mine that are new to the process.</p>
<p>Yes, I also fall into that category of not having any prep school exposure in my life until now, when I am trying to research on behalf of my d.</p>
<p>I find the slice of the community here at CC to be quite interesting including parents, applicants, and current prep students.</p>
<p>Now I will ask the dumb question about what percentiles people usually post... Do people here post the numbers that are the percentile of those taking the test (the lower percentile scores) or the percentile that the folks running the SSAT project as the percentile of all students of that age (including those who don't take the test) which is the higher set of percentiles? </p>
<p>Of course this isn't a dumb question any more because the only dumb questions are those not asked.</p>
<p>You're right, the only dumb question is the question that isn't asked, and I had the same question (and forgot to ask it). I THINK that the percentile being spoken of in connection to prep school admissions is the "SSAT percentile" in the box ("Your SSAT Scores") on the upper left of the score report page. Apparently (does anyone want to correct me on this point?--I'd really like to know) prep schools report their average (mean) TOTAL percentiles on the SSAT for each entering class, but other CC threads have shown that there is a broad range of scores that get in even at the most selective schools. </p>
<p>Good luck to all of this year's applicants.</p>
<p>tokenadult,</p>
<p>Congrats on your son's excellent test results.</p>
<p>That number was my hunch on the matter as well, but I thought I'd throw out the question to confirm. </p>
<p>Judging by the test scores I've seen posted here, we've got some well studied members! </p>
<p>My D's scores are not very impressive, nor did I expect them to be. Not to be overly critical, but my D is not naturally brilliant like many prep school candidates, but works hard to get good grades. Her main extracurricular takes more time from her life (with travel and such) than many spend studying. The prep school environment will allow that balance to change with less wasted time in her week.</p>
<p>But my D is looking to go to prep school for different reasons than many of the other participants here. So we have to look at other things like what a school does for the students who are not at the top of their class.</p>
<p>I'd be curious to hear stories about how the "jock" (I hate that term) crowd lives at these prep schools. I work at a well known public institution of higher education in the South and have heard stories both the negative and positive how students either are passed along (without much education) and how some students actually get the help they need to compete academically in school.</p>
<p>I'm just leery of having my D passed along at a school that only wants her for her special talent.</p>
<p>So if any of you have stories...</p>
<p>Fascinating to read all about the prep process (we just started applying for next year for current 9th grade son). I didn't know this thread was here! :-)</p>
<p>My son just his 9th grade first term marks and ended up with 4 "Bs" & 2 "As." Not very encouraging. He is in all honors classes, though, and has straightened up and started doing his homework so plans to get all As next term (do-able). </p>
<p>Wondered if this will really kill his chances at a good boarding school? I'm going along with this process reluctantly (financially it's tight) and would like to limit it if I can. </p>
<p>Though he did well on SSAT (800s -- sorry for the parental boasting...but thinking it <em>might</em> mitigate the Bs....! lol)</p>
<p>Goalliedad:I don't know how the schools use the SSAT in admissions. My guess is that it is a rough initial screen to ensure every admit is intellectually capable of a fairly challenging academic program that includes math, science and integrated humanities. After that it is more a question of "fit" and energy than anything else. As far as I can tell every student at St. Paul's is expected to have the intelligence and energy to combine a serious academic program with a sport or with a major time commitment in music or art. The surest way not to get in is not to apply. Have you looked at St. George's or Peddie?</p>
<p>We went to a very informative meeting about Andover last night in our town. An admission officer from Andover traveled all the way here because, "We don't have a ton of students from your state and we are actively trying to recruit students from your state." Indeed, in the most recently reported year, Andover had NO students from my state at all, but it is a school that mentions how many different states its students come from (45 or 46 in recent years). So I figure that young people in my state with a SERIOUS interest in attending Andover ought to at least apply, which may help Andover achieve a geographical diversity goal and make the on-campus environment more educational for everyone. </p>
