<p>Bit of an odd title, eh? Well, let's see if we can get a little background established. </p>
<p>At the start of any student's high school career, a path is presented. You can choose to take only the essential classes presented and required for graduation, or you can prepare for higher education and take preparatory courses to fulfill future admissions requirements. Being as ignorant as I was, I chose to follow a technical school path (which I found towards the end of high school to, quite frankly, no longer be worth the investment). As such, I lack(ed) a few essential college preparatory classes, as well as and standardized testing.
Fast forward about four years, and I have a semester of community college under my belt. Why only one? Well, life unfortunately has its twists and turns. To my advantage it turned me in a rather beneficial direction, albeit a little later than ideal. It was my intention (and still prime objective) to join the AFROTC in association with a four-year institution (most likely NCSU or, wishfully thinking, Duke). After a recent discussion with an admissions counselor at my current community college (CCC&TI), it sounds as though that might not be possible. </p>
<p>Under my belief and unsound grasp of the subject, in order to successfully complete the AFROTC and have the most beneficial academic standing, you would be required to attend one particular institution for four years (in succession). There stand some exceptions where you can complete it in three, but it becomes a bit more complicated. The scholarships associated with the ROTC look to require similar academic standards (and I can explain why I am so fascinated by the idea of their scholarships, as it's a bit of conundrum of its own).<br>
Having that in mind, it was my plan to complete the Associates degree while at community college to obtain the essential preparatory courses, and any core transfer requirements. I assumed (which you should never do....) that it was my choice as to whether or not I could transfer in as a freshman or junior. Thus, my question. </p>
<p>Being a student missing the core admission requirements, is it a viable option to complete an Associates degree and transfer in.... as a freshman? Is something so absurd even possible? </p>
<p>I'm at a bit of a loss here, so I figured I would turn to one of the largest culminations of collegiate-minded individuals for some further insight. </p>
<p>I would like to add that this does not involve remedial classes. The only requirement not met is the 2 years of foreign language and SAT / ACT test scores.<br>
Upon taking the entrance exam for appropriate placement into community college course work, I ranked well above the remedial level. </p>
<p>If you complete an Associates degree (NOT as a dual enrolled HSer) then you would be a transfer applicant. It is not possible to apply as a freshman. And ROTC scholarships are highly desired and highly competitive. If you really want to have your education paid for you may want to consider enlisting. You get your GI Bill and some college credit from your tech training.</p>
<p>From what I can tell, there is almost zero chance that you can transfer as freshman, with an Associates degree. Maybe there are couple of colleges in the country where this could happen but even that sounds far fetched. The key question is “how many credits remain to earn the degree?” Even with an Associates degree, it could take up to three years to complete some majors (engineering, for example, which the Air Force would love you to do).</p>
<p>For AFROTC, the requirement is that you have at least 3 years remaining to complete your major. This is not hard to make happen – change your major when you transfer! The foreign language requirement also would help with this.</p>
<p>Also, DO NOT TOTALLY TRUST a guidance counselor about ROTC, nor your own interpretation of a website. Instead talk directly with an AFROTC officer; in person at the university of your choice, if possible. I believe you can make this work.</p>
<p>If you have any interest in the Navy or Army, both of them offer 2-year scholarships and you definitely can get one when transferring from a community college.</p>
<p>For what it is worth, it appears to me that the Air Force has gotten a lot more restrictive with their requirements plus less generous in their policies. The two year scholarship is an example of the first (they used to have one) and the AF really wants you to attend a state university (to save money, I imagine).</p>
<p>If you take a look at the AFROTC college locator, you can see that in North Carolina they list several community colleges for crosstown enrollment. This means that the Air Force has made some provision for transferring from a CC, or those colleges would not be listed. This is the kind of thing to talk to an AFROTC officer about. Perhaps, you could enroll in AFROTC next term as a crosstown cadet, then find a way to continue at CC for another year (reduce your course load?), and transfer later than you had planned.
