<p>This is exactly what I’m talking about. Conversation goes like this:</p>
<p>romani: What issues are important to you?
Student: X, Y, Z, family values –
romani: [see quote above]</p>
<p>At no point was there an attempt to convert anyone to supporting family values, yet accusations of indoctrination are rampant.</p>
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<p>IB, I posted before I saw your post. We seem to be on the same page.</p>
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<p>No matter the moral stance of the issue, everyone is entitled to an opinion, no matter how backwards or dysfunctional it may be considered. Just my view.</p>
I believe tripe would be very inappropriate at a tea party - try bringing scones or shortbread biscuits…much more cultured. And, be sure to cut the crusts off the cucumber sandwiches.</p>
<p>As this will likely get shut down for being political if I refute much of what was said, I will not contribute further along these lines and bow out of the “debate”.</p>
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<p>Indeed, and my apologies. I thought this was about professors imposing on their students so that is where my train of thought came from. </p>
<p>Too many Catholic school years to not think that “family values” is imposed by all who spew them :p</p>
<p>smorg:
This is not a condition limited to the left. You’ll find in this country that being openly atheist draws all sorts of nasty prejudiced conclusions as a matter of course. </p>
<p>In my experience, people are almost always able to set aside their disagreements and treat each other with civility, decency, and a handshake, despite any political or religious disagreements they may have. But if someone considers it a matter of course, for example, that those who support abortion and other family planning practises are murderer-apologists, or that gay people have something seriously wrong with them, then a lot of folks aren’t going to take kindly to their views. Everyone’s entitled to their opinion, just as everyone is entitled to an opinion on others’ opinions.</p>
<p>Then you have clearly never been in politics. If there’s one thing I learned as a Senate intern it’s that civility does not exist anymore. It’s absolutely terrible. It truly, truly is. Among regular people, we’re usually at some level of civility and decency, but not among politicians. I got out of that really quickly.</p>
<p>Interestingly enough, I think it was Olympia Snowe who retired because of this. I don’t blame her and I absolutely adored her. I also believe it was her, and it may not have been, who attributed this to politicians no longer living in Washington together. They used to share meals together, no matter what side of the aisle they were on. In someone’s words (roughly): it’s hard to be uncivil to someone that you’ve broken bread with.</p>
<p>After watching how some tourists treat their guides (I’m assuming Senate duties are like House duties?), I can totally see that.</p>
<p>Joking aside, I concur: civility is on its way out. Even among regular people.</p>
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<p>Certainly. I mentioned that there are liberals open to opposing view points in my previous post.</p>
<p>I do disagree with you on the religious matter. I’ve never had any trouble with it, but then again, my views on the matter are kept extremely private.</p>
<p>Clinton said, “It depends upon what the meaning of the word ‘is’ is.” The point was to clarify an issue of tense, even if it did come across as absurd.</p>
<p>You said, “It depends on what the meaning of the word beating is,is.” This sentence doesn’t make any sense.</p>
<p>There is a strong liberal bias on this forum. When a kid asks for liberal schools - people will post Brown, Reed, etc. However, when a kid asks for conservative schools they will say something like “why do the politics of a school matter or they tell the kid hes narrow-minded or college is a time to see new viewpoints” OR others will post third tier religious schools like Liberty or Bob Jones even when the kid has 2300+ SATs or 3.8+ GPA - purposefully giving them bad advice.</p>
<p>There are enough elite schools where I feel smart conservatives can thrive - Princeton, MIT, Dartmouth, Duke, Vanderbilt, UVA, Wake Forest, Colgate, Notre Dame, Lehigh, Boston College, Washington & Lee, etc.</p>
<p>Perhaps not, but conservatives can thrive, be comfortable, and speak their mind at those schools and I feel that is all most young republicans want. At schools like Columbia, Brown, NYU, etc. the students tend to be more closed off to conservative viewpoints (against gay marriage, abortion, etc.).</p>
<p>A while ago I started a thread asking about LAC’s and political leanings. During our recent college visits DS found himself liking a couple of well known left leaning LAC’s and was personally concerned about what his life might be like if he opened his mouth. I pondered the wisdom of posting such a topic on this forum because frankly, one can get pretty electronically slapped for suggesting such a thing.</p>
<p>I did get some heartfelt responses and a few more in depth PM’s on the subject. I do find it curious that such things as food, view from the dorms, urban/rural/suburban, weather, availability of good coffee houses, diversity (the PC defined kind), access to skiing, etc. are all not only acceptable criteria to consider but can be discussed in length on CC. However, mention a concern regarding the life a non-liberal student might encounter and the posts inferring a closed minded attitude, an desire to shelter and control your kid, suggestions subtly ‘addressing’ your need to stop being a putz…and oh yes…the predictable thrashing of the RCC, …yup, those posts are pretty much predictable and guaranteed. </p>
<p>Although CC has officially stated political threads are not allowed, it is curious to see which ones survive anyway. It will be curious to see if this one survives since it is - as much as the others - a discussion of college life.</p>
