<p>So I am now attending a top private college on the east coast. This summer I went home to the midwest and audited a couple of classes (orgo, bio) at my local state school (ranked higher than 100). I was shocked by the quality of teaching for the orgo and bio classes. Those professors were much better teachers than my professors. </p>
<p>Now I'm wondering if spending 50,000 per year at a top private school is worth it...</p>
<p>That is an interesting question. Here are a few observations:</p>
<ul>
<li>I have an undergraduate degree from a public university that is considered a “top” university (College “A”). I have a masters in the same subject from the state flagship (College “B”) in the state where I moved after college. I consisently found that the teaching quality at College B was MUCH higher than the teaching quality at College A. However, the quality of students (intelligence, quality of class discussion, diligence in things like group projects) was consistently higher at College “A”.</li>
<li>We produce a ton more PhDs than we have jobs for. So an awful lot of very, very bright people are looking for college teaching jobs. Lots of them end up at “lesser” colleges. I know a couple of amazingly bright guys who ended up at third tier LACs or “directional” universities because that is where they could get a tenure track position – but these were top notch students in undergrad who went to highly ranked graduate schools.</li>
<li>You are probably aware that colleges with graduate schools often don’t give as much attention to their undergrad students. They would all raise a hue and cry at this accusation, but it is often true. The professors focus their attention on the grad students. And the grad students (who are often paying their way by teaching sections) are the ones paying more attention to the undergrad students.</li>
<li>This also raises the issue of “research quality” vs. “teaching quality” in the hiring decisions of top colleges. Research institutions generally reward research over teaching.</li>
</ul>
<p>The answer is top private colleges are not better than the elite public schools in many ways including the actual education itself. There are numerous outstanding public schools that have contributed enormously to the nation’s brain trust and deserve credit.</p>
<p>Nevertheless, the systems are different and you choose based on what you think is a priority. Often private schools give you “access”. This could be in the form of an elite alumni network. It could also be an increased perception of prestige in the marketplace. Then again, a great public school also has these available. No one can objectively and honestly say that UC Berkeley, William and Mary, UMass Amherst or Georgia Tech or any number of elite public schools are “less than” the top privates in any substantial way.</p>
<p>Basically, it comes down to your perception and what you want during and after college. Many feel that privates are just plain “better” and believe that the privates offer the best education, increased prestige due to exclusivity, social access and future employment prospects. Many prefer the state schools for their perceived egalitarianism, generally far better sports teams (exceptions do exist like Stanford and USC, but Harvard and Yale are not know for great football teams), camaraderie and often deeper regional influence, etc.</p>
<p>Basically it is up to you.</p>
<p>IMO, top private colleges are not really that much better in terms of quality of education than their public counterparts. However, two things distinguish top private schools from public schools: quality of your peers and network. That is, top colleges create the sort of environment where you will feel academically challenged. You will be among the best of the best - la creme de la creme, so to speak. Your peers are bright, very motivated, and very accomplished - well, the majority of them anyway. </p>
<p>Further, top private colleges offer you an extensive network with which to find a job after graduation. For instance, the Ivy League is still the prime hunting ground for Wall Street recruiters. The network will get you places when you’re looking for a job or applying to graduate programs. But the Ivies are mainly notorious for sending graduates to top Wall Street firms. </p>
<p>Also, the Ivies are notorious for their generous financial aid packages. If you’re paying $50,000 year, then it may not be worth it. But if you’re one of the majority of kids who are on aid and are paying much less than the ticket price, then yes, it is definitely worth it.</p>
<p>The match between a student and the college is what really makes the difference. I knew a a family with a student who went to Cornell, and she was miserable, miserable, miserable there. Stuck it out for two years, before transferring to Penn State, their state school, and she could not have been happier. This is not an isolated instance either. Happens all of the time. However, the top schools in reputation, rankings, most selective, tend to have the best retention rates with more of their students getting a degree in 6 years. That is a statistical fact. Whether their education was better, they liked it better, is more difficult to measure. </p>
<p>I’ve known Harvard undergrads who came from selective indepent prep schools, say that the lack of attention there for undergrad was a shock. I doubt large state schools will do any bettter in that regard, but compare that to the attention one of mine got at a LAC, yes, he got a lot more. The panache, lustre, whatever of some of the top schools can cover a lot of the issues there. But whether it’s because the students going to these top schools have better stats and the selection is more intense, or if it’s the material presented, the top schools generally do well in educating their students. Whether its “better” for any given student is an individual thing.</p>
<p>I think it depends on what you mean by “better,” and that’s going to depend a lot on the individual student’s needs and wants.</p>
<p>Very well stated, OsakaDad.</p>
<p>There’s a big difference between the research reputations of professors and their abilities to teach. Many moons ago I had the opportunity to audit a class ‘taught’ by a Nobel winner. It was a disaster. He was disorganized, incapable of explaining his subject matter in any remotely understandable way and completely socially inept (to put it mildly). It was like watching a great athlete explain how it is that they’re great - they can’t explain it, they just do it. Or to paraphrase Woody Allen, “Those that can, do. Those that can’t, teach. Those that can’t teach, teach gym.” </p>
<p>That’s an obviously gross oversimplification but the point remains. “Prestige” comes from the great accomplishments of the staff in their areas of expertise, not from their ability to teach that information to others.</p>
<p>Second, just remember you may have gotten lucky with your audit class. In every department at every school there are good teachers and bad, you may have lucked into one of the ‘good’ ones at the public.</p>
<p>Third, a lot depends on the material being presented and your style of learning. To my mind it’s hard to imagine that there can be a lot of variability to the data transfer that is teaching organic chemistry (gawd, there’s three months of my life I’ll never have back). Obviously there was something there for you, but other students may have found the same teacher intolerable.</p>
<p>Finally, to your question and something that stabs at the very heart of too many threads here on CC. For the vast majority of students there is no difference between the learning experience at an elite East Coast school or a third tier public. Most just want to get their degree, find the right party for that weekend and get a decent job with as little fuss as possible. How many of your friends say “I’m going to fill up on the toughest classes possible” versus, “Ooh, Rocks for Jocks, lots of cute girls in that class. I’m in.”?</p>
<p>There is nothing special about the “place”; you aren’t automatically smarter or better prepared simply for having walked around Harvard for four years. You decide if Princeton is prestigious by your ability to exploit the opportunities that are available to you (Note: Remove Princeton and replace with any college you care to name and the statement is still true). It’s the individual who decides his or her success not the institution.</p>