Chance Me & Reverse Chance Me!

Chance Me / Match Me!
1

Chance Me for Any Fine School Omitting Freshman Year Grades (e.g. Stanford, Princeton, Emory, and other more reasonable options, too!)

Intended Major: English and/or Comparative Literature

Demographics: Straight white male (U.S. citizen)

Current school: Small prep school in NYC

GPA (UW): 4.0

GPA (W): 4.2

Class rank (weighted): Top 25% with freshman year, approximately top 5-10% without

ACT/SAT scores: N/A, test-optional

Coursework:

10th: standard academic

11th: 2 honors (the most available to me) & more rigorous academic courses

12th: AP Literature (one of two APs offered, only one I could enroll in, matches intended major) & 2-3 honors

Awards:

10th grade Deans List Appearance

10th grade Department Awards for Distinction in chemistry and Spanish

11th grade Deans List Appearance

11th grade Department Awards for Distinction in English and Algebra II

Extracurriculars:

  1. Founder of my school’s debate society, which trains and recruits students of my school and others and is set to compete in New York City debate tournaments. Focuses strongly on language.

  2. Have published works in three notable literary and poetry-oriented publications (1 national, 2 in New York)

  3. Editor of and contributor to my school’s newspaper

  4. Member of review committee to award-winning literary magazine (affiliated with my school)

  5. Have a literary portfolio (WIP)

Essays/LORs/Other:

Essays: coming along well thus far

LORs: Two - one from Algebra teacher whose class I attained a 99 average in, other from English teacher who was very complimentary of my work. Possible third pending from in-school tutor.

Cost constraints:

None, applying with intention to pay full tuition

Additional comments:

I came to my school from a special needs middle school (I was diagnosed with a few LD’s). I had failed two grades previously and would have been held back were it not for my middle school battling it out with the Department of Education.

Freshman year at my current school was rough. It was a major adjustment for me, and the curriculum was mainstream (unlike my Sp-Ed middle school).

I pulled off a 2.7 GPA in freshman year and studied during the summer before sophomore. My GPA has been a 4.0 since then, but my mediocre freshman year kept me from taking more AP/Honors courses and dramatically reduced my class rank.

Reverse Chance Me:

With my 9th grade statistics included, I have a cumulative 3.7 GPA (which may become a 3.8 by next year, 12th grade).

So: which schools do you think I might have a chance at with this taken into account?

Thanks everyone!

2

Well what type of school do you seek? Large, mid size, small, sports, greek life, etc.

So your rigor a tad low - but it sounds like that’s all that was avail.

I mean, do you want a LAC - like a Sarah Lawrence or Skidmore.

A mid size school like a Hofstra or Quinnipiac.

Or a large, sport school such as SUNY B, Syracuse, or Delaware, etc.

Need more info.

3

Thanks for replying. I’m really looking for a hybrid model. I want a school on the smaller side with a scenic campus and a walkable town nearby.

I also want a prestigious enough school. It could be anywhere from Skidmore to Stanford in terms of prestige.

Below, I’ll list some schools you could (perhaps) chance me on, and then if you could reverse chance me I’d much appreciate it :slight_smile:

Below are 3 schools that don’t consider freshman year grades:

  • Stanford
  • Princeton
  • Emory

Here are 3 that do:

  • Tufts
  • Hamilton
  • Skidmore

If you don’t mind replying, what do you think are my chances at those? What are some other schools I may be a good candidate for?

4

Because you’re thinking of going test optional more emphasis is being placed on your grades. I believe the California State University System does exclude Freshman year grades if you are interested in heading our west.

Do you think have any thoughts on what you want to do with an English Degree? Teaching, Publishing, Law School, Author? If you have a specific interest it might be helpful in suggesting options.

1 Like
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Don’t forget, we are all on here amateur AOs…so take my feedback with a grain of salt.

First off, you didn’t ask about $$ - but why pay full for a degree in English.

So my take is a far no to the first five - not close.

And Skidmore a likely, especially if full pay.

Ones that might work - so with city nearby:

Reed - reach
Macalester - high target / slight reach
Lafayette - target - they love full pay
Occidental - match
Rhodes - match
Trinity - match
Franklin & Marshall - match
Connecticut - match
Trinity San Antonio - match
Wooster - safety
Lewis & Clark - safety
Dickinson - low match / very likely
Kalamazoo - safety

How about a small SUNY such as Geneseo, Pottsdam, or Fredonia - no reason to overspend.

Good luck.

6

California UC’s and Cal states do not consider 9th grades in their GPA calculation but still require 9th grades to reported and the a-g course requirements (core courses) to be completed with satisfactory grades C- or higher for eligibility. If spending around $45-65K/year for these schools are affordable without little to no financial aid, then worth considering.

7

Might I ask why it’s a no for the first five? I know they are all reaches for everyone, and I’m not suggesting you’re wrong, just wondering why. I always get varied answers from people - some say I have a chance at those first five (and counterparts on that caliber), while others say I don’t.

