Attacking Harvard

Colleges and Universities A-Z Harvard University
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<p>Over the past few days, I've read many posts on CC and articles online about all the negative aspects of Harvard. Everything seems to indicate that Harvard isn't a great place to spend four years. It seems no other school is attacked quite as much as Harvard is. While other schools are built up as great places to study, Harvard always seems to be criticized.</p>

<p>Since being admitted, I've had many doubts about enrolling. Although some rave about the great experiences they've had at Harvard, the overwhelming majority of the comments I've heard have been negative. </p>

<p>I suffer from no illusions that Harvard is the best college in the world. Instead, I've come to feel as though Harvard is in fact not a great school and attending Harvard would be a poor choice. </p>

<p>Is it possible that everyone is just rooting for the underdogs?</p>

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<p>There is a tendency for people to shoot and attack the guy at the top, and since Harvard just happened to be the first school founded in America, and a good school, each school in budding new america tried to model itself after Harvard.</p>

<p>See, HYP happen to be basically some of the oldest schools in the US. They never really did anything revolutionary to get their prestige, but rather just perpetuated a reputation of giving a strong education for hundreds of years... and nothing more really. What I am getting into here is why HYP are considered so prestigious; they just were the first few established in America, and didn't suck.</p>

<p>Moving on to your question. Is Harvard really that good? Remind yourself this: Harvard is JUST a school. As is Yale. And stanford, and MIT, and Caltech, etc.</p>

<p>The reason why Harvard is attacked so much is that society has perpetuated and fluffed the Harvard reputation SO much, to an excess. Ask someone why they chose Harvard over another school, and they often say Harvard's....Harvard. </p>

<p>(A quick side note: Did you know that society's obession with Harvard has partially been self-perpertuated by Harvard people in the media? There was a study done for Harvard grad authors in papers such as NY Times, and whenever they had to chose a source of recent research, they always went to Harvard to mention in their article, EVEN if there were better research being done at other Universities. In addition, authors that mentioned Harvard "as the pinnacle of American education" all also happened to go to Harvard too. Since THe Crimson is so huge, and has powerful connections with the journalism media, a lot of Harvard grads are put into position of journalism where they self-perpetuate Harvard's image. Next time you read an article that says how Harvard is the pinnacle of education, check the author's background. Almost everytime I've done it, he/she's been a Harvard grad.)</p>

<p>No school is as magical as people make out Harvard to be, so everyone else tends to attack Harvard to prove this. Does it mean that Harvard isn't a great school anymore? Of course not. It is just not the magic-land that people make it out to be, that, if you go there, your life will be magical and awesome forever, and you become immortal.</p>

<p>Now that you've had Harvard's bubble reputation popped, give Harvard a REAL look. Look at what Harvard has to offer. Yes, there is grade inflation, and yes, there are a lot of elite people there and z-listers. But, you'll find this at other places too (Princeton? Yale?). Look at the people, the profs, the staff. Do you fit well with them?</p>

<p>As much as I am anti-Harvard, I advise don't count it out; look at Harvard as a school like you would other schools, and see if it fits for you. If you think it is the best fit, then go by all means go there. If not, then by all means don't go there. And there is almost nothing better after this whole college application process than getting to say "I turned down Harvard."</p>

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<p>"Everything seems to indicate"</p>

<p>Does this "everything" include the opinions of current undergrads? Because no other source has any weight compared to that one.</p>

<p>Are there ANY current undergrads, or even recent alumni, on this board, who are part of that "everything"? Because I don't think there are. And if you're hearing these attacks from current undergrads on some other site or publication, let's discuss them. Are you?</p>

<p>"there is almost nothing better after this whole college application process than getting to say "I turned down Harvard.""</p>

<p>If you can even put this kind of bragging in the same CATEGORY as attending your dream school for four years -- which is, you know, another thing that can come after this whole college application process -- well, that's pathetic.</p>

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<p>Keep in mind that the last sentance about turning down harvard was meant to be tongue in cheek.</p>

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<p>I would attack the "turned down Harvard" comment, but I entertained the thought until the MIT rejection and my improved understanding of Harvard's sweeping initiative lol.</p>

<p>As for the OP, Harvard = Yankees, in a nutshell. And you know how much everyone hates the Yanks.</p>

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<p>The</a> Harvard Crimson :: Magazine :: The Cult of Yale</p>

<p>Student</a> life at Harvard lags peer schools, poll finds - The Boston Globe</p>

<p>I'm just trying to gain some perspective here. I am merely commenting on what I've encountered. The reason I made this thread in the first place is to discuss this topic. Please don't knock me for asking.</p>

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<p>Why doesn't the College of William and Mary have any prestige despite its age?</p>

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<p>No clue 10char</p>

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<p>I apologize for the offense "turning down Harvard" has seemed to garner; I only meant it in jest. I would echo the same sentiments about MIT, Yale, Stanford, Princeton, etc.</p>

<p>Something I also want to make clear. I offer the same precaution thats I do about Harvard for other schools held in a very high regard, such as MIT (where I am going) Yale, Stanford, and Princeton. </p>

<p>I am just saying it is important to seperate school and perception within society, and choose the place best for you (Cliche, I know. But it's true). I was split between MIT and UChicago in terms of choices. Both are excellent schools, but for some reason people saw MIT in a higher light, and would tell me "no no, why are you even debating? Choose MIT dude! How can you not?" To other people it seemed to be a question of prestige, when that's not what I care about.</p>

