Asian rejected from everywhere POSTMORTEM

You display great maturity and are very talented. Your loss is also a loss for those schools to which you applied but passed you over. I just wish you had applied to some top LACs known for strong STEM programs – you would have been a valued classmate of my daughter’s this fall when she heads off to Carleton. You are certain to be successful at most anything you do.

Thanks for the comments everybody!

Something that I left out of my postmortem is that I’ve been in communication a lot with people and staff at Ark and genuinely believe that Ark is a good fit for me (not just “my only option”), as good and in some ways better than any of the Ivies. My GC is very well acquainted with the Dean and I’ve gotten to know him this last month. For one thing, they have gone above and beyond to support me, and when they heard I was deciding between a gap year and ark they immediately gave me their highest merit scholarship even though this was in APRIL and people started applying last SEPTEMBER. They also invited me to have dinner one-on-one with several professors in the chemistry and physics department, who are amazing people doing quite impressive research; I have never heard of this happening at any other school to “woo” a prospective matriculant. They have really made me feel like they care about me and want me to come in a class size of 30,000, where at most schools they would have just tallied me in their yield column and moved on.

@pastwise I totally agree with you - in fact what I would say is that being focused on college admissions caused me to give up a lot of the things I genuinely loved doing like being Captain in my Varsity teams, or fully developing my abilities in research. Of course my comments are directed towards people who are applying, and are only relevant to a very specific subset of those applying, so I do place some emphasis on what I could have done different in hopes it might help someone else. However right now I’m happy where I am and don’t frankly give a swot about what I could have done better and I feel better than I have in a long time :slight_smile:

Wow, given OP’s stats, the odds of being rejected by all these super selective schools are quite small. It is just so unfortunate. I feel this personally because my son (Asian background) was in a similar situation last year. But he was lucky enough to get a few admits from these super selective schools, along with a bunch of rejects and waitlistings. As someone pointed out, OP’s application strategy is certainly too ambitious. Why dind’t you apply to schools such as WashU, CMU, etc.?

But in the end, it is okay. As some research shows, one’s success in future career is more correlated with SAT scores than with which school he/she goes to. You should do fine no matter where you go for college.

Large state schools in the midwest often get the brightest kids in the state, which is a bit different from the coasts. In retrospect, you should have applied to different kinds of schools. All of your schools are essentially the same: midsize private schools with the worst admissions percentages in the country. Your numbers are awesome, but all of these schools turn down most of the valedictorians who apply. Good luck at the state U, and more admissions luck when you apply to grad school (also, notice that even the best grad schools take plenty of kids who went to non-super-elite private colleges).

^Actually, that’s a misquote - the research shows that the sat score of an individual doesn’t relate to their future success, but rather that their success can be correlated to the aggregate average sat score of the university they attend OR -even more surprisingly- of the university they were admitted to but chose not to attend. This is especially true for first generation, lower income, or urm students.
This doesn’t apply to OP though.

Being a 'big fish ’ can be great, and it looks like 'UArk’knows what a gem you are and how lucky you are to have you. I’m glad they recognize this and made you feel so welcome. It does change things for you.
Stay as long as you can, taking graduate classes, studying abroad and ‘away’ sophomore year perhaps (some colleges allow study 'away’second semester freshman year as well as sophomore year, depending on the programs). If you find that uark doesn’t suffice - considering usamo qualification and senior -level math in high school, this may happen- know that Vanderbilt offers full financial need for transfers. A gap year would allow you to apply to other universities to find a different peer group but it sounds like Uark is going to make sure you can continue your education apace. You won’t hang out with professors though, so see if you can meet honors seniors who do pure maths or physics, or grad students in stem fields you’re interested in.

“UArk” not being a LAC, I’m pretty certain that the grad-level courses there would suffice.

In any case, I think you’re set up well for PhD admissions (profs in PhD programs are looking for apprentices, not to holistically set up a class, so the criteria is quite different).

“Wow, given OP’s stats, the odds of being rejected by all these super selective schools are quite small.”

I think this is a misstatement and misleading. I applaud the OP for his candor. I think his experience is a point of information for all students who might be in similar situations. I am glad he is finding his place at the U of Ark. and am confident he’ll be successful. I do think if he had been given better advice about which schools to apply to he would have had more choices.