Knowing the criterion for your assessment would help put my mind at ease. What’s wrong? Grades? Course rigor? SAT scores?

Everything?

8

So if you have a guidance counselor, run it by him - perhaps your school is well thought of, etc. and places people.

While I see some great accomplishments and there’s nothing wrong with your record, I don’t see rigor - you say 10th grade standard. And that is my hesitancy. You didn’t take a crazy hard schedule. Also, your class rank is - ehhhh - for these schools - especially if closer to 10%.

A high test score would help but when you talk Stanford, Princeton or Tufts - I mean, that’s over the top for anyone - and Emory or Hamilton are very difficult. My daughter was WL at Emory with a 4.5 weighted and 32 ACT. You can help your chance there by applying to Oxford, their small LAC - but it’s not walkable to much. And I personally don’t see it happening. But again, i’m an amateur and I’m just one opinion.

I actually provided you some outstanding schools, btw. You need to find the right fit, not the name you see in a rank. What you are majoring in is not job ready and all those schools I gave you will give you great prep for a fantastic grad school.

You have 20 common app spots - so swing for the fences - but include four or 5 target/matches so you’ll find a great school that works for yourself.

Personally, I’d rather see you go to a U of Arizona, join the Honors College to shrink the size, and practically have free tuition.

Any way, there’s nothing wrong with you - and there’s nothing wrong with any of the colleges I listed. There’s many more but you want a nearby town. But i see you in that 25 and later LAC type school - and those are very strong!!

Don’t let a pedigree crush your dream. Millions of successful individuals have gone to schools you’ve never heard of.

I would set up a generic email - such as crisclassof22@gmail.com and go to any college of interest - and get on their email list. This way, you can have all colleges of interest in one place and colleges will track your interest so open emails, play videos even if you don’t watch.

They’ll also send you free app codes. Demonstrating interest is very important.

You’ll be fine.

9

Ideally, I’d become a communications manager. The thing is that my family is very heavily involved (and successful) in real estate and may want to drag me in as well.

I honestly do not have an idea of where it is, precisely, that I want to go.

Skidmore is close by and seems to be in a great area. I know several successful people who attended.

But another side of me wants to maximize my potential on the prestige side. I know that I am capable of doing exceptional work at most universities - even the big names. And some believe I have the stats and context (story) to get in to many of them.

A balance of prestige and experience is what I am looking for most.

10

It seems you have created a different user name since you posted here: Reverse chance me, please!. This can be disappointing to contributors who replied to your earlier thread.

11

I have forgotten the email to that account and was meaning to make some replies. I figured reposting would be fresher and easier.

12

I don’t quite trust my college counselor, and the concept in general. My brother had a 3.5 GPA (below average for his far reach), no test scores, no extracurriculars whatsoever, and no honors/AP courses. His counselor told him not even to apply to the top 10 program he was aiming for.

He ended up getting in regular decision.

My counselor seems all over the place. Some of the things he has said don’t seem to check out very much, and I’m getting mixed messages. That’s one of the reasons I’ve come to these threads.

Now, for my stats.

My GPA is a 4.0 UW (highest possible) and a 4.2 W. Both are above average for many of the schools I listed, including Stanford, which doesn’t consider freshman grades.

And it was because of my freshman year that I couldn’t take many honors/AP courses. I came from a special needs school (I have several learning disorders) and had failed two prior grades and also attended three separate middle schools.

Because of my prior Sp-Ed school, I was given standard academic classes during freshman year at my school. They were very challenging for me as I had no academic motivation/experience whatsoever. I wanted to change that, so I studied for my courses over the summer before 10th grade. I ended up with a 4.0 that year, but was still ineligible for honors/AP courses. It was only last year (11th grade) that I was offered those courses and applied for all of the ones available to me (they gave me 2 honors). Next year I’m set to take 3 honors and 1-2 AP’s (one of which is AP Literature).

Class rank at my school is weighted and includes freshman year. Obviously, both of these terms work against me, but are easily explainable. Without freshman year and a weighted rank, I’d very likely be in the top 5-10% in my entire grade.

Against this backdrop, it should be obvious why my stats lack in some areas. It has nothing to do with my intellect or academic drive, but past complications (for which I was also not at fault) that held me back. Hopefully that means something to AO’s.

As I’ve mentioned to another user here, I want a balance of prestige and experience. I want to apply to some far reaches, like the 6 I listed, but would be equally content at some smaller, less prestigious schools. I can also apply E.D. to one or more schools which may greatly increase the probability of admission.

Edit: my school only offers 4 AP courses. Two in 11th grade and two in 12th. That isn’t exactly a large offering, either.

13

What is prestige? Don’t be a sucker for a rank in US News, etc. Now let’s be honest and again, it’s just my opinion, but you’re not going to get into what you deem a prestigious school.

