<p>Next year I'll be a undergraduate freshman at Texas A&M studying Political Science and Economics. I'm going to do ROTC over there and serve in the Army, but afterwards I want to get a job with the CIA as an intelligence analyst. I know Bengali a bit of Urdu and I hope to learn Arabic in the military. Is it possible to get a CIA job with these credentials?</p>
<p>JGDO, you have a solid plan, especially if you become an Intelligence Officer in the Army as it will directly translate to a CIA related position - not to mention open more doors for you than just the CIA.</p>
<p>Urdu will be a big ticket if you can become fairly fluent and even certified some how. Even in 8-10 years from now (when you would be going for the CIA position, minus hiring process time and the BI) Pakistan should still be a hot button and that language will come in handy for there and neighboring countries (along with Arabic, of course). Are you a native speaker of Bangali?</p>
<p>Are you asking if it’s possible to get offered a CIA position after learning 3 possible languages, going to a target school, majoring in a relevant subject, and serving a stint with the Army? Yes, I would imagine so.</p>
<p>If your end goal was to be an operator, you might have a better shot with grad school, assuming you keep your grades up. Also, you might be interested in picking up the book, “Fair Play: The Moral Dilemmas of Spying”. It was written by a professor at your future university with ties to the political science/economics department. Reading it as a freshman would be a heck of an ice breaker.</p>
<p>Remember there is more to the intelligence community than just the CIA.</p>
<p>Skills in a target language obviously would provide a big leg up. Getting an intel slot in the Army is probably important if you want to be an analyst.</p>
<p>If you have other citizenship, you very well might have to give it up.</p>
<p>I don’t know if the CIA has internal culture issues with former military or not. Just putting it out there as something that might exist. CIA prides itself as not being a military organization.</p>
<p>Hello chaps, I’m not the OP, but I’d like to hijack this thread for another question:
Imagine there is someone who has two doctorates and speaks three languages next to English fluently including Arabic and Farsi. This person has probably a strong profile for the agency or any other government organization. The problem is that this person is already 32 and still requires 2 years before receiving the US citizenship. As the maximal age is 35 this person would be very close to not meet minimal requirements (we know how long the selection process takes… maybe even a year?). Let’s just look at the Core Collector job offer as an example. It is states that they’ll consider you at the age of 21-25 straight out of college or at the age of 26-35 with work experience. Yet this person has technically no work experience, or only a maximum of 2 years (given that we don’t call PhD and MD studies real work). Is this still a viable candidate? </p>
<p>Thanks for any help.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>For the CIA? IMO, no.</p>
<p>I may be incorrect, but I thought only citizens could work for the CIA (or ANY gov’t agency, for that matter)?</p>
<p>Assuming they ARE a citizen even, as far as the work exp goes, I guess they would be a viable candidate since they technically meet the age/work exp requirement: 32 with 2 solid years work exp (26-35 with work exp considered).</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Sorta English is my first language, but I’m an ethnic Bangladeshi so I’ve been learning Bengali since a young age. I can understand most conversations, but its been a while since I actually put the language to practical use so my conversational skills are a bit rusty. However I can basically relearn the language in two weeks if I go back to Bangladesh.</p>
<p>US citizenship required. The person might be able to get in at the end of the age window, but I don’t think they are going to budge on the citizenship thing.</p>
<p>
Of course, I’m doing research into the ATF, FBI, and State Department as well.</p>
<p>@Hedged</p>
<p>I’ll take your advice on the book, it wouldn’t hurt me to do some light summer reading anyways. I was planning on staying at the Bush School to get a degree in International Relations once I’m put in the reserves. Should I stick with this plan if I want to be an operator?</p>
<p>Thanks for the advice so far everyone.</p>
<p>
You’ve been watching far too many movies. There are no “target schools” for the CIA. There is a misconception that going to a “target school” gives you a leg up on government recruiting for positions that require a TS (top secret) clearance. In most cases, it is quite the opposite. Target schools tend to be expensive. Many students take on substantial debt to attend these schools. Debt is a VERY significant factor on whether you will be granted a TS clearance. Applicants with more debt are susceptible to becoming a security risk. The costs of breaches in security are far too great when weighing it against a “name brand” education. This extends to many other areas of government recruiting such as federal law enforcement (FBI, USSS, DEA, ATF, etc.).
The CIA has “core collectors”. They are not “operators”. They are not Jason Bourne, James Bond, Jack Bauer, etc. Operators refer to individuals serving in combat arms MOSs in units that belong to USSOCOM. These units may, at times, may be OPCON to the CIA for a very limited duration to perform operations that are more military in nature.
