Architecture?

College Majors Architecture Major
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the truth is, Yale Architecture School had never ranked No.1, the best so far is No.2.

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I never knew there was one sole, universally accepted set of rankings. They tend to disagree. This, however, is a very reputable one, with a very clear description of its criteria:
<a href="http://www.di.net/article.php?article_id=173%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.di.net/article.php?article_id=173&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>
[quote]
I guess you like Vivaldi's music, right?

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Yes - it's, well, structured. I like that. ;)</p>

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<p>Help me deciding which college I should attend.
I want to go to Harvard design school for masters, and probably for MArchII. (Do you know if MArch I is any less than II? I would need to attend 5 year program in order to take II. II just sounds better in the course description on Harvard website.)
I was admitted to these schools: MIT(4 year, I believe), Cornell (5), UPenn (5), Syracuse, UCBerkeley, CalPoly
My most likely choice will be either MIT or Cornell. I wanted to go to MIT for its being prestigious school, but then it has a 4-year program. Cornell is very tempting because it has such a reputation for being a great architecture school. I am really stuck. please give me some feedback if you know anything about Harvard design school, MIT, Cornell or any other schools I mentioned. Thank you.</p>

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<p>dawnlite, i have a similar problem.
ive gotten into Rice, Cornell, Syracuse, WUSTL and MIchigan.
Ive ruled out all except RIce and Cornell, and i need help deciding between those two!
Rice or Cornell?</p>

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<p>Dawn - MIT
Jimminy - Cornell</p>

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<p>Bozenuts05, could you explain to us the reason behind your opinion?</p>

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<p>Dawlite:</p>

<p>There has always been the argument over the better program: 4+2 or 5 years. Now a 5-year program is more rigorous and highly rewarding than a 4+2-year program. You get your B.Arch earlier and can start work. If you're not the artsy kind of person, the 4+2 will bore you as the first 4 years is all art history and theory of architecture, not much studio work and you'll get an A.B or B.A. before going for another 2 years where you'll get into architecture proper.</p>

<p>Definitely Cornell Architecture is far more reputable than MIT's. Not necessarily better (I think it is, anyway) but more reputable in the sense that Cornell is a very prestigious university and it has one of the most rigorous curriculums than in any other university. Cornell architecture stands out because the CAAP (college of art, architecture and planning) has a great deal of influence from world-renowned architects, a wonderful gallery and library. It really has a great heritage and it's the only school I know of that has a 'Cornell-in-Rome' program! What better place is there to study architecture than the home of modern architecture than the birthplace of modern architecture itself? ANd you will also have the opportunity to visit several cities of great cultural significance in Europe.</p>

<p>MIT is GOOD, but I think if an employer wanted a new architect and he saw two resumes, a graduate of Cornell and another of MIT, I guess the Cornellian (once a Cornellian, always one) will get more attention. Believe it or not, it's true. </p>

<p>Ithaca is a wonderful place with several natural waterfalls and parks, a great place to get architectural inspirationa and reflect. Though I can't say how Cambridge, the environment at Cornell is much better for architecture. Besides, Cornell has a much larger campus.</p>

<p>That's my argument. The choice, however, remains yours. In many ways I may not realize, MIT might just be the place for you. When you enter university, interests will change. Your passion may switch without notice. Or you may love to do several different things with your time. In Cornell, the college system there makes it very difficult to get in, and believe, even more difficult to get out(of the college). Those who can't survive either way are kicked out or transfer. Only 69% of CAAP undergrads made it out in the last five years. So if you're rough and tough and can meet the challenge, lace your boots! </p>

<p>Cornell gives you a good social life, very active and enjoyable. Cornell serves the best food! (THere's a school hotel on campus.) Cornell has a very high culture. One you won't easily find anywhere else. MIT is the no-frills, bare-bones type. If you'd prefer that, no problem.</p>

<p>I really hope this has helped though you have to realize that this is a very biased argument, lol.</p>

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<p>Tough choice. Yours to make, unfortunately.</p>

<p>Rice offers you an education in architecture that is unsurpassed. Extremely rigorous and demanding. Overall, rewarding. Rice is in fact the best in architecture (although some rankings place Cornell ahead.)</p>

