<p>collegehelp, can I ask you how old you are? </p>
<p>Because really, my identity, at this point in my life, is not really tied up in where I went to college.</p>
<p>collegehelp - realize that some folks (yes even in the employment world) can react negatively to names like Harvard and Princeton. Some want to hire normal every-day folks and think Ivy grads have chips on their shoulders. Not saying that's true - just that everyone carries impressions around that may or may not reflect reality.<br>
So where did Tim Russert go? I can't even remember the name of his college (saw it in the paper last week). But hey, who cares? The guy was amazing - and part of what made him amazing is that he was a great communicator, a smart hard-working man and a solid citizen. He was loved and respected by top officials and the camera men and janitors on the crew. Now that's something to shoot for...</p>
<p>
[quote]
Do faculty adjust their teaching for honors courses?
[/quote]
umm, YES! </p>
<p>Where you attended "whatever stage you've reached" does become part of your identity. </p>
<p>Where did you go to HS? College? Law school? Clerked under? Biggest Client? </p>
<p>Where did you go to HS? College? Medical School? Internship? Residency? Fellowship? Clinical trials?</p>
<p>Where did you go to HS? College? Grad school? First job? Biggest application ever developed?</p>
<p>Collegehelp,
First, $40 grand difference is huge and cannot be neglected. Second, as an example of non-Ivy's opportunities , My D. is in a program that accepts 10 kids into freshman class and she is with this Ivy caliber students without going to Ivy. We are paying $6000/year + books and very low travel expenses since she is only 3.5 hours away. There is no way any Ivy would bit this deal. Plus, there is no guarantee that they would have accepted her, that is what Harvard said in their invitation to apply - no quarantee. So, we would have wasted an application fee. There are sooo much opportunities out there if you look beyond that name recognition!!! She might decide to apply to Harvard's Med. School though, since all of them expensive anyway. But by that time we would have saved tremendously on her undergrad education.</p>
<p>@collegehelp, I have taught honors classes at a large research university, as well as the "regular" classes. The honors classes are significantly smaller (about a factor of 10), the textbooks are higher in level, the pace is faster, the expectations are higher, and really, there's very little in common with the regular level courses--everything is adjusted to the capability range of the students. At junior/senior level, our honors students often take graduate courses in the major, and sometimes outside of it.</p>
<p>To add to an earlier post of mine: I should have mentioned Fulbright scholarships (for graduating seniors) as well, in the set of awards to check.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Where you attended "whatever stage you've reached" does become part of your identity
[/quote]
</p>
<p>But it doesn't preclude you from attaining success, nor does it assure you of it.</p>
<p>At this point in my life, having secured lucrative employment, satisfying personal relationships, and financial security, I don't go around with my college affiliation on my sleeve.</p>
<p>I don't either. What I was trying to illustrate in my ? ? ? series was that college is just one step in (hopefully) many. I guess that wasn't clear.</p>
<p>yougotjohn is right with OSU and Miami at Oxford</p>
<p><<collegehelp, first,="" $40="" grand="" difference="" is="" huge="" and="" cannot="" be="" neglected.="" second,="" as="" an="" example="" of="" non-ivy's="" opportunities="" ,="" my="" d.="" in="" a="" program="" that="" accepts="" 10="" kids="" into="" freshman="" class="" she="" with="" this="" ivy="" caliber="" students="" without="" going="" to="" ivy.="" we="" are="" paying="" $6000="" year="" +="" books="" very="" low="" travel="" expenses="" since="" only="" 3.5="" hours="" away.="" there="" no="" way="" any="" would="" bit="" deal.="" plus,="" guarantee="" they="" have="" accepted="" her,="" what="" harvard="" said="" their="" invitation="" apply="" -="" quarantee.="" so,="" wasted="" application="" fee.="">></collegehelp,></p>
<p>In the first place, Ivies can and do give kids FA that result in the family contributing about $6K per year. In the second place, you <em>seriously</em> would not apply to any school that your kid wasn't guaranteed to get into because of a <strong>$60</strong> application fee??</p>
<p>That's just a tad short-sighted, IMHO.</p>
<p>$6K is total that we pay including R&B. I am 200% sure that D. would have not gotten full tuition + some R&B at any Ivy, let alone being accepted there. I am almost positive that she would have gotten $0 in merit scholarships at any Ivy and we are not qualifying for any need based at any school in the US. Because of $$ consideration and chance of not being accepted, $60 ($60 is high for application fee anyway) would be totally wasted. She applied to many schools, so we already have spent a lot on application process. But she was accepted to all of them with very good academic scholarships at each. We did not consider these fees wasted because they bought her options to choose from.</p>
<p>Unfortunately this very helpful hread has been hijacked. I for one would like to return to the listing of the best honors programs at Public Universities and discussion of the benefits offered to students in these programs. Take the arguing somewhere else and keep this purely informational. It is a great resource for those applying to college and the parents who would like low cost options for their children. I have noted all of the honors programs discussed thusfar and will have my child investigate them all. Please keep adding additional programs and further information on the programs already listed.</p>
