Caltech is not offering scholarship to Freshman any more?

<p>The following is from Caltech's web site:</p>

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<p>Merit-based Scholarships:</p>

<p>Upperclass Merit Awards are awarded annually to returning students solely on the basis of academic merit. These merit scholarships include Caltech Upperclass Merit Awards, Carnation Scholarships, and several other private and corporate scholarships. The Faculty Committee on Scholarships and Financial Aid recommends a number of Caltech's most academically-talented students to receive the upperclass merit awards for their sophomore, junior, and/or senior year. Financial need is not a factor in the recommendation process. Upperclass merit award amounts range from $5,000 to full tuition, room, and board. The Merit Award honor is recorded on academic transcripts and listed in the Commencement program when the scholar graduates.</p>

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<p>I am wondering without the scholarship, how much of those student who get acceptance from both MIT and Caltech will choose Caltech now....if you have to pay either way, I think majority of them will got to MIT....</p>

<p>Where does it say anything about not offering freshmen scholarships? They're talking about UPPERCLASS merit awards, thus the phrase "UPPERCLASS MERIT AWARDS".</p>

<p>here is the link:</p>

<p>Caltech:</a> Grants & Scholarships</p>

<p>I don't see any where it mentions scholarship for freshmen ...</p>

<p>i am almost 100% sure they will still offer some scholarships, albiet no longer directly named...
I received ~20k more aid than i should have, it must have been a scholarship.</p>

<p>hi, omgitsover9000:</p>

<p>You got it last year right? </p>

<p>This year could be totally different, economy is so bad...Caltech may not has enough funding any more, but for those who already got in, Caltech has to keep it's promise, since the scholarships were awarded for four years, I am guessing that's why it only mentions upperclass scholarship now....</p>

<p>Here is another quote from Caltech's website:</p>

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<p>In order to strengthen our need-based financial aid program even further, we will be redirecting our freshman merit-based scholarship programs to our need-based financial aid program, effective with the class that will enter in September 2009. Caltech will continue to support the Upper Class Merit Scholarship program for rising sophomores, juniors and seniors to recognize exceptional performance in coursework and research.</p>

<p>Caltech</a> Undergraduate Admissions: Merit Scholarships</p>

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<p>i received my financial aid letter yesterday.</p>

<p>Just wondering: if this decision was made very recently, is it possible that they now have more money for need-based aid than they thought when they sent out EA estimates, and thus will give us more than is indicated in those estimates?</p>

<p>Maybe I'm just being too hopeful here . . .</p>

<p>The upperclass merit scholarships, and I'm fairly certain the same holds for freshman merti scholarships, do not necessarily provide a substantial benefit to your financial aid package unless you're EFC is very high. Upon receiving a scholarship, money is taken away from the Caltech grant (the non-merit based scholarship portion) and I'm pretty sure the government loan requirements as well. If I remember correctly, the highest merit-based award was just under $40,000? (a full ride in the sense of tuition and room and board, if I remember right, but I could have this wrong) The total bill comes to just over $50,000 (for freshman at least with the required room and board, etc.) It's very possible the merit scholarships wouldn't change your financial aid package at all, or perhaps very marginally. Money is removed from your expected contribution only if the scholarship has exhausted all other possible sources of funding. For upperclass scholarships, it's really a matter of whether a trustee is providing the funds or it's coming from the financial aid budget. There have been several cases where students will receive an upperclass merit scholarship, only to pay the same amount anyway. If I have my numbers right, the prospective students who would have won a merit scholarship would most likely be in a similar situation. (my roommate received a $26,000 scholarship, only to pay $2,000 less, which is nice, but a far cry from what the scholarship was worth) This doesn't look like something to worry about. It may even be beneficial to you under this system.</p>

<p>Upperclass Merit goes up to full tuition and board. The highest freshman scholarship was the lingle, which was full tuition + board + a ~7k stipend.</p>

<p>Honestly, I'm glad they are getting rid of freshman scholarships. The scholarships are based on high school performance, which in no way translates to performance at Tech. Reward those who actually do well, not those who you think might.</p>

<p>In response to the OP, most people who got freshman scholarships more often than not still chose to go elsewhere. If I recall, our freshman class has only one axline this year that matriculated. I know him because he lives down the hall from me, so I might have missed one or two others (plus Lizzardfire might know better). Still, it's significantly less than the 20 or so offered.</p>