<p>That's good. But Jimminy, let's focus on the future. You go for a job interview. The panel has to pick ONE from many would-be employees. Believe it or not, if there is a Cornell graduate, it jumps at them. Attention is switched. Nobody really cares whether you went to Rice or not because as far as they are concerned, it's no different from any other good architecture school.</p>

<p>The Ivy league holds a lot of influence, it captivates. This is one lesson I have come to learn. You're among 18% of selected applicants and you don't want to throw that away. Looking back in the future, you'll be glad you chose Cornell.</p>

<p>TO be honest, I don't know much about Rice, but Cornell and Rice interchange positions frequently. Each program is unique. There are pros and cons, fine. For example, IIT has a very, very unique architecture heritage and program. Based in Chicago, it was directly influenced by world-renowned architect Ludwig Mies van der Rohe. One of it's buildings is a historical landmark. It's archtecture is truly amazing. (I've been there.) You can't beat it. Coupled with the fact that it's in Chicago, America's premier architecture city - birthplace of the skyscraper, home of Frank Lloyd Wright, the Sullivans, home to the imposing Sears Tower. Students take real-life examples from undeveloped areas in Chicago and work on them in studio. There is a huge connection network and once you're done, there's always a fat job waiting downtown Chicago. </p>

<p>But that's just the IIT experience. And it's influence is very limited.</p>

<p>But Cornell has worldwide influence. A universal grip. The prestige is not just empty, it's backed by a solid archtecture experience, a broad education. Cornellians are great thinkers. You're in a place five equally or better qualified people struggled for. Do you want to let go? I think not.</p>

<p>This is a really biased argument. The choice is yours to make. Have you visited the two universities? I'm sure you have. But a visit says very little about the ACTUAL experience. You need to talk to experienced people - architects, employers, professors, etc. It's a very tough decision you need to pray over. </p>

<p>But if you ask experienced people, really I think Cornellium would have infected them already. You'll be shocked to find that almost everyone is suffering from Cornellia.</p>

<p>I hope this has really helped. Thanks for reading this unusually long post.</p>

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<p>dawnlite, if you want to attend Harvard GSD someday, your best choice is Cornell.Trust me, 20% of Cornell graduates can go to the GSD with full scholarship. And MIT, I think the most possible ending of your academic career there is to continue your professional study there. Although MIT is very close to Harvard geographically, it won't actually provide you more oppurtunities to get into the world of the GSD. however, Cornell has a very special connection to Harvard.MIT is a place for nurts, if you are not one of them, you'd better find another school.And a typical MIT education gives you too many science and math materials, and less humanities, that's why I think it basically loss the meaning of what you should learn in an architecture school. Last, and most important, MIT does not offer professional degrees, the degree you will get is BSAD,which meant that in case you got into Harvard GSD, you need to spend 3 years to finish your graduate study, it is a waste of time and money.Therefore, your best and only choice is Cornell.</p>

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<p>"MIT is a place for nurts"
*** is a nurt?
fallinwater, youre what, 17? maybe 16? you actually probably know less than most of the people who have applied already (i believe youre a junior still), so stop parading your false information around like its the last word. youre skewing peoples points of views on things they were already quite clear on.</p>

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<p>its not a personal attack or anything, just what i think you should do, or rather, stop doing.</p>

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<p>MIT is a good program and very well known. I spoke to an architecture frim in Chicago and they said MIT is an excellent school</p>

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<p>i've gotten into berkeley, usc, and nyu. </p>

<p>i think i want to go into architecture, but i've never really taken any classes so i dont know for sure i want to go into it. if not architecture i guess i'd go into art or business. where do you guys think i should go? i know that berkeley and nyu have good business schools (HAAS and Stern), and berkeley and usc have good architecture schools. it seems as though berkeley would be the best choice for me, but if i TRULY wanted to go for architecture where would you guys recommend then? berkeley or usc? i heard that ucla has an architecture program, but is it any good?</p>

<p>and if anyone is curious, i am the artsy type of person so i'm kinda worried that ill be going to a way too theoretical or too technical type of architecture program. any advice will help me a lot, thanx in advance.</p>

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<p>If you are not sure what you want to do, go to USC. They have exceelent architecture programs, busniess programs and many other options. Did you apply to the USC architecture school?</p>

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<p>yea i got into usc architecture, berkeley undeclared, nyu urban planning and architecture studies.......</p>