The skillset that is required for this line of work is very specific and cannot be taught in a classroom. I doubt you will see very many if any core collectors right out of undergrad unless they have very specialized and relevant work experience prior to undergrad.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>The entire intelligence apparatus for the US is very complex. There is a vast array of alphabet soup agencies dipping their feet into the intelligence gathering business.</p>
<p>As for the Military Intelligence CMF (Career Management Field in the Army, there are very limited slots at the 2LT level. MI is shaped like a stovepipe. The vast majority of slots for a MI officer are for CPT, MAJ, and LTCs. However, most people who want to branch MI may not necessarily want to be doing MI but they are after the TS clearance. MI is the only basic branch that requires its 2LTs to have a TS clearance. The TS clearance is worth a premium in the private sector if you are being employed by a defense contractor. However, I do not know if the TS clearance transfers over to the CIA. The federal organization that does the TS clearance is OPM (Office of Personnel Management). I know for a fact that if I had a TS clearance under the DoD it is still not transferable to the DoJ for example.</p>
<p>The best advice I have for you is that the Infantry branch offers the most opportunity for specialized assignments and the most opportunity for advancement. The vast majority of flag officers in the Army have Infantry as their basic branch. I have seen many Infantry officers re-branch to a combat support or combat service support branch but I have never seen CS or CSS officers command a MFE unit unless they were SF in which case they are awarded the 11A and 18A CMF identifier.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Incorrect. Debt is held against you in a security clearance when it is delinquent, as in you are currently behind in payments or have not paid. Having debt in and of itself does not effect a clearance really at all if you are making even the minimum stated monthly payments.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>You are misinformed.</p>
<p>There are various levels of security clearances and each has a different standard that must be met.</p>
<p>After knowing people who are involved in that entire process (E-qips, JPAS) at the State G1 and knowing an ARNG LT in my unit that works as a Army civilian processing these cases, I can assure you there are many people who are denied clearances SOLELY based on finances when they have NO delinquent debt. Of course, the % that are denied for these exact reasons alone are different for each type of clearance with TS clearances being denied far more frequently for having high debt to income ratios than standard “secret” level security clearance.</p>
<p>It comes down to how “likely” and what “level” of debt someone is carrying. I’ve seen more than enough cases to have a general idea of both of these factors to say what I had originally said.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Again, I would “hope” we did not grant security clearances to people who have large debt and are in a position where the income would not pay off that debt, right?</p>
<p>kk, I think I’m pretty well informed. I too have an intelligence background and have lots of friends that process or did process BIs and security clearances. I have talked extensively with them on what affects them and what does not. Yes, someone with $300,000 debt with absolutely little (poverty level) to no income may be considered a higher risk. However, a fresh undergrad with the average of 30k student loans, or even near 70 or 80k after a grad school would not be held from a TS based solely on that.</p>
<p>Besides, the OP’s plan is to go from undergrad to AD (did you miss that?). I’m sure they can pay down a whole lot if not all of their undergrad loans from their AD pay over 4-5 years as an officer. I know MANY officers who did just that.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>“Intelligence background” and “friends”. Those terms are very convincing…</p>
<p>People have been DQ’d from the hiring process for big city PDs for large yet not delinquent student loans. You think this is going to be any better for any FLEA or the CIA which require a TS?</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>The OP’s plan is largely conjecture. He is a high school senior projecting what he might pursue 4+ years down the road. He has to get through high school, college, ROTC, BOLC, etc. Did you miss that?</p>
<p>He simply doesn’t just “go” AD these days. The Army is drawing down very quickly as we pull out of Afghanistan. That is going to make the National OML very competitive. In fact, there’s a chance he may not even assess AD. We are transitioning to a peacetime Army. The officers you KNOW right now will be a different generation than the incoming officers over the next 4-10 years. You should look at what the Army is requiring these days and how they are restructuring/transitioning. They are available in numerous MILPERs off the HRC site that will clue you in on this.</p>
<p>It seems what you heard from “people you know” isn’t really from people “in the know”. You are clearly not informed.</p>
<p>If the OP chooses to go to AD Army route, he won’t have the required work experience to be successful in the CIA until he is somewhere between a junior to senior CPT with rated company command time. With the promotion timeline reflective of the current officer strength and projected strength, you’re looking at somewhere from 5-7 years of time in service from date of commission. That will be your transitional period from being a tactical leader to organizational management.</p>
<p>kk is obviously offended that anonymous posters on a forum have other experiences and suggestions or insights to offer.</p>
<p>