<p>They discussed this change at Parents Weekend. It was my impression that it did not involve any decrease in funds available at all, simply directed more of it to need-based aid for the freshman class. Also, as said above, they felt that the merit aid should reflect performance at Caltech rather than perceptions of high school performance.</p>

<p>Upper class merit awards are not being discontinued. Need-based scholarships are not being discontinued. </p>

<p>The scholarships that are being discontinued (Axline, President's, etc.) were strictly merit-based and were awarded to very few students each year. This change will not negatively affect financial aid. The hope is that it will help financial aid by redirecting funds into the need-based program.</p>

<p>'Honestly, I'm glad they are getting rid of freshman scholarships. The scholarships are based on high school performance, which in no way translates to performance at Tech. Reward those who actually do well, not those who you think might'</p>

<p>So, freshmen’s performance will definitely translate to a good performance for sophomore year? Nothing is guaranteed, but at least a high achiever in freshmen year will have a better chance to perform well in sophomore year, same goes with high school, a higher achiever in high school usually has a better chance to excel in college. Otherwise, Universities should not even care about high school student’s stats at all…..</p>

<p>Plus, all those upclass scholarships are possibly just an continued obligation from their freshmen year's awards since Axline is a four-year scholarship.</p>

<p>Caltech has been proud of itself for being more academic emphasized than other elite schools. Especially when comparing to MIT, Caltech claims its superior by offering harder classes, more weights on academic excellence when picking freshmen and most of all, the only elite school that rewards academic excellence by offering merit-based scholarships. Now by giving up one of its uniqueness, Caltech is making itself more or less like MIT.</p>

<p>Axline scholarship has been a big inspiration for my area local kids, each year there will be couple seniors in town (from different area schools) won the honor; schools , students and parents talk about it with excitement...… It’s an honor only very few can get it, which in turn makes it more valuable, admirable and inspirational and from which freshmen find examples, goals and motivations that bring out four years of persistent and determined hard work..……</p>

<p>I am feeling very sad that Caltech is giving up this scholarship, not sure practically how much money it can actually save, but this action definitely is tarnishing its claimed imagine of advocating pure academic superior and losing its edge to MIT. High school students lost one of few very concrete motivation and inspiration for pure academic excellence.</p>

<p>blueriver: "Plus, all those upclass scholarships are possibly just an continued obligation from their freshmen year's awards since Axline is a four-year scholarship."</p>

<p>This is not true. Upperclass merit awards are applied for during the school year and are awarded based upon a student's performance at Caltech. They are not related to the Axline.</p>

<p>The reason there's been a trend to remove merit-based scholarships from high-end schools is because of the amount of competition it creates. (in a bad way) Given the small environment, Caltech strongly encourages collaboration; I have never heard of a student's lab being destroyed by a dangerously "ambitious" GPA-worrywart. The honor code severely reduces instances of cheating compared to other schools; some universities have cases where >80% of the class shares answers. (I believe I heard MIT had a problem with cheating in one of their popular classes recently)</p>

<p>Believe it or not, there are some people (not many, but it's happened) who come here very well prepared, only to screw around/not apply themselves/etc. and end up taking time off, or in extreme cases, just dropping out. </p>

<p>I fail to see how removing merit scholarships diminishes Caltech's quality and/or makes it more like MIT. There are plenty of differences between MIT and Caltech, but also many similarities. Faculty from both institutions collaborate all of the time. A professor from Caltech even shared the Nobel Prize with a professor from MIT a few years ago. People from Caltech don't "hate" MIT, and vice-versa, at least to my knowledge. (there could be a few outliers, but this holds in general)</p>

<p>For students accepted to both universities, they can make a choice between the two based on the campus, personalities of the students, etc. etc. Whether a school offers merit scholarships shouldn't be a determining factor in the application/decision process. </p>

<p>It's unfortunate students in your town find a merit scholarship to be a huge inspiration to apply and participate in extracurriculars, research projects, math clubs, etc. If they're not motivated by the work itself, enjoy it for what it is, then they're wasting their time trying to accumulate enough awards just to win a silly scholarship. They should be doing something they enjoy, not just looking for bragging rights or something to pad their resume.</p>

