<p>Hi...new member...can ya tell??? Was looking for 'soozviet', but anyone with input, please, please feel free to repsond. </p>
<p>Please see post under "Brown" threads. Title "Brown or other options. Please help" </p>
<p>Thanks a million.</p>
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<blockquote> <p>The experience opened up her mind to a whole different way of learning , one which suits her much more, as well as a different college lifestyle ( i.e. a residential community, where 'community' is meant in the best sense). </p> </blockquote>
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<p>Sorry, for posting here, but my reply is too generic for the Brown forum</p>
<p>Most of the small liberal arts colleges (LAC's) would provide what your daughter seems to find attractive about Brown, probably even to a slightly greater degree because they are half the size (typically around 2000 students). Small size, focus on undergrad education, and strong community would probably be the three most distinctive features of the LACs.</p>
<p>At the top of the range, places like Swarthmore, Williams, Amherst and Pomona (in California) will be roughly comparable to Brown as far as difficulty of admissions and "prestige". However, there are dozens more that would probably be appropriate admissions matches for your daughter. Each one has a slightly different "ambience" -- some very intellectual, some a bit more preppy, some a bit more artsy, some a little quirkier.</p>
<p>Thanks much to interesteddad for responding !!</p>
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<p>So sorry for the long novel. In a nutshell, she is a bit quirky, really has her own way of thinking, and is much beloved by quite an unusal array of people ( i.e gang-bangers to girls scouts...ha ha)</p>
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<p>The question is : since Brown is pretty-well impossible for her to get into , are there any other schools that you could recommend that operate in a similar fashion, with a similar philosophy? </p>
<p>I'd be so grateful to give her another possible option. By the way, she is interested in becoming a teacher. Likley major is English, but she wants to explore ...psych, philosophy, theology.....</p>
<p>Much Thanks!!<</p>
<p>Yes, yes she sounds as if she should explore LACs. There are many fine LACs of varying selectivities as InterDad has said. Go to the website for "Colleges that Change Lives", and try to get a copy of Loren Pope's book. Many of these schools will be matches, and/or safeties for a 1400 SAT with strong ECs, especially service oriented ECs.
The downside of LACS is that they are expensive, particularly for students who do not have the right combos of stats and need to get substantial aid, either merit or need-based. But, not to panic, there are so many of these schools, and the education and the sense of community is so strong at most of these, that she should not have a problem finding a good fit, both educationally and financially.</p>
<p>Do some searches on this forum for LAC, and you should find many discussions about these - a general rule of thumb from this forum is expect merit aid when her stats fall into the upper 25% - and you may get some money at lower levels. Also, prepare to apply to a number of schools and compare aid packages. If she is a URM or has other desireable qualities, such as her service ECs, she may get more than expected aid - the important thing is to find several school that fulfill her basic criteria. Good luck, she should be able to find a good fit.</p>
<p>Cangel, thanks much for replying. Looking outside the UC system is definitely uncharted territory for us. I will share these suggestions with her!</p>
<p>Definitely look at Wesleyan, in Ct. It is often thought of as the LAC equivalent of Brown. From reading her profile, I think she'd have a good shot there, if she can make them see past the rank. Her ECs sound spectacular (and an essay about the girl scout to gang-banger appeal would probably go over particularly well, there.) My D attended, and your D sounds a lot like her and her friends. (She refused to study for tests for the exact same reason!)</p>
<p>Open curriculum schools (like Brown) include Vassar, Smith, and Amherst (I think).</p>
<p>Liberal like Brown includes those above, and a whole lot more. Brown has a much higher percentage of students from private schools, and a lower percentage of students on financial aid, than many schools (including all of the above). Don't know whether that is a plus or a minus - it's just a matter of what you are looking for. Brown is probably the most "quirky" of the Ivies, but that doesn't make it particularly quirky.</p>
<p>Quirky - think Sarah Lawrence, Bard, Reed, Smith, to a lesser extent Vassar, maybe Wesleyan (I'm not sure it is all that quirky), Hampshire, Earlham, perhaps Mills, Evergreen.</p>
<p>I thought Wesleyan sounded plenty quirky when we visited and the tour included an explanation fo how to handle gender self-identification if you consider yourself gender neutral or simply decide not to identify.</p>
<p>Son said "that could be either a really great thing or a really bad thing....depending on your viewpoint". He thought it was cool, BTW.</p>
<p>Things remained "quirky" until we entered the info session.....at which point things got downright serious and felt elitist.......it was an odd transition. </p>
<p>They did, however, have the most beautiful space for an info session...better than any of the many others we've attended.</p>
<p>"I thought Wesleyan sounded plenty quirky when we visited and the tour included an explanation fo how to handle gender self-identification if you consider yourself gender neutral or simply decide not to identify."</p>