<a href=“College Locator | U.S. Air Force ROTC”>http://www.afrotc.com/locator</a></p>
<p>It was indeed my intention to major in Engineering, most fields of which are apparently strongly sought after. I believe, from what you say, the most likely course of actions to take given my current restrictions is to stretch the remaining two years into three.<br>
By doing so, do you know if you would have to enroll in both GMC courses (Freshman and Sophomore) at once? I recall reading on the AFROTC website that such was possible. Then the summer between Sophomore and Junior you have the chance to attend Field Training?<br>
The crosstown just isn’t possible at the moment, as I live an hours drive away from the closest CC to offer it, and almost twice that for the host university. </p>
<p>And, it isn’t so much that I want them to pay for my education, it’s the state of mind that comes with knowing that they’re as invested in me, as I am in them. Even if I enlisted, I still lack the appropriate high school courses, and would have to do the majority of this as a result. Unfortunately, I have just barely enough credits to be considered a transfer student, as well. </p>
Yes, I agree. Probably the best course, especially if your major is engineering. Rather rare to finish an engineering degree in four years anyhow. Five is far more common.</p>
A assume that you are talking about the 2 years of foreign language. Correct? Is there no way around this? Take these at CC, maybe? Also, a lot of engineering schools waiver any foreign language requirements. So check that out too.</p>
<p>Also, if it is the foreign language requirement that you are talking about, there definitely has to be at least one AFROTC school in North Carolina which simply does not require this. I see this as a smaller barrier than it appears to be. Maybe I am wrong, but I think there has to be a good way around this.</p>
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AFROTC has changed its website so extensively this year that it is not clear to what degree scholarships are part of the picture. It barely even mentions cadets who are not on scholarship. At first I thought that AFROTC had dropped the non-scholarship path. Anyway, if you do not care that much about the scholarship, then this might be to your advantage.</p>
<p>I’ll agree on their subtle alterations. That website offers such conflicting information sometimes I question if the overseeing body of people know what they’re doing. The amount of specificity they place on the scholarships is a bit worrisome; different bodies of text read that you cannot hope to sign on without it, and others barely recognize their existence.<br>
But, that’s probably just my confusion talking. </p>
<p>As for the entrance barriers, I refer to both the high school requirements, and the transfer student requirements. The admissions counselor at my CC led me to believe both were important (I don’t mind taking the foreign language; as it is, I wanted to at some point). The larger barrier comes from the transfer requirements into an engineering-specific school. Most have requirements for a multitude of high level math courses (which I am confidently working on, assuming finishing the Associates still stands to reason) and chemistry / physics. The physics is currently my last standing barrier, as my CC doesn’t offer a high enough degree of physics.<br>
I don’t know if that’s something they can overlook until you take it under their curriculum, or a bare minimum that MUST be met. </p>
All the more reason that you will be able to stretch from two years to three years to complete the degree. This should not be a real barrier, just a delay. Anybody can normally transfer, regardless of what has been completed (an Associates is rarely required, for example). Very unfortunate, however. Seems like a CC should do better than that. :-? </p>
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Is this only for NC State and UNC-Chapel Hill? Have you looked at UNC-Charlotte and East Carolina too? Maybe they are less demanding.</p>
<p>I think I might be placing to much emphasis on the language, as you said. I really appreciate all the trouble you’re going to, to find a solution to a problem that’s not your own. Very commendable! </p>
<p>It’s funny with the physics, too. The CC even tells me that I can take it to fulfill graduation requirements, but also that they don’t actually offer it. Talk about fun times.<br>
Do you think bringing up the “three-year” extension with a ROTC rep. would be a worthwhile endeavor? Also, do you have any specifics on that? If you have an Associates, or two years worth of credits… where does that place you on the academic scale when entering, if you want / need another three years to complete a Bachelor’s? Would you enroll to the general college, and than apply to the Engineering specific branch? </p>
<p>I apologize for all of the questions, but you’re the first individual I have run into that has provided some solid headway into the matter. I very much appreciate all the help you’ve given! </p>
Yes, absolutely. Military people like straight talk, and you won’t be successful beating around the bush anyhow. The AFROTC specifically says you would need to “have three academic years remaining in a four-year degree program.” Notice that it does not say that you have to be a sophomore or a freshman. I have no doubt that this was worded very carefully. Plus, I bet that it would take you three years to finish an engineering degree after an AA or AS degree. Odds are you would qualify for the “three years” requirement without even trying.</p>
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It probably does not matter. Lots of folks are juniors, strictly speaking, but still won’t graduate for three more years. Personally, I had this happen to me. Partially because I majored in engineering, but also because I didn’t have my “ducks in a row.” The fact that you might need to take a freshman physics class even after completing two years of CC is an example of how those categories really don’t matter much.</p>
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This depends entirely on the university in question. Check with NCSU and any others you are interested in. Sometimes you have to get accepted into a specific program, but sometimes you can get admitted as “undecided.” Depends on the school.</p>
<p>By the way, since you mentioned Duke, does this mean that you have the money to go there? Or would you need a scholarship? If you have the money, then you should look outside the state of North Carolina for any schools which have don’t require foreign language from high school.</p>
<p>Also, if you are older than 21 then some requirements fade away. Check that out, if you are or will be over 21 when you transfer.</p>
<p>There are a few exceptions among four year schools, where applying as a frosh after completing significant post-high-school college work is allowed. Given the OP’s ROTC interests, some of these exceptions may be worth considering, such as the USAFA.</p>
GREAT POINT! – This happens every single year at every service academy.</p>
<p>Also, the U.S. Merchant Marine Academy is a legitimate path to an Air Force officer commission (look it up, it’s true), and is considerably easier to get into than the other service academies. I saw in the newspaper back in the spring, that a student at the local college (not high school) was accepted into USMMA. So, that is worth looking into.</p>
<p>(Let’s see if I remembered how to quote correctly.)