<p>At the admissions meeting, the Andover officer asked the kids who arrived on time what grade they were in (and thus, implicitly, what grade they were applying for next year). There were four 8th graders, one 10th grader, and one current senior applying for a "postgraduate" ("PG") year. A few other kids arrived after the meeting started, who mostly looked to be 8th graders. The Andover admissions officer was aware of some of the subject-matter interests of some of the prospective students who have already started the application process. He asked everyone whether they play any sports. Only one student mentioned a team sport (soccer), while most of the other kids mentioned tennis. That surprised the Andover officer, who expected a different predominant sport in our state. I was surprised there weren't any lacrosse players, as that is a growing club sport here and now a varsity sport at our high school and some of the nearby high schools. </p>
<p>Andover practices flexible placement by ability and previous background in math, science, and foreign languages (which are all standard subjects for the first year and most following years). The other standard subjects, English and history, start out all students at the same level. By the senior year Andover students can pretty much design their own class schedules. About half of Andover's students do an interscholastic sport--the rest take physical education classes sometime during the standard time of the day reserved for sports, usually 3:00pm to 5:00pm. Extracurricular clubs meet from 6:30pm to 8:00pm, and of course there is a huge array of those. The Andover officer said that 9th graders often go to the club rally day in the fall and sign up for nineteen different clubs. Their advisers then suggest that they shouldn't spread themselves so thin. Study hour is from 8:00pm to 10:00pm and is fairly rigidly enforced for 9th graders (called "juniors" at Andover). </p>
<p>Andover has extensively reconsidered its residential life and advising systems under the leadership of Barbara Landis Chase, the current head of school. About 85 percent of 9th grade boarders live in single rooms--to ease the transition to living away from home--and all live in 9th-grade-only dorms. Every Friday has an advising period, during which students meet with their advisers in small groups, and every day has a "conference period," when no students and no teachers have classes scheduled, so that students can visit their teachers individually for help. All boarding students have house counselors in their dorms, and the house counselors are the lead contact for questions from out-of-town parents. </p>
<p>The Andover officer was surprised that no one asked, "So what is Andover looking for?" at our local meeting, so he provided the answer to that question himself. Andover is looking for students who are </p>
<p>1) motivated and engaged students--learners. Students have to desire to to challenge themselves and be curious to thrive at Andover. </p>
<p>2) serious about other things they do--having a passion or interest outside of schoolwork. "We could take the students with the top test scores and top grades and not look at anything else, but Andover would probably be a much less interesting place if we did." </p>
<p>3) good kids--without serious behavior issues. "We have to live with you. We have to be a lot more careful about this than perhaps a public school or a private day school. Most of the faculty live on campus, and many of them have young children." </p>
<p>We and some of the other families at the meeting were pretty convinced that Andover is a great school. Of course none of us know who is going to get admitted this year, but I think most of us would urge our kid to accept the offer of admission--while being reluctant about our kid leaving home. </p>
<p>We also heard that the annual Exeter-Andover games are quite intense. It would be fun to see those.</p>
<p>Yes, A/E day is huge. At Andover, we have an "Exeter Geek Day" on the Thursday before A/E games where students dress comically and jokingly poke fun at Exeter kids. The next day is "All Blue Day" where everyone, athelete or not, wears blue to demonstrate school spirit. Then we have a huge pep-really at 6:00. We had fireworks a few years ago, but the past two years we had to stay inside due to weather. This year, the games were at Exeter, and about 900 students went up there. Andover was like a ghost town that day.</p>
<p>Well, in short, A/E is huge here. Any Exeter kids out there? I'm curious as to what you guys do as traditions.</p>
<p>paleozoic:
I'm curious about your suggestion of St. George's and Peddie. Not that either have girls hockey teams, (Peddie doesn't), but is there something about those 2 schools that you know that works better with a broader population of test scores? </p>
<p>I know my D is a good team player and is generally considered a good leader in any activity - at least the post season player evaluations tell me that the coaches think she is a good leader.</p>