<p>You see, it is all on a scale. Last year, the Smith Student Association changed the student constitution to be "gender neutral". (???) Students who have XX chromosomes but who identify as male can attend an all-women's college; however, students with Y chromosomes who identify as women cannot. But the college doesn't check chromosomes as part of the application process, so things are going to get interesting, to say the least! (My d. is enjoying that immensely! and is looking forward to writing an opera with indefinite genders and voice parts.)</p>
<p>My take on Wesleyan is the same as yours (Williams with a 'tude!). Great place!</p>
<p>Thanks to garland, mini , and momsdream. Much to consider. Financial issues are definitely a concern. I will be sharing the responses with my daughter, who is very thrifty...another reason why the interest in Brown was a surprise
( she always says she will be perfectly happy living in a cardboard box)></p>
<p>Sounds like mine - we gave her "poverty lessons" (she is a composer, and will probably not make it until she is 40, if then), and they took! She got $200 in birthday money from grand'rents, and wouldn't spend $35 on a used peacoat from the Salvation Army. She says she feels "sick" whenever she spends more than $30 on anything. (I sent her a $10 "rebate" certificate - all she has to do is buy a coat, and send me a photo - and she hasn't done it!) We are insisting (without success) that she spend more money while at Smith - her research assistantship pays her $1700 a year, and at this rate, she'll save more than half of it (and that's including books, trips to DC for Thanksgiving, a trip into Boston, etc. etc.) She did bike to a big rummage sale on Sunday, though, and while she bought almost nothing, she said the leaves were gorgeous, and it made her day! (so much for expensive entertainment.) (She also complained about her visit to Amherst on Saturday, where she was singing in an early music concert - she says she met too many sloshed female Amherstians ("Lady Jeffs"?) in what she took to be designer partywear to feel comfortable. It's nice when you get the right "fit" (LOL!)</p>
<p>I know this is not the "usual" college problem, but having the kids learn to spend money on themselves when it will advance their education (and quality of living) has its own ring of importance.</p>
<p>P.S. I should have added that at the concert, the group was dressed for Halloween. The conductor conducted with a scythe. My d. had a solo - her first solo in college. Her costume was made of garbage bags.</p>
<p>How fitting!</p>
<p>(My d. is enjoying that immensely! and is looking forward to writing an opera with indefinite genders and voice parts.)>></p>
<p>Mini:
Your D should team up with my S's friend at Harvard who is producing operas for the Harvard Early Music Society (L'Orfeo on Nov. 18). There should be parts for falsettos though may be not for castrati unless some of the performers have undergone a sex change operation!</p>
<p>I went to Brown and I would say Vassar is a very close LAC clone. I would characterize Brown as a school of 6000 happy extroverts, and Vassar came off the same way when we visited. Wesleyan did too. Though Brown can be quirky, and often the quirkier kids are the most visible, there was also a strong population of uber-preppy kids at Brown. It was more like a mix 1/3 Williams-Hamilton and 2/3 Vassar-Wesleyan.</p>
<p>In the UC system, UCSC might get you in the ballpark.</p>
<p>Ha!! mini ,your daughter sound like a gem!! My daughters favorite holiday is Halloween !</p>
<p>"Mini:
Your D should team up with my S's friend at Harvard who is producing operas for the Harvard Early Music Society (L'Orfeo on Nov. 18). There should be parts for falsettos though may be not for castrati unless some of the performers have undergone a sex change operation!"</p>
<p>Actually, she visited H., but missed the recent Lowell House performance of La Serva Padrona. Currently, she is putting together a singing edition of the first opera ever written by a woman (Francesca Caccini), which is going to be performed by 5-College Opera a year from January. She's even going to get to compose some of the missing music!</p>
<p>(If you've got the announcement, e-mail it to me privately, and I'll pass it on.)</p>
<p>I was thinking more on the order of "The Marriage of Figaro", where the Count finally relents to Figaro's gay marriage, and then it is revealed that he is actually a transgender Countess in drag.</p>
<p>Jeunger - your d. would fit right in with mine, so she might want to give Smith a look. (She thought Brown would be alright, but music wasn't as strong, nor JYA in Italy, and she definitely preferred Northampton.)</p>
<p>Thanks SBmom. Interesting point about the extroverts because she is definitely not an extrovert...nor an introvert, exactly, but she seems more intro than extro because she's on the very mellow side.</p>
<p>Thanks, Carolyn. Someone else also suggested UCSC. My niece goes there, actually. This college thing is kind of blowing my mind. Before all this, I had kinda thought we'd just drive her up to Davis for school....</p>
<p>jeunger,
all this boils down to is that your daughter has to cast a wider net. Keep Brown at the top, then less competitive (but still excellent) schools - you already have a good list that other posters have suggested. We are in a similar boat due to a bad year and unweighted ranking (my son in is in BSA, in fact). Can any of the family difficulties be discussed in the GC rec??? In a supplemental rec from your D's girl scout leader? </p>
<p>Also - for the LAC's - make sure she interviews. The will help 'see past the rank'. Good luck! You are not alone.</p>
<p>Wow..mini. You must be so proud of her !!!</p>