<p>What about Penn State?</p>
<p>They have a huge engineering program, with an enormous variety of engineering majors to choose from, and the campus is very rural.</p>
<p>I’m not seeing much in the way of merit aid at Penn State.</p>
<p>I know it’s not northeast, and I did see another poster mention it briefly up-thread, but I’m going to put in another plug for Virginia Tech. Blacksburg is rural, but a very nice college town, and depending on your taste the campus is really beautiful. Top engineering school, check (#13 overall, and many individual area’s coming in as high as #5). Their OOS tuition is not too steep ($32,911 T,R&B +$30/credit hour in e’school classes), and I do know that the year my son applied (2011) many OOS students that qualified for honors got a $5k scholly awarded towards mid April. It may at least be worth a visit if you can work it in.</p>
<p>Thanks, I’ll take a look. Their scholarships (VT) seem pretty hard to figure out in advance, so thanks for the data point. Was that $5K scholarship renewable for 4 years?</p>
<p>I don’t know. You could possibly ask admissions. It was a more then a few kids that got it so they should be familiar with it. It seemed to be an incentive to get OOS kids as IS kids weren’t getting this award. I’ll go back to the thread last year where ppl were talking about it and see if I recognize any posters that are still active that might be able to confirm they got the award again this year. I’m on my iPhone now so I’ll have to get to my computer later at home where I can do the search easier.</p>
<p>Per VPISU’s 2011-2012 CDS, out of 2700 freshmen deemed to have no need, 598 (22%) were awarded merit aid, with the average amount being $3,815.</p>
<p>At Penn State, the numbers are 440/3527 (12%), average award $3,725.</p>
<p>Thanks BobWallace. Those look like pretty small average merit awards, but then the average doesn’t necessarily tell the tale. What is VPISU? Is that Virginia Tech?</p>
<p>Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University</p>
<p>figured it must be something like that – sorry for being too lazy to look it up myself ;-)</p>
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<p>Big schools may offer courses more frequently (e.g. every semester instead of every year) and offer more esoteric electives due to student demand, and may be more attractive to recruiters (more soon-to-graduate students to recruit per trip).</p>
<p>Small schools and liberal arts colleges may be preferred by those who want a more intimate feel; some may offer small class sizes at the freshman and sophomore level (though honors courses at big schools may also be small).</p>
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<p>An ABET-accredited engineering degree program must include some humanities and social studies courses. Brown University, which has no breadth requirements for most undergraduates, has humanities and social studies requirements for engineering majors.</p>
<p>MIT has “tech” in its name, but has heavier breadth requirements than most other schools, including some that are known for a “core curriculum”. MIT requires 8 humanities, arts, and social studies courses, including some from each category, and a concentration. That is in addition to relatively heavy math and science requirements that even humanities and social studies majors have to take.</p>
<p>My point isn’t that the tech schools don’t make kids take humanities courses, but more that the breadth of offerings at a liberal arts college may be wasted on a kid who isn’t particularly interested?</p>
<p>Actually, liberal arts colleges, being smaller, often have a smaller selection of available courses (or less frequent offering of courses). Their most usual main feature is that they are more focused at all levels of undergraduate study, giving freshmen and sophomores smaller classes with faculty instead of giant lectures.</p>
<p>Big universities tend to have a larger selection of available courses, but introductory courses are often giant lectures.</p>
<p>Because I went to one of those big schools with 100+ kid lectures for intro-level classes, I can hardly imagine college any other way. ;-)</p>
<p>So… what kind of budding engineer would most benefit from a liberal arts college? Are the pros/cons the same as any smaller school, or is there something unique offered by being a “liberal arts” college?</p>
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<p>It’s the Thayer School of Engineering. Tuck is business. Either way, Dartmouth is rural with a creative approach to engineering. </p>
<p>Has UNH been mentioned/considered?</p>
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<p>The main attraction of LAC-model schools over RU-model schools is the smaller class sizes at the lower division level and greater in-class interaction with faculty that is possible in the smaller class sizes at the lower division level (upper division class sizes tend to be smaller at the RU-model schools). But the trade-off is the smaller selection and/or lower frequency of offering of upper division courses. Also, LACs’ undergraduate focus means no or few graduate level courses available for the most advanced undergraduates. The students who fit best at LACs are the ones who value the smaller, more interactive class sizes at all levels, and are not so advanced that they will be limited by the fewer or less frequent course offerings.</p>
<p>Dartmouth has a drawback in that the full ABET-accredited engineering degree should be planned for 1-3 extra quarters beyond the usual 12 quarters.</p>
<p>Thanks ucbalumnus, that’s a good analysis. But that does seem to me to be the same as any big/small analysis. What exactly makes a LAC a LAC, and different from another small college?</p>
<p>And thanks CULater for the UNH mention – had looked into it before but I think it may be a bit pricey for OOS. Looks like he’d get 10K automatic (?) merit, but that still leaves almost 30K to pay. There are 2 full-rides available for engineering applicants, but I don’t think he’s <em>that</em> good.</p>
<p>It may be hard to pin down a strict definition of “liberal arts college”. Some of the usual characteristics:</p>
<ul>
<li>Focus on liberal arts subjects. But many do have more overtly pre-professional majors like engineering or performing arts.</li>
<li>Focus on undergraduates with few or no graduate students.</li>
<li>LAC-model teaching with small faculty-led classes at all undergraduate levels. But small schools not calling themselves LACs may be similar (but not always).</li>
</ul>
<p>It may come down more to what characteristics of the school fit or do not fit the student, rather than whether it is called a “liberal arts college”.</p>
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<p>as always, good advice – was just having a hard time wrapping my head around a “liberal arts” college offering engineering in the first place… I think I get it now. (I also think this particular kid will be better of in a bigger research U most likely.)</p>
<p>I’m a big fan of LACs. I’m also an engineer who attended and now works for a medium-sized RU.</p>
<p>In my experience, the bulk of engineering learning is done by the student on his own. Engineering is about learning how to approach and solve problems, and the critical part of this learning is done by actually solving problems on your own. The RU teaching model is really no disadvantage for the engineering curriculum, IMHO. Also, available equipment and facilities are a much bigger advantage for engineering than for most other curricula, and large and/or rich schools usually win out there.</p>
<p>The benefit of engineering at a LAC or other undergraduate-focused college would be in the non-engineering curriculum. Again, IMHO.</p>