<p>The vast majority of freshman, merit scholarship winners or not, invest a lot of effort into their work. Frankly, since you think Caltech has ruined its image and become "more like MIT," simply by a reorganization of financial aid awards, it doesn't seem you know that much about the institution, nor even seen the campus. (no offense intended; also, upperclass merit scholarships come from donors and trustees interested in helping students, not to act as a replacement/addition to freshman merit scholarships.)</p>

<p>--‘The reason there's been a trend to remove merit-based scholarships from high-end schools is because of the amount of competition it creates. (in a bad way) Given the small environment, Caltech strongly encourages collaboration; I have never heard of a student's lab being destroyed by a dangerously "ambitious" GPA-worrywart. The honor code severely reduces instances of cheating compared to other schools; some universities have cases where >80% of the class shares answers. (I believe I heard MIT had a problem with cheating in one of their popular classes recently)’</p>

<p>Yeah, right, Nancy Kerrigan was attacked by her rival in 1994 for the competition of USA team for Olympiad, thank god, we have not heard any rumors talking about canceling Olympiad. So many people are over eating to become obese, en, what we do about it, let’s stop food supply to whole human being……. yes, Caltech should also cancel their upper class merit scholarship too since those scholarships are making their students vulnerable to break honor code too…LOL.</p>

<p>--‘Believe it or not, there are some people (not many, but it's happened) who come here very well prepared, only to screw around/not apply themselves/etc. and end up taking time off, or in extreme cases, just dropping out. ‘</p>

<p>Sure I believe it, and especially perhaps most of those screw ups are scholarship winners? LOL.</p>

<p>--‘I fail to see how removing merit scholarships diminishes Caltech's quality and/or makes it more like MIT. There are plenty of differences between MIT and Caltech, but also many similarities. Faculty from both institutions collaborate all of the time. A professor from Caltech even shared the Nobel Prize with a professor from MIT a few years ago. People from Caltech don't "hate" MIT, and vice-versa, at least to my knowledge. (there could be a few outliers, but this holds in general)’</p>

<p>Removing merit scholarship adds one more similarity. The relationship between the two was never a concern in my previous talk. </p>

<p>--‘For students accepted to both universities, they can make a choice between the two based on the campus, personalities of the students, etc. etc. Whether a school offers merit scholarships shouldn't be a determining factor in the application/decision process.’</p>

<p>I see, honor and money are not an issue in your world, then we are in two totally different world…..and I know there are many people live in my world where we care about honor, at the same time, forced to be concerned about money too, since we are not born to be rich yet we work hard to make ours self not to qualify need based financial aid…..which left us only possible help is merit scholarship.</p>

<p>--‘It's unfortunate students in your town find a merit scholarship to be a huge inspiration to apply and participate in extracurriculars, research projects, math clubs, etc. If they're not motivated by the work itself, enjoy it for what it is, then they're wasting their time trying to accumulate enough awards just to win a silly scholarship. They should be doing something they enjoy, not just looking for bragging rights or something to pad their resume.’</p>

<p>Passion and inspiration are never exclusive. When I say young kids got inspired by those Axline winners, it doesn’t mean those kids don’t have passion to start with. It could well be that the younger ones meet their admirer on math team, or some clubs, just like a young passionate athlete inspired by an Olympiad gold medalist. Btw, Axline is a ‘silly scholarship’? OMG, LOL…Caltech has been so stupidly doing such a silly thing for all these year, you must be happy now, since it finally stopped doing such a silly thing now.</p>

<p>--'The vast majority of freshman, merit scholarship winners or not, invest a lot of effort into their work. Frankly, since you think Caltech has ruined its image and become "more like MIT," simply by a reorganization of financial aid awards, it doesn't seem you know that much about the institution, nor even seen the campus.'</p>

<p>True, I have not visited the campus yet, and I don’t think seeing the campus will have any effects on my current believe on this issue either.</p>

<p>--'(no offense intended; also, upperclass merit scholarships come from donors and trustees interested in helping students, not to act as a replacement/addition to freshman merit scholarships.)’</p>

<p>OK, I am enlightened again. The donor of Axline must have no interest in helping student at all. And only current donors of upperclass scholarship are having great interests in helping student, which definitely are not silly like Axline. Btw, help students in which aspect? Let’s see, based on your above mentioned logical, the only effect of merit scholarship that is worth mentioning is to make students more vulnerable to break the honor code. So those upperclass scholarships should be abandoned too…..I am wondering how can those donors keep doing such a silly thing, did you try to contact them to alert them the possible negative effects? (no offense please ).</p>