<p>i think i've ruled out nyu even though i do love new york. i cant get a degree in architecture from there though. as for usc the 5 year plan scares me, i do want a social life and the fact that im like 40 min away from home sucks too since i want to be waaaaaaaaay farther than that. i guess my only option left is berkeley.... but what do i do then? i always thought i wanted to be doing stuff in art, and then architecture but the other thing that bothers me is that i have to be good in everything to be an architect. and i do excel in many of the required fields, but that's high school (having to put up with all subjects) and i dont want to have to KEEP doing that and then get a crappy salary for all that work. i dont think im that into business considering i have no clue what goes on in it. </p>

<p>so now my REAL problem is if i have been denying myself my real passion for art.... cuz i always thought that i cant do art for anyone but myself, like i dont like working strictly under someone else whose bossing me when it comes down to drawing. i consider art as a hobby and an enjoyable past time not something where i have to meet constant deadlines and stress, drawing stuff i dont want to draw....... but then again i dont know if i just came up with that lame excuse thinking that a lot of artists come out poor and underpaid. architecture isnt that much better is it?</p>

<p>sorry for the long rant. career choices are hard..... and i hope this isnt advertising, but if anyone is curious you can see my artwork at
<a href="http://sohl.deviantart.com%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://sohl.deviantart.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>if you think its not so great, it's cuz i do this stuff in my spare time, if i have spare time from school. other than that i think i have a lot of room for improvement. oh yea, one last question, as an architect do you think ill have some freetime at least? enough time to keep up an art hobby.......</p>

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<p>wow Jrock, thanks for that detailed reply. and thanks to Fallinwater and Bozenuts, too. I was actually leaning towards MIT before I read your opinions, but now I don't know what to think. I guess I need to do more research.
Jrock, at first reading your resent post here, I thought you were a Cornell student, but then I read some more of your previous posts, and I see you are a high school senior. where are you going for college yourself? I mean, if you had no concerns over the finacial aids.
and I have a question to all of you who's reading this. I heard from someone that Cornell is on decline, mostly for its financial troubles. Is that based on truth?
oh, and one more thing. I am very confused about the architecture programs at harvard GSD. so if I graduate from cornell I will spend 2 years more at GSD, and if I go to MIT I'll have to study 3 more years there? is that right? But then they both amount to 7 years, don't they?</p>

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<p>


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<p>You won't get a crappy salary! You'll actually have to spend very long hours on the job, but then, the pay is good.</p>

<p>And dawnlite, you have to realize that if you enter the 5-yr program, you'll have a professional degree. That means you can start working as an architect right away. Then after earning some pay you can go to grad school and get an M.Arch after two years.</p>

<p>The major difference is that, if you do 4 years and get a B.A., you can't work as an architect. You have to do 2 or 3years to be able to practice your profession. Not everyone is actually interested in doing architecture however. Some just love it's history or the scientific aspect to it. so if that's what you like, no deal.</p>

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<p>yes, i agree with JRock, getting a BArch is definetely better than a BA or a BSc. This means you can also, if you want, forget about an MArch or whatever and just stay with the BArch and practise.</p>

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<p>savvyz0r:
i loved your comic fantasy manga style art. i have a friend who does the same sort of stuff as well. youre very talented. the thing about an architecture education is what you make of it, not what college you got to. as long as youre motivated to work your butt off and have a natural artistic flair and sense of space, youll be fine.</p>

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<p>Let me begin by saying I am an architect, licensed since 1982, as well as the head of the architecture program at our local community college, I am also married to an architect. I regularly advise students on transfer and graduate school admissions. Last year's students include 1 at Cooper, 1 at Rice, 3 at IIT, and 2 at UIC. We are in the Chicago suburbs.</p>

<p>Reality check #1-Though architecture is a wonderful, creative activity it is a group process, you have to coordinate with many people, some brilliant, some arrogant, some average etc.</p>

<p>Reality check #2-In general the B.Arch is considered less prestigious and more of a vocational approach than the B.A. + M. Arch. The M.Arch is necessary for teaching.</p>

<p>Reality check #3-All architects must complete an internship period of 2-3 years minimum before taking the exams which usually take 1 to 1 1/2 years to complete. Until you are licensed you are not an architect.</p>

