choosing schools based on money / FA appeals

so the school’s i’m looking at currently are WashU and UIUC. UIUC is a state school for me.

i got FA packages from both last week. UIUC gave me nothing, and WashU gave me 17.7k (~5k in loans). my family’s EFC is ~52k, which is ridiculous because my dad’s yearly income is not more than 150k. he’s already said he will not pay that much, and is only willing to put forth ~10k per year out of pocket.

WashU has a 3-2 program which would enable me to finish two degrees in five years (a bachelor’s of social work and a master’s). my 529 would cover approx. ~14k/ yr at WashU. so going in I would have to pay ~30k/ year, which is still way more than my family can do.

UIUC does not have a 3-2 program. so to get my master’s would be an extra 2 years of school (i think). however, my 529 there covers eight full semesters of tuition. i also got a 10k/yr merit scholarship, so the entire cost of my undergrad, should i go to UIUC, would be basically free.

however, my sister will be a senior my freshman year of college, so my sophomore year my parents will have 2 students in college. my first year of grad school, my parents will have 3 kids in college. do you think this would have enough of an impact on my FA from WashU that it would make it feasible to attend?

i’m currently attempting to appeal for more FA from WashU because I do really want to go there, they flew me out for discovery weekend in september and i’ve loved it since. UIUC is a good school, i know, but my HS feeds 50+ students there each year, and chambana doesnt really intrigue me anyway. i don’t want to put my family in debt unnecessarily, but i dont want to compromise the quality of my education at all.

any tips for appealing for FA/ advice on what I should ultimately do?

For your first year of graduate school, you will be considered an independent student and your parents income will no longer matter, as you will only be offered loans to cover the cost of the program - unless you can get an assistantship or institutional funding to cover the cost of the program. I don’t think an appeal is going to get you far unless there is something specific in your family’s finances to ask the school to exclude/reconsider.

You wont get aid for the masters part of your program. You’ll likely just get offered huge loans, which aren’t a good idea for that major.


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i got FA packages from both last week. UIUC gave me nothing, and WashU gave me 17.7k (~5k in loans). my family's EFC is ~52k, which is ridiculous because my dad's yearly income is not more than 150k. he's already said he will not pay that much, and is only willing to put forth ~10k per year out of pocket.

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Your parents likely have assets, including the college savings accts.

Where else did you apply??? Did you run any of the NPCs when you were picking schools to make sure that you had affordable schools???

Are you a NMF, by any chance???

Your dad (your parents) have $300k in non-protected assets. BTW…your dad is also self-employed…that is also an issue. And, your dad could put some of that in protected accts. There are options for self-employed.

What was your FAFSA EFC? $52k?

You were lucky to get anything from WashU. With your dad being self employed, the school could have really over-estimated contribution.


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However, my dad is pushing for me to go to his alma mater, UIUC. I have a 10k/yr merit scholarship from them, and my 529 (college of illinois) would cover full tuition--essentially, UIUC would be free for me.

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ok…so you have a safety…good. Go there.

Lucky that you have 529 enough to cover 4 year tuition. Nevertheless, 529 is an education saving account, so UIUC is not “free” for you but just within your budget.


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You wont get aid for the masters part of your program. You'll likely just get offered huge loans, which aren't a good idea for that major.

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not looking to get aid for it, just thinking that it would be a reason for them to maybe want to respond positively to my appeal, given that i will be spending more money for a masters with them in addition to my undergrad.


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Your dad (your parents) have $300k in non-protected assets. BTW....your dad is also self-employed....that is also an issue. And, your dad could put some of that in protected accts. There are options for self-employed.

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~150k of those assets are retirement money in brokerage accts. idk if that matters. the rest are 529s (3 of them, one each for me and my siblings). the weird thing about his job situation is that his company (paid for in full by his business partner) is worth 0–theyve made no money from it in the past 10 years, he just makes what his partner pays him.


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Where else did you apply??? Did you run any of the NPCs when you were picking schools to make sure that you had affordable schools????

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Are you a NMF, by any chance???