<p>The original poster was looking for honors programs that take out-of-staters. There would be no financial advantage for an out-of stater. This baffles me.</p>
<p>There is no reason for bafflement here. Assuming you mean "no financial advantage when compared to an elite private school" then you are clearly wrong. Public U's are generally substantially cheaper even at OOS rates.</p>
<p>Harvard College
Tuition & fees $36,173</p>
<p>Ohio U
OOS Tuition and Fees $17,871</p>
<p>U of MD College Park
OOS Tuition and Fees $23,712</p>
<p>I completely agree that it is an error to assume that a private college is financially out-of-reach without knowing what FA might be available (and hence should be applied to if of interest), but based on sticker price alone an honors college at a public U is a highly attractive financial option for an upper-echelon student.</p>
<p>I don't believe this one has been mentioned yet. It receives much attention in Ascher's "Cool Colleges"
Robert</a> E Cook Honors College at Indiana University of Pennsylvania</p>
<p>After grants and scholarships are awarded, Harvards cost would be much lower.</p>
<p>This is what I mean. I hate to see people make bad decisions based on misinformation or incomplete information. </p>
<p>I point out the downside of honors colleges as a matter of conscience.</p>
<p>
[quote]
After grants and scholarships are awarded, Harvards cost would be much lower.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>If you had said "could be" lower, we would be in agreement. However Harvard only awards about 50-60% of its students financial aid, and many of those would not receive it in amounts adequate to covering the difference in costs.</p>
<p>But let's suppose you are fortunate enough to be able to afford the full-sticker price (at least by Harvard's calculations!). If I read you correctly, you would say that the choice must then be for Harvard. And, if I point out that studies show that the difference in price is usually not covered by future earnings outcomes (especially if you take into account the time value of money) I anticipate you would say that intangibles, such as educational quality and prestige, tip the scales in Harvard's favor.</p>
<p>But do they? The Honors colleges try to address the educational advantages by offering smaller classes, better teaching, and improved curricula. It would take some analysis to simply dismiss the improvements as inadequate. And "prestige" is, ultimately, a personal value. Some will pursue it at any cost, and others think it fool's gold. You'll find happy and powerful people in both camps, as well as miserable and disenfrancished ones, too.</p>
<p>Havard is probably a bad example since they recently changed their aid policies and are giving significant help to those with incomes close to 200K. That's a lot of folks. And if the cost is the same or close, yeah I'm probably going to Harvard.<br>
This big change in aid policy has not yet trickled down to places like Cornell or Duke. It can be quite difficult to get fin aid at those schools. And merit aid is non-existent or very hard to get. It really depends on the situation. It's tought to make broad generalizations here. Yes, keep your eyes open, but just as you shouldn't count out privates, don't count out honors colleges just because some folks think they're not "prestigious" enough.</p>
<p>The UC (University of California) school system is the best. UCLA, Berkeley, UCSD, and UCSB are all amazing schools.</p>
<p>The site Uchance.com</a> - Calculate your percent chance of acceptance at dozens of colleges and universities in the U.S. profiles the UC's really well and if you enter in your GPA and SAT the site will give you a percent chance of getting into the schools.</p>
<p>I think one of the meanest fallacies told to HS students is "Study hard and maybe you'll get a scholarship to FamousU." Actually, most of the super famous privates given little or no merit aid. </p>
<p>Honors programs at public universities probably all give merit aid. Some of it is automatic, some involve supplemental applications, essays, and interviews. </p>
<p>Here is Ohio State's info <a href="http://undergrad.osu.edu/merit.html%5B/url%5D">http://undergrad.osu.edu/merit.html</a></p>
<p>Some state university honors programs waive OOS tuition, especially if the student is NMF. UF and Pitt do and I think I heard UNC does (but I am not sure about UNC). Plus, of course, merit money. People often confuse "scholarship" designation as meaning merit aid, but colleges will designate financial aid as "scholarship" also. HYPS do not give merit aid (although you might get some local alumni association to give you money). But H and Y limit the parental contribution to 10% of income if it is below $180k for H and $200k for Y. This may well result in less expenses than a public honors program. That is why you apply to both and compare aid packages and merit scholarship offers.</p>
<p>There is no one right answer. To some, Ivy is the way to go if they get in. To others Public Honors is the way to go. Finance is a very important and deciding factor in most cases. For one that will get a substantial financial aid from these very selective colleges, I agree that it is better to apply to them and compare the financial package. For those that will not get any financial aid, then the choice is $200,000 for four years at an Ivy or $40,000 at a good public honors college. It is not a matter if one can afford it but rather if one is willing to pay for it. My son has a choice of $200,000 to Northwestern, $80,000 to UCB or Rice, and $25,000 to ASU's Barrett Honors College and he choose to go to ASU.</p>