<p>Reality check #4-A minimum of 75% of the work of architects is in something other than design. Architects spend huge amounts of time negotiating with clients and contractors, researching materials, coordinating with engineers, preparing code analysis, construction details etc. If you like solving puzzles and enjoy a never ending series of "what if..." questions you are a likely candidate for architecture.</p>

<p>Reality check #5-Architects don't make much money! Repeat architects don't make much money! Starting salaries vary with region, 40 k in Boston is a lot less than in St Louis, but whereever you are it won't be enough. It never is a lot unless you are the principal of the firm. When you are you find you are spending time reviewing contracts and insurance policies and are even more removed from the work of architecture.</p>

<p>Reality check #6-Architecture school rankings are not that important. You will always have your portfolio, this shows what YOU can do. A school name is important to support someone in a field with less tangible products. The school name is not meaningless but less important than other fields. You will all begin as "computer jockies" anyway so make sure you have concrete production skills. The school ranking link on a previous post begins with this quote; "Any school with a score of three or less. They may be the best teaching schools in the world, they may be producing the most sought-after architectural employees: but they are not the planet's intellectual leaders." One of the schools with 3 or less is the Cal College of Art, a very good school that also had the highest pass rate for the ARE, Architectural Registration Exam, of any school in California a couple of years ago. Make sure you know what the statistics you are looking at are telling you. Data analysis is a critical skill for architects. (As is communication, Fallingwater you need to work on language skills or proofread your posts)</p>

<p>Reality check #7-All architecture programs have a terrific attrition rate. The typical line at the freshman orientation assembly is "look to your left, look to your right, only one of you will graduate". 33% is actually optimistic it is probably less. Why? The combination of art and science the reality of the professional experience and compensation ends up dissuading many people. </p>

<p>So what does it mean? Go in with your eyes open, every architecture student thinks they are the ONE. We all start out arrogant, read the Fountainhead, by Ayn Rand or look up what Tom Wolfe has to say about architects in the Right Stuff or Bauhaus to My House. Choose a school with a solid program, in the area of the country you want to work in, check out it's licensing stats, check out the faculty, go and visit. If every student's work looks the same run, they are a school that thinks they know the answer, if you disagree you will be miserable. Give up on a social life. Forget double majors. Your design studio will expect you to work on architecture every minute available. More than 2/3 of my architecture faculty is married to architects. Why? Because they were the only people we ever saw. When I was a student I shared a house with pre-law, pre-med, english, and engineering students. NO ONE worked anywhere near the amount of architecture students. Architecture students routinely have 24/7 access to their building. </p>

<p>If you love architecture go for it. I can't imagine anything else that would make me happy. One of the reasons I chose it was that it would give me a field that would always be challenging, that would never be mastered, It has lived up to my expectations</p>

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<p>Thanks SRMom3 for that insightful post.
Truth is, architecture is fast losing its grip on me and I don't know what else I can do. The requirements are sort of tough considering where I am from - Nigeria. The important aspect is the portfolio. Though I got in at IIT, WashU and USC School of Architecture with half-rides at USC and IIT, I don't feel too challenged.
For USC, I had to send in a portfolio. Most of my previous work had gone unrecorded and I practically had to do everything from scratch. (After all the trouble, I didn't make the Trustee Interview.)
I modified the portfolio and sent one to Cornell, and I was rejected.
WashU required slides for the architecture scholarship but there was no place I could do slides in my country (at least in my city). So I forfeited the scholarship there.</p>

<p>I want to give myself a year break and rethink the whole thing, and do things differently.</p>

<p>I'm very sure my portfolio wasn't too good compared to those of others, which could have been a major factor. I really do not know what is really expected in a portfolio. Please could you shed some more light on the issue. I included pencil drawings, quite simple paper models, a house plan (drawn by hand), and colour drawings. The pencil was my strongest medium through which I portrayed animals, objects and other things. (Didn't that appeal to the architect?) So I'm really frustrated - "What do these guys really want?" And if I want to have another go this year, I'm not so sure I would apply for architecture at Cornell because I can't create another portfolio.</p>

<p>You said that 4+2 is more prestigious than 5? So would it be better to get in for a 4yr B.A. at some place where you won't need a portfolio (e.g. Princeton, etc)? Because that would certainly reduce the stress a little bit. I was at IIT for Camras, and the Director, Steven Stenner, strongly recommended the 5yr program.</p>