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i applied to 11 schools. the other 9 were uchicago, northwestern, upenn, columbia, ut austin, montana state, university of iowa, prescott college, and eckerd college. gotten into all except uchicago and obv havent heard from nw, upenn, and columbia yet. not NMF, just commended.


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Lucky that you have 529 enough to cover 4 year tuition. Nevertheless, 529 is an education saving account, so UIUC is not "free" for you but just within your budget.

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jeez, sorry i worded that wrong.

Wait to see what the other schools give (if anything).

However, for the career you are looking at, taking out loans does not make sense.
Having enough money to cover both a bachelors and masters would be ideal (the 529 can be used to pay for graduate education as well).

You’re going to ask them to give you more FA on the chance you’ll complete a 3+2 program and continue on to grad school. Good luck with that.

If the $150K in brokerage accounts is not a 401K or other recognized retirement account by the IRS then it’s free game.

The making no money is after deductions, which would include your father’s $150K in come. That’s why schools look at self employed info closely.

If you’re looking to get a MSW and then become a LCSW, you have to look long term and avoid as much debt as possible. I don’t know what the LCSW regulations in your state are, but many require a ton of “internship” hours before licensing. You don’t want to have a bunch of debt, and then have it grow during all of this.

My sister (an LCSW) had no undergrad debt, but did have debt for USC (calif) for her MSW (and this was 25 years ago when it was cheaper!). It took her a very long painful time to pay back all that debt.

I think you should go find your parents right now and give them a huge hug for having been such disciplined savers, and for having had the foresight to fund your education for so many years.

There were no doubt a lot of things they didn’t buy or do which would have made their lives easier. Instead- their thrift is allowing you to get an education without going into debt, taking the bus from home to a local community college, or having to make a commitment to the military via ROTC. In a few weeks, CC will be filled with kids who have sad stories about the enormous debt they are taking on, the many years commitment to the armed services, etc. because although their parents make about what yours make, they have zero saved on their behalf for college.

So go give them a big hug. Unless you made an error in filing your financial aid application, it’s not likely based on the facts you’ve presented here that you’ll be able to get the folks at Wash U to up your aid. But you’ve got a terrific alternative which is affordable!

You are lucky and are going to do wonderful things with your education!!!

Anyone who reads this - please do not join ROTC or the military just to get money for college. It will be bad for you and bad for the military. If you truly have a desire to serve your country, than by all means, please explore the options that will allow you to do this while earning money for school.


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You're going to ask them to give you more FA on the chance you'll complete a 3+2 program and continue on to grad school. Good luck with that.

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that’t not the only reason… but alright. thanks for wishing me good luck!!!


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The making no money is after deductions, which would include your father's $150K in come. That's why schools look at self employed info closely.

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no… they make negative after deductions, then, since they literally make NO money and my dad’s partner just pays him to come in every day and work on products that have never been released. I guess either way, it would be wise to qualify this with my FA appeal.


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If you're looking to get a MSW and then become a LCSW, you have to look long term and avoid as much debt as possible. I don't know what the LCSW regulations in your state are, but many require a ton of "internship" hours before licensing. You don't want to have a bunch of debt, and then have it grow during all of this.

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of course i don’t want debt, which is why i’m looking to appeal for more aid. if i don’t get enough i’m obviously going to go to uiuc. one of the two questions i asked in my original post was for tips about appealing for fa–so far i’ve gotten none?


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I think you should go find your parents right now and give them a huge hug for having been such disciplined savers, and for having had the foresight to fund your education for so many years.

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they already know i’m grateful–the 40k they put into mine and my siblings’ 529s is effectively doubled now as the cost of a public state school rose, which is fantastic. we’re obv looking for any fafsa errors (there are probably a few, as my dad only grudgingly filled it out assuming we would get nothing, and didnt read up on what to put and what not to put in each section).


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Anyone who reads this - please do not join ROTC or the military just to get money for college. It will be bad for you and bad for the military. If you truly have a desire to serve your country, than by all means, please explore the options that will allow you to do this while earning money for school.