I agree he’s probably well set for a PhD (the 'apprentice ’ analogy is a great one) but depending on what areas of stem he’s interested in he may not find it at UArk at the level he needs. Graduate programs have specialties and so do not offer classes beyond grad level 1 in all areas of the field. They will offer three or four classes or levels in specialties only.
How many classes will be available to him each semester? I would assume 'enough ’ but he’ll be starting at graduate math level his freshman year and it’s impossible the flagship covers all areas of math, for example. If they cover the specific fields he’s interested in, good, but it’s possible. An additional hurdle is that math PhDs tend to be ‘snobbish’ in what they want (names/brands/classes) and it’s hard to evaluate how that would or would not impact, keeping in mind there’s no math professor on a flagship 's faculty who isn’t at the top of his/her game. (IE., that may have zero impact but if OP realizes it does, he should feel able to transfer).
Chemistry, physics, etc are 'flatter ’ in that respect, and it’s clear OP will go on with very interesting research, a prime spot in labs, etc. So for a PhD in those fields things should go well.
Another reason why a student who does research at a state flagship may want to transfer is that a public university is submitted to political decisions and budget cuts. It sounds he’ll be protected from some effects of these decisions, as they tend to impact lower level classes in which OP won’t enroll.
All in all it’s heartening to hear how much uark has gone out of its way to help him find his place there.

@MYOS1634, OK, but at the grad-level, is math at Vandy so much better than at “UArk”? Doubtful.

And for research and lab stuff, so much comes down to research grants, not state funding.

We don’t know (what flagship is this? What areas? Compared to what at vandy?)and OP doesn’t at this point, but it’s quite possible, especially depending on fields.
Of course, since OP saves tuition by being at UArk so might not need info about fa for transfers at all, if that became a necessary consideration.
I’m trying to say that I’m glad uArk is rolling out the red carpet but if necessary OP shouldn’t feel indebted to them and should recognize it’s not the be-all end-all.

For the benefit of other students, with his stellar stats, the OP could have considered the super selective LACs. My D’s good friend (incredible grades, test scores, etc…) was rejected at all the HYPSM-type schools she applied to, but accepted at several top LACs, including Amherst, which she will be attending. She is Asian too, and her parents were initally upset and thought it was very unfair. They had never heard of Amherst before she applied, but I explained to them that the people who matter (she wants to go to med school) have heard of Amherst. Her parents are now delighted, and the Val, who mostly applied to the others because her parents wanted her to, is over the moon.

Kids with stellar stats should also look at the path OP has taken. He has been welcomed and given even more money, and is learning to love the place he got accepted to. He is impressed with the professors and staff he has met. He is going to meet plenty of other talented and intelligent students who chose his college. There is no reason to think that state universities have lesser professors. One thing I think OP has demonstrated is that there are great educators in all kinds of schools, not just the twelve he applied to.

@MYOS1634, right, but my point is that for someone like the OP (who would be doing many things on the grad level), Vandy may not actually be a step up (at least in terms of educational and research opportunities). They’d have strengths and weaknesses in various areas as well.
If he does look to transfer because he’s run out of opportunities, the top state schools which are research powerhouses would be a better bet (though frankly, if he’s run out of opportunities at “UArk”, he probably should just apply to PhD programs).

Isn’t part of the point that the OP would have benefitted from adding a few less super-selective schools – adding super selective LACs doesn’t really help. He might have applied to Williams, Amherst, Mudd – and gotten the same results.

For other readers’ sake only : such results were less likely at Williams (math advantage), Carleton (intellectual versatility advantage + being considered urm not orm), and probably HarveyMudd (they *really * like usamo qualifiers).

Thank you, OP, for sharing your experience. Your future sounds bright, and your post will be very helpful for a lot of kids.

And to second @Lindagaf, the academic talent in this country runs very deep and some state schools that aren’t very hard to get in to at the undergrad level are global research powerhouses. Yet some of these profs who may be among the best in the world in their subject get few or almost no undergrads of the caliber that they are use to in research or their education or among their grad students, so a superstar undergrad could get superstar treatment (some within an honors college; some just identified and tagged as superstars).

Congrats on coming out the other side of a long, hard journey, OP. “Go where they want you” is too often overlooked, but is really valuable. Have a great adventure…and when you get to Stanford or MIT for grad school come back & tell us!

Kudos to you, OP, for sharing your adventure as it will no doubt help others in similar situation. You’ve handled this with maturity and grace and you no doubt have a fabulous future ahead of you. Take advantage of everything “UArk” has to offer as you’ll be a very big fish in that Midwestern pond. Plus, think of all the $ your parents are saving for grad school.

This statement is simply not true. The odds of being rejected as an unhooked applicant are actually very high.

Not convinced about Mudd or Williams. Agree the OP would have like gotten into Carleton.

I have no doubt OP will be very successful and will get his choice of PhD program, fully funded :slight_smile: :slight_smile:
I hope he’ll come back to tell us how his year is going and ultimately where he chooses to go for his PhD .