That said, as long as you have satisfactory matches and safeties - and I tried to give you some to research and I suggest you do so and visit some (perhaps you’ll come up with others - I tried to give you what you want - near a town) - as long as you have a few that you know you’ll get into, you can reach for whatever you want. If you have the time, there’s nothing wrong with that.

But when you are going against the creme de la creme of students, these are kids with 12 and 14 APs, with top test scores, and top notch grades. That’s just not you.

btw - look at leaders in society…they run the gamut - public schools, elite schools. You know a top English school - U of Iowa.

What is prestige going to bring you?

The only way you’ll know is if you apply. My opinion matters nothing. The AOs do. So craft your best application. Wow them with your writing.

Just apply for a few safeties and matches - and don’t “under estimate” those - meaning some see safeties that are really reaches - and they get turned down everywhere.

So be smart - and you’ll find the right school for you.

I don’t think it will be the reach you hope for - but again, it’s fine to apply as long as you apply to others you can be assured of admission.

Understand you can find a great education anywhere and everywhere - so your strategy of perceived pedigree - which is just effective marketing - is short sighted.

Good luck.

14

But when you are going against the creme de la creme of students, these are kids with 12 and 14 APs, with top test scores, and top notch grades. That’s just not you.

A 4.0 UW GPA at a school omitting freshman year from consideration sounds top notch enough to me.

I just don’t quite agree with your evaluation, and I am being completely honest with myself.

My circumstances, my story. They explain away the mediocre performance in freshman year and the minimized opportunities for honors and APs that followed, as well as the lower class rank (which is also weighted).

And even with all that, my school doesn’t offer many AP’s at all. Nonetheless, the first chance I had (last year), I applied for every honors & AP course available to me, and ended up in honors. Because I excelled in those courses, I will be in at least one of two AP courses next year.

As for test taking, I chose not to take the SAT on account of the pandemic and the new wave of test-optional school policies. Forgoing the test allowed me to take up new extracurriculars and focus on my grades (which could have easily fallen during the pandemic).

I see what you mean on the surface. I don’t have the traditional application, but a textural one. It has a story about it, and when it is read, it is easy to put two and two together. That’s what I’ve often been told and personally tend to believe. That does not mean I will get into the most prestigious of schools, but it should mean I have something of a chance. I would, in some ways, even prefer a less prestigious school with a better environment.

It’s all a balancing act.

15

My friend, there is many a student with a 4.0, rigor, and a 36 ACT getting turned down to the finest institutions. You have a 4.0 but no rigor and no test score. Here’s an example - the valedictorian of my daughter’s class applied to 16 top 20 schools. She had a 4.0, 4.5 weighted and 36 ACT. She was 0 for 16. She got into NYU but no aid and is going to U of TN.

It’s ok to disagree with me. I may not be right. But then why ask for people’s opinions if you are going to dismiss them?

As I said, apply where you want - I have no issue with that as long as you find several match/safety schools - which means, if you ended up there, you’d be ok. In other words, don’t apply to a school that you’d have no desire or you can in no way see yourself attending.

I gave you many schools - and there are many more you can find on your own - that anyone would be proud to attend - such as Kalamazoo, Wooster, Franklin & Marshall. These are great, very respected names.

Again, I wish you luck. I hope you get in where you think you will. I have serious doubts that you are even close - but it doesn’t matter. You should absolutely apply - my guidance is to have a back up. If I’m wrong, then no harm - you wasted a few bucks and a little time. If I’m right, you’ll have a credible school to attend. Based on what you’re saying, you really need to craft your story in a way that the AOs can see what you are trying to convey. Most will see what you said your life is on the surface - and therefore most will dismiss you. The question is - can you share your story in a way that will resonate with them, decide to give you a chance over the many valedictorians, salutatorians, and other accomplished students that are competing against you for a spot?

Again, good luck - and I hope you achieve your education and lifelong goals.

One last thing- I love this line right here: prefer a less prestigious school with a better environment.

Take out the word “prestigious” which really has no meaning except if you want it to…and then read that sentence again: prefer a school with a better environment.

I agree with this - find the school with the best environment for you, whether you deem it prestigious or not.

You have to spend four years there, day after day - and what one sees as prestige another may not. Many see school’s I mentioned - Skidmore, Occidental, Kalamazoo as prestigious. Others don’t see Wesleyan, Davison, Colgate, Washington & Lee as prestigious even though they are highly ranked.

There is no true thing such as prestige - we all form opinions based on marketing, lists, or otherwise - and what you see is different than what maybe I see - and honestly, it’s not relevant.

What is relevant that you spend your four years in an environment that is best suited for you.

I think I killed this one - but I do hope you take my guidance to heart (whether or not you use it) and I will watch to see if others comment - and hopefully they do - so you can get further perspectives.

Again, I wish you luck.

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