<p>Absolutely nothing wrong with the above situation. It is denial of such a reality that is the concern.</p>
<p>Anecdotal evidence. Documented anecdotal evidence also. I cited a page load of various abuses of power committed by university administrations (as somebody pointed out, they weren’t all examples of the kind of bias I’m talking about, but I never said they were and that wasn’t the point, the point was that the page contained loads of examples of the bias I was talking about so people didn’t have to take my word for it).</p>
<p>My point was not necessarily that it happens all of the time (though it happens more frequently then I’d like to admit), in fact, I didn’t have a point. I had a <em>question</em>, about how liberals reacted to bad behavior from other liberals. I wondered if it was a commonly held viewpoint among liberals that it was okay to abuse the classroom for political indoctrination or if only a minority of liberals felt that way.</p>
<p>I had hoped to spark peoples’ curiosity but maybe I have to cite five or so specific examples to get people to understand what I’m talking about:</p>
<p>TomServo: As a subscriber to FIRE, I’ve already read most of the links you’ve posted. I do remember having a jaw dropping experience with the University of Delaware case.</p>
<p>I only clicked on one of those links, the last one. </p>
<p>He crossed a line. There is a difference between teaching that Catholics view homosexuality as immoral and saying that you yourself find it immoral in a classroom. As a member of the LGBT community, I would be extremely offended and hurt if a teacher said that because it WOULD make me feel like I’m being judged by my professor. </p>
<p>I also went to a Catholic school for 9 years and was bullied very badly by students and teachers because of my sexuality so this is a very, very personal issue for me. </p>
<p>Fwiw, I have taken religion classes in college. Including religious ones. Including ones with Catholic professors. I have been taught what Christianity thinks about Catholicism, but it’s one thing to teach it and another to proclaim it as YOUR belief system. YOUR beliefs should not be in the classroom. This holds true for liberals and conservatives. THAT is the difference and THAT is why he was fired. A professor should not be “taking sides” or agreeing or disagreeing, especially with something that condemns students, only presenting the “facts”.</p>
<p>It’s not at all clear to me from reading the article exactly what the professor said, and in what context. But it’s a little puzzling to me to that a professor would be forced to refrain from revealing his own stance on controversial issues, especially if that restriction is only applied to one side of the controversy. If anything, revealing his beliefs would seem to be more honest, since it would alert students to the possible presence of bias in the non-personal statements the professor makes.</p>
<p>I think we can all agree that most of these examples are flagrant and regrettable. The same sort of thing occurred with leftists up until the 1960’s, and now it’s the other way around. Obviously, this sort of censorship is a trend that ought not continue.</p>
<p>There’s a difference between exercising free speech and open discrimination. It’s still legal to hold any opinion you want, but when you start discriminating against groups based on their race, ethnicity, sexual orientation, political views (as you would agree), etc., people will naturally react as they see fit. Nobody’s being thrown in jail for this, but I’m allowed to think that people who speak in this way are morons, and act accordingly (to clarify, I think professors/teachers/etc. should grade without bias. You can’t really help your opinion of a person, however). Unfortunately there is a double standard, but you’re creating a strawman in blaming political correctness for the actions of a few overzealous school officials, just as I would be to denounce Christianity for the actions of the Westboro Baptist Church. </p>
<p>At any rate, I’m sure we all put up with people with whom we disagree. I smile and nod at economic and social conservatives just as you do at Marxists and environmentalists, and as I’m sure people do when I talk about my own radically leftist political views. It’s part of everyday life and I agree that we should all just get along</p>
<p>A liberal Muslim homosexual ACLU lawyer professor and abortion doctor was teaching a class on Karl Marx.</p>
<p>“Before the class begins, you must get on your knees and worship Marx and accept that he was the most highly-evolved being the world has ever known, even greater than Jesus Christ!”</p>
<p>At this moment, a brave, patriotic, pro-life Navy SEAL champion who had served 1500 tours of duty and understood the necessity of war and fully supported all military decision made by the United States stood up and held up a rock.</p>
<p>“How old is this rock?”</p>
<p>The arrogant professor smirked quite Jewishly* and smugly replied, “4.6 billion years, you stupid Christian”.</p>
<p>“Wrong. It’s been 5,000 years since God created it. If it was 4.6 billion yeras old and evolution, as you say, is real…then it should be an animal now”.</p>
<p>The professor was visibly shaken and dropped his chalk and copy of Origin of Species. He stormed out of the room crying those liberal crocodile tears.</p>
<p>The students applauded and all registered Republican that day and accepted Jesus as their lord and savior. An eagle named “Small Government” flew into the room and perched atop the American Flag and shed a tear on the chalk. The pledge of allegiance was read several times, and God himself showed up and enacted a flat tax rate across the country.</p>
<p>The professor lost his tenure and was fired the next day. He died of AIDS and was tossed into the lake of fire for all eternity.</p>
<p>Semper Fi.</p>
<p>*I’m an observant Jew and can never make it past this point without completely losing it from laughter.</p>