<p>With all above said, don't take me wrong, I still consider both MIT and Caltech are super schools, just Caltech used to be a little more academic advocated and now is giving up one of it's strong advocating action, which could as well be involuntary due to current economics ( my pure speculation).....</p>

<p>Two quick responses, blueriver:</p>

<p>"So, freshmen’s performance will definitely translate to a good performance for sophomore year?" No, it won't. But the upper-class merit scholarship isn't predictive. It's given to students who have done good work at Caltech, not just to students they think will do good work at Caltech. For that reason most upperclass merit scholarships are given to sophomores and Juniors, not freshmen. </p>

<p>And yeah, I think it's a better indicator of success here, too.</p>

<p>You also said "just Caltech used to be a little more academic advocated and now is giving up one of it's strong advocating action". I don't think this is the case. You're basically saying that we promote academics over other things, and by removing the scholarship we no longer do that? This isn't correct. In fact, it's the opposite--the academics are incredibly important, especially the academics at Caltech. That's why our focus is shifting toward strategies that actually work in helping and rewarding students who do well at Caltech. Axline was not a good predictor of academic success, and if anything it added pressure to students that attended here. Axline or not, not everyone can handle Tech. Axline didn't work particularly well as a recruiting strategy, either.</p>

<p>"Yeah, right, Nancy Kerrigan was attacked by her rival in 1994 for the competition of USA team for Olympiad, thank god, we have not heard any rumors talking about canceling Olympiad. So many people are over eating to become obese, en, what we do about it, let’s stop food supply to whole human being……."</p>

<p>I honestly don't understand what this means.</p>

<p>"yes, Caltech should also cancel their upper class merit scholarship too since those scholarships are making their students vulnerable to break honor code too…LOL."</p>

<p>Perhaps I should have separated those lines; it seems you've misunderstood me. I was saying that Caltech has a very collaborative, non-competitive (for most students, but there are some minor exceptions) environment, not one suited for cutthroat competition over scholarships and such. I'm not saying there is competition for scholarships, just that the personalities of the students, etc. aren't suited for it. (I've personally never met someone here who gets really competitive about this stuff. It's actually quite nice and relaxing.) Yes, there are friendly competitions, students participate in ACM, Putnam, etc. with other schools, interhouse sports (some of the athletes care more about this one than others, it's more of a "tradition" amongst them), and others, but nothing resembling "unhealthy" competition. (concerns over who gets what scholarship might serve as an example)</p>

<p>As for dropouts and people who go on leave for a few terms, I'm not sure whether or not they've won a scholarship. There are students that have tested out of several core classes in the past who have wound up in this position; perhaps they didn't win a scholarship, but either way, given the small group of students who test out of core classes anyway, you might say these students are "more deserving" of a merit scholarship on this basis. (on basis of intelligence, but there high school record might say more to support giving them a scholarship)</p>

<p>"I see, honor and money are not an issue in your world, then we are in two totally different world…..and I know there are many people live in my world where we care about honor, at the same time, forced to be concerned about money too, since we are not born to be rich yet we work hard to make ours self not to qualify need based financial aid…..which left us only possible help is merit scholarship."</p>

<p>I'd say getting into Caltech would be an honor enough. Whether or not you get a scholarship, as far as honor goes, shouldn't make a difference. Bragging rights over other students simply because a committee thought you deserved some extra money is kind of silly, which is why I referred to it as a "silly scholarship." Ultimately, it's a pretty trivial thing. There's more important stuff to worry about.</p>

<p>As for the money aspect; unless I've misunderstood something, the funds from the merit scholarship are simply being moved to the need-based scholarship funds. This means more students and will have access to more money. If you didn't qualify for financial aid with the government and/or Caltech, depending on the situation, you can always talk to the financial aid department. The FAFSA form isn't perfect, so if something needs to be discussed, just call them. If everyone who didn't qualify for financial aid had to depend on winning a merit scholarship, then we would have very close to 100% of the enrolled student body receiving financial aid. (we don't) If none of this works, it's possible you have enough money to pay for this, and just don't realize it. I come from a middle class background and was shocked at what the FAFSA gave me. Paying for college isn't easy for everyone who isn't very wealthy. It involves sacrifices, so if worse comes to worse, try looking at your finances and see what you can do. (well, you'll have to do this anyway; everyone does, unless you're a millionaire) Student loans are always an option. Full rides to a good school are (clearly) hard to come by, so you shouldn't apply with the idea in mind that you'll win one. (plus, I'm not sure Axline covers everything, you'd probably be paying something in the end anyway)</p>

