My son graduated from MIT and full disclaimer- was not in engineering. But most of his fraternity brothers were, and they all made it out in four years with a major and a minor. According to my son, if someone takes five years, it’s usually because they are taking advantage of MIT’s “fifth year Master’s” program- as I recall, if you have a B average or better, you can automatically take your fourth undergrad year as the first year of a two year Master’s program, finish in “Year 5”, with no application, no GRE’s, etc.
You do need to communicate with your advisor- not just before freshman year, but a few check-in’s during the semester, and then frequently afterwards. For the kids I know IRL, this seems to be a huge hurdle- just communicating with someone who is getting paid to keep you on track. Parents grind their teeth- kid didn’t realize a pre-req was not “optional”, or kid didn’t realize that taking a light load one semester was going to bite them back later, or kid went off to an overseas program without checking (and verifying, and checking again) that the credits would transfer. This isn’t rocket science but it takes some organizational skill!
My son is currently an Aero Senior in the COE. He is on plan to graduate on time. He came in with 39 credit hours from APs which gave him more than enough time to pursue 2 minors, participate in the Marching Band and have a few semesters with lighter loads. He applied to go on for a fifth year to get his masters. Only real downside to the AP credits is that it gave him Junior standing (and the higher tuition rate that goes with it) sooner than if he had not claimed the credits. He actually dropped one AP class credit to delay that effect an extra semester.
I finished my EE degree 35 years ago in the typical 4 year time frame, but I knew several folks that had to go for one or two semesters more. Dropping a class can lead to a domino effect causing you to miss necessary pre-reqs.
This is why my son took 2 classes at a community College in the summer. At Michigan it was like $11,000 with room /board or some crazy number and at a cc it was like less then a $1,000.
So yes fifth year BS/MS is popular with engineering. So wonder how that is factored. Probably stating it took 5 years I guess. Schools like UIUC take Aps from 3-5 scored. Some only take 4/5 and limit which ones they take. Every school has a different focus on this. We paid Junior status a semester early. Totally sucked
Here is a sample schedule for University of Michigan mechanical engineering (with no AP or other advanced placement, but also no remedial course work, starting in calculus 1): Bachelor’s Degree – Mechanical Engineering
Note that it requires 128 credits, or an average of 16 per semester (15-17 in the listed sample schedule). This is only slightly higher than the typical 120 credits needed to graduate in most majors at most universities.
However, because of prerequisite sequencing, students need to carefully plan their schedules so that missed prerequisites do not delay graduation. See Bachelor’s Degree – Mechanical Engineering .
Whether a student is likely to need more than 8 semesters depends more on student characteristics. Academically stronger students are likely to finish in 8 semesters and not need any extra (including summers) (academically stronger students are also more likely to have advanced placement that leads to more schedule flexibility). Students who have large outside commitments (e.g. work to pay for school or family obligations) may be delayed in graduation due to being unable to take ~16 credits per semester.
Yes, we paid it for an extra year, it would have been 3 semesters had he not dropped one of his classes. At least back then the AP credits counted toward your registration seniority. I don’t think it does anymore.
Mine could have graduated in 3 years and 2 quarters, she came in with 1 AP that was acceptable to engineering. The last quarter she only took 2 classes. Internships every summer and part time job on campus, so it’s doable.
My son is freshman. Technically he can graduate in 3 years and a quarter with AP credits, but we told him to graduate in 4 years. Courses are tough enough, and we thought he should not sacrifice his grade due to the course load. If he wants to attend the grad school later, GPA has to be high.
When considering graduating early, you really have to trace through all the prerequisites and see how long senior project is. A student can have the classes to make it through in theory, but the order can trip the plan up.
As another example that it can be done, my son attended a school that has a 60% 4 year graduation rate across all majors. He finished his BS and a thesis based MS in ME in 5 years.
So many college open houses told us most of their engineering students graduate in 5 years. We always questioned this. Our money, right? They stated as above kids need to retake classes, drop classes to have an easier load etc…
Also the stress of engineering can be real. I told my kids that the mental health department is up the street and use it as needed. I told them if you have to go an extra semester, extra class, drop a class or extra year it was OK and budgeted for. Some kids just can’t take 16-18 credits a semester.
My son told me they all “struggled” together. Let your students know they “might” drop a whole grade point their first semester /year from high school. High school was a breeze for most of these kids. Engineering is not a breeze. My son got his first “C” ever and when “I” panicked and offered a tutor he told me this was the “good” grade for the class. Upperclassmen told him some classes you just gotta get through… …I just used to hear that even the easy class’s are hard… Your kids got to swallow their pride and get used to going to TA classes, math /science labs for help. Peer to peer help. Professor hours. Learning services. HINT :This is how the good students get through. Engineering is collaborative. So is learning it. This is hard for many kids to learn early on.
Planning is key. Sometimes you have to take a class out of sequence. It happens. Persistence and the will to succeed. It’s not always the smartest that make it through…
How selective were these colleges? Less selective colleges have lower graduation rates due to having more students who cannot handle full course loads (in engineering, or any major).
Just needs to land between 3.0 - 3.5 GPA for good job offers. Do as I said above especially with the weeder classes. That’s why I said persistence can trump grades. Lots of kids drop out in the first semester /year in engineering. My son used to tell me kids walking out mumbling "not going to be a doctor or engineer now), class sizes were less every test. Persistence…
https://www.rose-hulman.edu/academics/academic-affairs/irpa/reports/CDS-AY2020-2021.pdf indicates that 73% of the fall 2014 frosh graduated in 4 or fewer years. It also says that 73% of students major in an engineering major. So that means that even if all of the 27% not graduating in 4 or fewer years was in engineering, that is still less than the 46% who graduated in 4 or fewer years in engineering.
Ha, this was in 2016 and I don’t memorize them all… Lol. It seemed like every school was stating the 5th year warning. Purdue, Michigan State, Wisconsin, Vandy, Berkeley, UIUC definitely… Etc.
Purdue did an about face on that by 2018 ; ). Stressed that everyone could be out in 8 semesters.
D just found out today that she could go down to part time status 2nd semester senior year and just do her final engineering design class. Would save 1/2 a semester tuition but she has a bunch of graduate level courses that she’d like to take.
But doesn’t Purdue have a decent number of students doing co-ops, which can result in extended calendar time, but not necessarily more tuition-paying semesters, to graduation? That could mean that the 4 year graduation rate may be significantly lower than the 8 semester graduation rate.
Ha… , it’s just what they all said. UIUC was the worst with the “look to the left then look to your right speech.” Great program but bad optics to us.
At Michigan the head of engineering showed his first year grades. D, C, E, A, B. He is now the head of the department. Lol… They say getting a B there is like getting an A at most places. So they know. They expect kids to struggle some. But I will tell you (like you don’t know😉), that the classes are very hard to prepare them for the real world situations. My son is in his first year leadership program and nothing is that hard. Learning new stuff sure… but not prepared… No way… So it’s hard for a reason.
…I just used to hear that even the easy class’s are hard… Your kids got to swallow their pride and get used to going to TA classes, math /science labs for help. Peer to peer help. Professor hours. Learning services. HINT :This is how the good students get through. Engineering is collaborative. So is learning it. This is hard for many kids to learn early on.