During info sessions and campus tours, I have heard admissions officers say their college is looking for nice (meaning not mean or bad) students. In fact, at some places like Dartmouth, Davidson, and WashU, it felt like they were making a big point about this. (And it does seem at those places we met really nice students.)
I get that selective colleges take a “holistic” approach. BUT is “how nice you are” REALLY a factor in one’s admissions to a selective college? If so, how do these schools judge that? Teacher recommendations, volunteer work, peer recommendations in the cases of Dartmouth and Davidson?
I think it shows up in letters of recommendation. Not being a nice person can show up in your essays, if you say anything that tears down other people or shows excess competitive drive.
And many people like politeness. Writing a thank you letter or email after a tour, going out of the way to praise your tour guide by name, dressing nicely for interviews and being on time. Basic things that show you respect the other person.
Yes, it is hard to figure out if someone is “nice” from an application. But I imagine that there are cases when admissions officers can get hints from LORs, the essay, how applicants conduct themselves in an interview etc.
Regardless of the impact on admissions, one should strive to be a good/kind person.
At one school that made a very big issue about wanting “nice” kids, they also put a lot of emphasis on the interview. I think in addition to the letters of rec and essay, they felt they could learn a lot about a kid in 45 minutes of one on one conversation.
Most people would think that they are nicer or can act nicer than other applicants, and would be encouraged to apply based on this perceived boost, resulting increased applications received. And that’s the very purpose of offering campus tours.
@happy1 - I agree one should just be a nice person regardless of college admissions or not, always…at least after coffee.
@gallentjill / @ucbalumnus - yeah, I bet it does show up in interviews. I read this (https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2018/9/12/harvard-student-admissions-file-analysis/) a few weeks ago and I really didn’t piece it together. But I guess this fellow Diep came across to his interviewer as just a really nice guy. I’d read another story about a HS student who didn’t have overly impressive scores but was just a really like-able guy who got into Princeton or Yale…or some where. Or a girl who’s hs janitor wrote her a recommendation and she got into a selective college.
I can’t imagine that happens too often (admitted just cause you’re nice without the scores), but I imagine if you’re scores are within the range and it’s a choice between Nice & Not-Nice schools would rather have nice students on campus. BUT as @SculptorDad / @ucbalumnus suggest “mean” applicants can effectively hide that…sometimes.
Seems like those interviewer ratings in Harvard’s admission rating scheme do not have “grade inflation” in that it is possible for an applicant to be admitted with only 2 and 3 scores (1-6 scale, with 1 being the best).
I think significant volunteer work (long term, many hours - not the 20 hours required for graduation) does show niceness - or at least demonstrates you care about something or someone besides yourself.
Davidson doesn’t allow interviews so they don’t get the info that way. I think they draw it from the LOR and the peer recommendation. I heard the admissions director say they are looking for students who have shown they are ‘good friends’ as in good to their friends. I also know character is on their admissions rubric.
I agree it’s hard to pin down and seems potentially squishy – but so are other aspects of the process.
Seems like if AOs went on a driving test or witnessed how applicants acted at the airport that would be informative. Barring that maybe @Groundwork2022 has a point as well, volunteer time says something. I just looked at a CDS form and noticed volunteering is on there as a possible admissions factor.
When having to choose between equally qualified candidates I imagine admissions people are swayed by gut reactions to how the applicants come across in essays and LOR’s.
I think of it as being “decent” – a person who treats others well, does not make their high school classes and experiences all about themselves. Grade grubbing, jostling others out of the way for leadership or publicity in high school, can suggest that someone will be the same in college, and that can be antithetical to the communities some schools emphasize.
A couple of years ago when we visited Tufts at their info session the AO said they look for nice kids. She said it comes out predominantly in the LOR, but also in the contributions made to their community.
It would help to think what “nice” means in the admissions context. Just being what most of us call nice (polite, respectful, caring, not too aggressive, etc) isn’t it. It’s a rather default compliment, if you think about it, not a driver. Sometimes not a compliment at all. You can be nice but not qualified or be shallow. Nor is it about helping an old lady cross a busy street.
And it wouldn’t be enough just for an LOR to say she’s “nice.” That could even be ‘damning with faint praise.’ It has to come through from the applicant, the choices he/she has made, the ways she’s involved, his perspective he presents, it has to show. That’s not, “He comes into class with a smile” or the 100 hours at the nursing home or library.
But funny: so many posters say not to do or be what the college wants, just be yourself. That may not be enough, by itself.
yeah, being “nice” sometimes blends into the background. When picking a team (or class), it might be obvious who the individuals are you don’t want on your team but less obvious who are the good teammates. Sorting through that seems difficult.
I’m with @KKmama above: I think this this is more a way to sort hundreds of otherwise qualified applicants than some substitute for the usual primary standards (GPA, test scores, etc.) The schools listed by the OP are not hurting for apps, so they can draw a line and then start picking through the pile. You still have to more or less hit the main marks for Nice to matter.
Gosh, my cynical nature is thinking that this is just something they are saying in the presentation to make the parents feel good about their child applying/attending there!!! I’m thinking this is more marketing than something they are trying to ferret out in applications. Of course, by all means, still be a nice person!