<p>"Passion and inspiration are never exclusive. When I say young kids got inspired by those Axline winners, it doesn’t mean those kids don’t have passion to start with. It could well be that the younger ones meet their admirer on math team, or some clubs, just like a young passionate athlete inspired by an Olympiad gold medalist. Btw, Axline is a ‘silly scholarship’? OMG, LOL…Caltech has been so stupidly doing such a silly thing for all these year, you must be happy now, since it finally stopped doing such a silly thing now."</p>

<p>I'm not saying inspiration is bad, and I see what you mean by inspiration and passion being "tied." Using a scholarship as a "benchmark" is pretty silly, that's what I'm referring to. If you want to go to Caltech, you should find math and science to be inspirations in themselves. Grigori Perelman serves as an extreme example of this. Pursuing an education and a career in science just because of money and prestige is extremely stupid, and perhaps that unfortunate soul will wake up one day and see how miserable they are. If it isn't fun for what it is, then there are other career options to explore. No sense in being depressed because of which job pays more. </p>

<p>"OK, I am enlightened again. The donor of Axline must have no interest in helping student at all. And only current donors of upperclass scholarship are having great interests in helping student, which definitely are not silly like Axline. Btw, help students in which aspect? Let’s see, based on your above mentioned logical, the only effect of merit scholarship that is worth mentioning is to make students more vulnerable to break the honor code. So those upperclass scholarships should be abandoned too…..I am wondering how can those donors keep doing such a silly thing, did you try to contact them to alert them the possible negative effects? (no offense please )."</p>

<p>I'm not sure if the Axline donor ever requested his money to be attached to financial aid. I don't know the story about it, but since the scholarship was removed, he's obviously ok with it. (or if he's dead, the original requests didn't mandate it be used for a merit scholarship) As for the rest of it, it seems your misunderstanding with what I said earlier prompted those comments.</p>

<p>It's just a simple merit scholarship. I don't see how this seriously affects the image of the institution with the reputation it's built for itself. If you're really that concerned about college finances, we can all understand that, but this is such a small matter, I can't really see how this makes it less academically oriented. There are plenty of deserving students for those scholarships, and given the similarities in how impressive the students are, picking out a few for a merit scholarship could be a bit exaggerated.</p>

<p>If you've been accepted to both MIT and Caltech EA, and deciding between them based on which one (used to) have a merit scholarship, then you should just go to MIT. There's a lot more to these schools than just money, and you're looking at it the wrong way if being awarded a merit scholarship is the primary concern. Some people love the house system, others hate it. Most everyone loves the honor code. Doing very rigorous work sometimes into the wee hours of the morning could be fun (or in most cases, tolerable) to some, and excruciating to other people. Maybe you prefer a small community over a big school. I don't know. If the financial aid awards, scholarships, etc. differ by $10,000 or something, I can see why you would choose a specific school. But if they're similar, there's much more to this than winning a scholarship. If you ultimately decide to go somewhere solely on the basis of a full ride, but hate the school, you're probably going to end up transferring. I'm not sure why your responses are so sarcastic; they come off a bit rude. I've been civil about this.</p>

<p>"If you've been accepted to both MIT and Caltech EA, and deciding between them based on which one (used to) have a merit scholarship, then you should just go to MIT."</p>

<p>Wow this sounds pretty harsh...
I have been accepted to both MIT and Caltech EA. I don't qualify for any need base financial aid. Sure I could go to a lot of schools that offer a full ride merit scholarship but would not turn down MIT and Caltech for them. I have visited both schools, yes they are different but I love them both. Yes there are things about both I would change too. MIT does not offer any non need based financial aid. Caltech having the possibility of merit aid was a big plus. If you love two school what is wrong with choosing one that will enable you to graduate with less loans? Maybe after attending both preview weekends I will have a clear preference but maybe not and maybe a merit based package from Caltech would have been the tipping factor.</p>