Unlike you I’m not going to spit off a whole bunch of jargon that doesn’t really help the OP at this point. I like to keep it simple for other future viewers/students to also understand. I’m not going to be the dolt posting on the web everyone I’ve met and everything I’ve ever done just to somehow prove my position on, once again, an anonymous forum where everything should be taken with a grain of salt anyway.</p>
<p>
Talk about conjecture. You’re right, the OP won’t be looking to AD for about another 4 years from now. If going on your own statement that the Army may be different in 4-10 years, then offering the argument that the OP may not be well suited for the Army today is a bit pointless. A LOT of things can happen in 4 years. It’s worthless to the OP if you are speculating negatively on their initial plan based on what may possibly happen or continue to happen in the future.</p>
<p>
This is one of your more correct statements. OP, as I’m sure you might have thought, your general plan will take some time.</p>
<p>OP, there are some people here that are trying to give the best unprofessional advice we can, but there are others who would rather pump their chests and try to be the know-all be-all. With anything you take away from here, just know that everything said is just a grain in the shaker. We are only one view point and outside resources may turn up some better suggestions (like an Army recruiter).</p>
<p>@turtlerock
As you have some kind of intelligence background I’d like to ask you one more thing. The problem wasn’t the citizenship. The problem is rather that I’d have it with 2 doctorates and 2 years work experience at the age of 33-34, which is very close to 35. The real problem is that the CIA probably expects some “relevant” work during the age of 26-35. They do not state it directly on their homepage regarding core-collectors (just “work experience”), though. Are 3 years research in engineering (and possibly some medical research during the degree) regarded as solid work? It involves analytic skills, I’d say. Furthermore I have some work-experience at hospitals, a business consultancy and in a research institute.</p>
<p>I might consider to drop out of med-school but I don’t like the idea of throwing out 2 years of hard work that I was interested in just in order to fit a time-frame. Maybe I transfer to an Arabic country in order to improve my fluency in Arabic and to gain more cultural experience- with the risk that my degree isn’t recognized in the USA.</p>
<p>I know that you won’t exactly know what an organization like the CIA might want or not want, but some suggestions might help me.</p>
<p>
Offended wouldn’t be quite the word. Definitely “amused”.
Again, amused. You obviously are not familiar with the subject matter, hence you want to keep it “general”. You can delve into specific parts without compromising OPSEC. As it stands right now, it’s almost so “simple” it’s not offering the OP any real advice.
Reading comprehension isn’t your strong suit or your short-term amnesia is becoming full blown. The second part of the paragraph you decided not to quote:
He can consult the current MILPERs and see the direction the Army is going towards. With a bit of effort, you will find it off the US Army Human Resources Command’s website.
An Army recruiter is one of the worst people to go to for advice just like turtlerock. They either don’t have your interest at heart or are just straight up incompetent on the subject at like turtlerock.</p>
<p>norfol, you’re right, these websites and job openings will almost always just state it as “work experience”. Unfortunately, they do mean specific and specialized, as in the intelligence related kind.</p>
<p>Eventhough Engineering does reflect great analytical skills - among others - it isn’t directly relational to intelligence. I’m sorry, but IMO you may be better suited to finish out your doctorates and look into not as intelligence intensive related CIA positions here: <a href=“https://www.cia.gov/careers/opportunities/cia-jobs/index.html#Engineering[/url]”>https://www.cia.gov/careers/opportunities/cia-jobs/index.html#Engineering</a></p>
<p>Engineering is listed as well. As stated earlier, the age issue may be waived especially if you’re a well qualified candidate and you otherwise meet all of the medical and mental requirements.</p>
<p>
No, I’m just not pretentious. But I like to leave it up to those seeking advice if I’m familiar to which I speak.</p>
<p>
So the OP will need to read those over the course of the next several years? That’s like telling them to follow MARADMINS. A new MARADMIN (Marine Administrative Message) is released almost daily and most of it does not pertain to MEFs (Marine Expiditionary Force) as a whole, so most of it is irrelevant to a vast majority of individuals. It would prove futile to look at those things so many years in advance because, yet again, they can be contradicted a few years or even months later as things change.</p>
<p>
Direct popositions about ME don’t help OTHERS.</p>
<p><em>sigh</em>
</p>
<p>You must be the type that I just have to ignore.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Infantry is still one of my options, one of my backup plans if I didn’t get the intelligence commission is to get my commission in infantry and take a shot at Airborne, Ranger, and Special Forces schools, but I’m assuming these guys do more SAD work rather than advisory duties. While I wouldn’t mind a job with the SAD I’d much rather prefer a analyst job. I’m not expecting the Army to turn me into Jack Bauer, I’m just trying to keep my options open.</p>
<p>As for my current debt situation. Most of my expenses at A&M including tuition and housing are sitting at $20,000 for one year. My father said he’s saved enough money for me to attend SMU for two years. That’s around $100,000 in my college fund without any military or academic scholarships. I’m not too concerned about my undergrad making me a lifelong debtor.</p>