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agreed! i looked into the rotc at the beginning of the college application process but it ultimately is not for me–as you said, it would be bad for me and for the military!

You have gotten no tips about appealing because there aren’t any to give. There is no such thing as FA appeal at private colleges. Just because you command doesn’t mean we can pull it out of our rear ends.

The only thing you can do is show a better offer from a peer or better school or ask if there is any merit aid available to allow you to come to your number one school, but you can only do this if you are going to enroll if they come through with anything.

Generally, for an appeal you want an extraordinary circumstance that the school didn’t know about or couldn’t have considered before the original financial aid decision was made. The examples that I have seen were something like the sudden lay off or sudden death of a primary breadwinner right in the middle of college decision season.

The issue with that is that there’s no real guarantee that you will choose to stay with them for a master’s degree, right? I mean, you can say that now but so can anyone else; they can’t make financial aid decisions because for all they know you might go to grad school elsewhere or change majors.

This probably won’t make that much of a difference either unfortunately. Your father is receiving income; the fact that the business that he is working with isn’t profitable doesn’t mean anything in terms of EFC. There are probably plenty of folks out there who are drawing income from businesses that are struggling, either as employees, as owner/managers, or as partners.

I think you should file the appeal for your peace of mind but there’s really nothing in what you have described so far that will increase financial aid significantly for someone with an EFC of $52K.

An appeal to the FA offices very rarely works especially if your parents have save money for you.

I work with a lot of MSW’s LCSW’s, MFT’s and Psychs. They owe a lot of money. We get hundreds of applications from OOS grads who want to work in California but don’t understand how little the pay is versus how costly the housing is.

I don’t want to put a damper on your future goals, but please consider what your field will pay, vs. how much debt you will incur and for how long.

Getting multiple degrees in this area of study doesn’t necessarily increase your income.


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You have gotten no tips about appealing because there aren't any to give. There is no such thing as FA appeal at private colleges. Just because you command doesn't mean we can pull it out of our rear ends.

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plenty of my friends that go the colleges I want to go to have done it and been successful… obviously i’m not going to “command” anything but since when has it hurt to inquire? the only reason i’m even going to appeal is because i’ve heard stories of washu’s financial aid being super helpful and generous.


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I think you should file the appeal for your peace of mind but there's really nothing in what you have described so far that will increase financial aid significantly for someone with an EFC of $52K.

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I’m not comfortable explaining my family’s ENTIRE situation online, so there are a few things I could include that are not mentioned here.


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I don't want to put a damper on your future goals, but please consider what your field will pay, vs. how much debt you will incur and for how long.

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thank you for the concern–return on interest for college/ career choices has ben something i’ve thought a lot about, especially since i went into high school initially hoping to study studio art, lol.

Perhaps it would be most helpful then to talk with your friends to get the tips that you are asking about.


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Perhaps it would be most helpful then to talk with your friends to get the tips that you are asking about.

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I have, that’s what I did first. i just assumed there would be more people on here with different tips/ advice than my friends offered.

Why don’t you share with us some of the tips that your friends have given you, so that we’re not reinventing the wheel for you and can come up with some different ideas that might help.


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Why don't you share with us some of the tips that your friends have given you, so that we're not reinventing the wheel for you and can come up with some different ideas that might help.

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can’t tell if you genuinely want to help or not, but i’ll bite.

my friends have suggested making sure they (FA people) know their school is your first choice, talking about how grateful you are that they gave you anything to begin with and to obviously not just ask for more money off the bat–don’t appear entitled, don’t refer to it as a “negotiation” or a “bargain”. rather, ask for more info on the options they gave you (loans, work study, need scholarships) and their policy on reviewing students’ individual financial situation. come up with actual numbers and the documentation for any outside circumstances/ changes in situation that could affect your ability to pay. don’t use emotion, use logic, as that’s what they’ll respond to best.

one of my best friends got an extra 20k from washu by asking and explaining her family’s circumstances, and she said they were wonderful and really tried to make things work for any student that they had accepted.