<p>I ultimately chose MIT not because it is MIT (as in for people's perception of it), but because of various factors such as location, offerings, and people.</p>

<p>It is about seperating reputation from the truth. In the same way you have to seperate all the build up Harvard gets, you also have to seperate all the criticism it does too.</p>

<p>Choose the school, not the reputation.</p>

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<p>I'm not knocking you for asking. I'm knocking you for being so credulous regarding sources who are not and never were Harvard undergrads. If "the overwhelming majority of the comments [you've] heard have been negative," then it sounds like you are assigning equal weight to comments from Harvard undergrads and comments from everybody else. And that just doesn't make sense. I don't think you would poll Lithuanians to find out what it's like to grow up in France.</p>

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<p>^Hanna^</p>

<p>There have been polls of students at Harvard which showed they were often unhappy and stressed out. See the links to the articles above. The OP has justified his claims with those sources, one of which is Harvard itself.</p>

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<p>Being regarded as Number One automatically paints a big red bull's eye on your back. People generally like success, but some people get turned off by what they consider to be too much success. Consequently, these people are just going to hate Harvard no matter what.</p>

<p>Harvard University, The New York Yankees, Microsoft, Disney, Starbucks, California, and The United States of America are all organizations that are wildly successful and have a legion of haters because of it.</p>

<p>I don't pretend that Harvard is perfect, but it does many, many things very well. It's got a LOT more going for it than merely age. (Ask William and Mary how age alone will get you). If you can wade through the hate and mindless objections to anything famous and actually enroll, the chances are very good that you will love the place and get an excellent education to boot.</p>

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<p>What about the OP's article sources (one of which is Harvard itself) that indicate students are stressed out and not as happy as students at other elite institutions? </p>

<p>Not saying this is true, but no one seems to be answering the OP's original question with evidence, personal or otherwise.</p>

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<p>^^Who hates California? LOL.</p>

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<p>William & Mary is very prestigious, esp in the South. Its not like Harvard but then again who is. The historical problem with W&M is that its buildings were burned down, alumni base killed and endowment erased during the Civil War. It basically shut down during the 1880s and got started again a a public school in the early 1900s. Reborn from such humbling times it has actualy done extremely well. It compares quite well to its peer group of Georgetown, Dartmouth, Haverford, Chicago and Davidson. It has become the best small public college in America and one the best teaching institutions of any school, public or private.</p>

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<p>OUCH. Dang, seems like William and Mary had it pretty bad in the past.</p>

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<p>A lot of people who do not live in California love to criticize, disdain, and mock California. Collecting anti-California writings could easily be a full-time hobby, like stamp or coin collecting. Same for anti-Harvard screeds.</p>

<p>And like Harvard, a few of the California critics actually live there. The genesis of the gripes about Harvard by Harvard students comes from two main sources: the budding intrepid reporters for the Crimson and the nature of Harvard students. </p>

<p>First the Crimson: basically <em>every</em> college newspaper feels it is its duty to to dig up dirt, scandal, and dissatisfaction about their own school. It's the nature of "investigative" reporting. It's how the would-be journalists make their bones in the business. So no matter how perfect the school, there will "always" be Crimson articles from time to time attacking Harvard. </p>

<p>As for the dissatifaction so loudly expressed by a few Harvard students - a big contributer is the type of students Harvard attracts in the first place, namely smart and articulate people with high expectations. And if some of those expectations fall short, as they inevitably will for a few, these smart, literate Harvardians are much more likely to write a magazine article or book about it than are the students at State U - witness Ross Douthat.</p>

<p>I know a bunch of Harvard students, starting with my daughter, and they all love the place. My daughter is a senior and she says when walking from place to place she'll even go a little out of her way to walk through Harvard Yard one more time, because she knows she will be leaving soon and will miss it so much.</p>

<p>Is Harvard perfect? Of course not. Are some students disappointed for one reason or another? Yeah sure, a few, but they are the rare exception, not the rule. If you are bright, hard-working, and confident you won't find many places better than Harvard to go to college.</p>

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<p>All I have is anecdotal evidence, so please don't take this too seriously. Both my brother and my sister went to Harvard - 25 years ago. Both of them found it to be a very high pressure, competitive environment. They call it "swimming with the sharks." I went to Princeton, 30 years ago. I found it nurturing, but socially requiring a somewhat inflated personality.</p>

<p>Princeton these days has changed. But, the core culture is still place. My guess is the Harvard these days has changed, but that still, the core culture is still in place. Stereotypes are usually there for at least a fragment of a reason.</p>

<p>So if fun, or community, is your first priority, probably Harvard isn't the best fit. But it is still Harvard. Just that if you are a little thin-skinned, Yale might be better. And if you are more fond of belonging and networking, Princeton might be better. And so on.</p>

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<p>
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^^Who hates California? LOL.

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<p>Republican candidates not named Reagan :P</p>

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<p>One thing to keep in mind is that people choose Harvard over any other school even when accepted to Harvard, Yale, and Princeton (check the cross-admit rates). Similarly, virtually no one chooses to transfer out.</p>

<p>Most of us learned a long time ago not to brag too much about Harvard is because then you're 'that Harvard d-bag,' whereas if you're comparing yourself to someone else who consensus says is better it's not considered impolite to highlight places that you're awesome. Listen to all the other Harvard STUDENTS and ALUMS on the board, not second-hand knowledge from friends of friends and people who have never actually attended. Harvard is an amazing place to be with opportunities and resources that are unparalleled elsewhere in the world, and until you get here it's impossible to really understand what Harvard is all about.</p>