<p>I'm not sure how much that means or can be quantified or is easily demonstrated in an interview. My D is quite humble about leadership - is more of a quiet type who leads by example.</p>
<p>So I know she will be well motivated to perform in the right supportive situation as IMHO her EQ far outdistances her IQ.</p>
<p>I've put together a list of BSs with girls hockey programs with their reported SAT scores (a general indicator of what level (average) of students they work with). I'm thinking of using the SSAT projected SAT score to use as a match for schools, aiming to put my D about 50 to 100 points below the school's average. This student population will challenge her, but probably won't overwhelm. </p>
<p>You think that is a good strategy? Or am I getting overly analytical on the numbers?</p>
<p>Jolynne: I think improving the grades will definitely be a help as schools recognize that many kids don't buckle down until later. Does he have the extracurricular or outside talent that will make the difference?</p>
<p>Numbers are exactly that, numbers. My SSAT score on the verbal section was almost 30% lower than the average at Andover, but I am enjoying the English classes and finding them manageable. I would say let your D decide what schools she likes or doesn't like.</p>
<p>Are any currently enrolled Exeter students following this thread? I suppose they mostly just got back from Thanksgiving break today.</p>
<p>goaliedad: I suggested Peddie and St. George's because in their essential philosophy they resemble St. Paul's. The way you describe your daughter suggests she may fit there. </p>
<p>You may be wrong in the importance you attribute to SSAT scores. Much more important are her current grades at school. If these are good enough for her reasonably to aspire to go to a decent college--Rhodes, Sewanee -- if she stays where she is, she should have no qualms about St. Paul's. If I were you I would pick up the phone and talk to the director of admissions at St. Paul's and arrange for your daughter to meet with the athletic director to talk about hockey and humanities. Good luck. Do the same at Peddie and St. George's.</p>
<p>Post #256 raises the interesting question of how much contact a parent should initiate in channels other than the standard application process of requesting and filling out forms and submitting test scores. Would anyone else care to comment on that?</p>
<p>Well in terms of athletics, since there are no NCAA rules here, there can be open contact between recruiter and recruitee and parents, which to me is actually much more honest and above board than the dances you have to do (visit limitations, contact limitations, time of year limits, etc) when dealing with Div I college.</p>
<p>Hi, goaliedad, I wish I knew more about the world of sports to help you with your questions about that. I come from a long line of bookworms, and I think it was my wife's family that passed on enough inclination toward sports for my son that he has been willing to play a team sport (as I essentially NEVER did as a kid). Best wishes to you and your daughter as you look for a school that supports her sports interest and builds up her other abilities too. Like you, I'm looking at boarding school because of the reputation that boarding schools build up all of a child's skills to a higher level. </p>
<p>I do have one bit of advice about the test score numbers, in accord with paleozoic's advice. I'm not at all sure that the SSAT scores are as carefully and scientifically massaged as the scores on, say, the SAT (which gets plenty of criticism anyhow). Any score on ANY mental test is a "sample of learned behavior" (a great phrase I picked up from Alan S. Kaufman, an author of great books about IQ testing), and maybe the sample is just plain not very representative of the rest of a test-taker's behavior. You earlier mentioned your daughter's busy schedule, so that has to be taken into account in deciding how many schools to apply to, but if the hockey program is good, the other characteristics of the school look right, and your concern about well-rounded learning seems to be taken into account at that school, go ahead and apply. The schools decide what the scores mean and how much they influence each applicant's chances of admission. There may be some huge range of actually obtained scores among students who thrive at this or that boarding school. The schools only report a mean level of SSAT scores, and it is not at all clear what the whole range of scores for admitted students is at any school. </p>
<p>I'm embarrassed to say, as a fifth-generation Minnesotan, that I don't even know how to skate. So I admire those who do skate, and hope your daughter is happy with her search for a school at which to pursue hockey and other learning goals.</p>
<p>I thought folks in Minnesota were born w/ skates in thier feet......and you don't know how to skate huh? Very funny stuff up there in MN. Do you ice fish? That could possibly make up for not skating.</p>