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<p>I have to sincerely thank you for this. Not just for the information, but for a good dose of hope too. Sometimes it all just gets to you, and you sort of lose hope you can do it. I appreciate it. </p>
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<p>Well in reality, that’s just wishful thinking. I will certainly aim for it, but I understand if I don’t quite meet the financial barrier it withholds. I will definitely check out some out-of-state schools; any recommendations?</p>
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<p>23 this year, 25 by Associate’s time of completion. Had a few obstacles in life, such as it goes some times. Better a little late than never! </p>
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<p>Sadly, that was a consideration I made too late. Just a little bit too old for that now, I’m afraid. I’ll be keeping an eye for other exceptions though, so thank you for the suggestion! </p>
<p>So, most important thing right now is to get an appointment with an ROTC rep., and possibly admissions for more concrete facts / pathway? The sooner the better, I imagine. </p>
<p>Being 23 has its advantages, such as some of the high school requirements are dropped (at least at some schools). No time to waste, though. If you get your AS at 25, but take three years to get a BS, then you will be 28. So you are looking at being about 6 years behind your contemporaries. Not a huge deal, in my opinion. I see conflicting information about age limits for getting an AF commission. I have seen ages 30, 34, 35, and 48 mentioned in different places. In other words, all over the map.</p>
<p>Yes, make an appointment to speak to an AFROTC officer. Preferably one currently at a university, but an AF recruiter is better than nothing.</p>
<p>Frankly, I do not think it is crazy to just walk in the door at an AFROTC unit nearest to where you live. They will not ignore you, I guarantee. Just walk right in, with a good haircut, and nice attire (not a suit, but not jeans either) and tell them you want to talk to the Executive Officer. I did this for NROTC at Miami University in Ohio; not for myself but to get information for my nephew. Had a great conversation.</p>
<p>Otherwise, I recommend starting with email addressed to the Executive Officer. If you can get their precise name and rank, all the better. The XO might refer you to somebody else, but he or she is the best place to start. Don’t get too complicated in the first email, just tell them you are in CC now, and interested in transferring to the AFROTC program as soon as possible, plus you would like to speak with them. Try to meet them at the college, if possible. It is amazing how much more helpful people are when you are in the same room with them compared with a phone call. </p>
<p>If you really don’t have much in the way of financial resources, I suggest staying in-state. I thought maybe you inherited some money or something like that. </p>
<p>In-state is remarkably cheaper in the long run. Alas, no inheritance. </p>
<p>I’ll post back when I can get an appointment and hopefully (most likely) some more information.
I really do appreciate the help. You’ve given me some fantastic pointers and leads to follow. </p>
<p>Didn’t notice the post about the USMMA; do you think that might be worth pursuing, given my age? My deadline would be July 1, 2016. I’d only need to cram some science and math classes in to meet the academic requirements, and make sure my credits per semester met or exceeded 12 credits. Doesn’t sound too tough, assuming I am understanding correctly.<br>
The only points of concern are the physics class, which I might be able to find at another CC (perhaps they might offer it online, too) and the three letters of recommendation. I’m not sure how I would get these, being five years out of high school. I wonder if letters of recommendation from college professors would count? </p>
<p>Yes, I think the USMMA is worth pursuing. Personally, I would have chosen it over my NROTC scholarship if I had known that I could get a Navy commission through “King’s Point.” In fact, I am now working in the logistics field, which is one of the majors there.</p>
<p>I did not notice that its age limit was 25, unlike 23 for the other service academies. You can do it.</p>
<p>Actually you still have time, barely, to apply for entry next fall. I say “barely” because the Senators and Congressmen are already accepting applications and probably already doing interviews. USMMA has a deadline of March 1st. If you are interested, go to the websites for both of your Senators and your representative and see what they say. Each member of congress (MOC) has a slightly different process. Probably need to write you MOC’s within the next week or two.</p>
<p>My guess is that whatever physics you can take at CC would be good enough for USMMA. They are only asking for either high school chemistry or physics; not college level. So I think a CC course would be sufficient.The bigger problem seems to be the SAT or ACT test. Seems like you indicated that you had not taken either one. That needs to be done. If you are unable to apply for fall 2015, then aim for 2016. </p>
<p>Even if you feel unprepared at this time, it might be worth trying anyhow, just for the experience. It will not count against you a year later, and probably will make you more confident.</p>
<p>The great thing about USMMA is that it gives you several options upon graduation. You can serve in any branch of the military, including Coast Guard, or stay civilian. However, you will definitely be learning about ships. All the majors revolve around ships and the shipping industry.</p>
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