Colgate or Hamilton?

College Search & Selection
1

I’ve been accepted to and visited/overnighted both Colgate and Hamilton, but I still can’t decide. I am planning on majoring in biology/psychology to go to medical school after, though that could change. I’m also coming from a small prep school of 500 or so students, but it’s definitely not “preppy.” Here are my impressions.

Colgate:

I visited Colgate first and the campus was gorgeous. I visited on April Visit Day, so there were a lot of admitted students there and the actual April visit day was rather boring in my opinion. I didn’t feel like I could spend 4 years there until I got to my overnight. My host was absolutely amazing and tried to introduce me to all her friends/include me in her everyday life, etc. but I did meet a lot of fratty guys. I am also Asian, and the Asian population at Colgate is extremely underwhelming, as I saw less than double digits of Asian students. Partway through, I switched hosts (complicated) to an OUS Scholar host, a program (for minorities who have overcome great challenges throughout high school or something) of which I am not a part of, and saw drastic differences. The school felt kind of divided financially and ethnically to me, but also made me feel that I could find a group I would fit in to. It was definitely cliquey, but everyone I met was super friendly. I also know this is a very party school, but that isn’t of much importance to me; I like to party but I don’t need to party.

Hamilton:

Though a lot of people seem to think Colgate is prettier, Hamilton’s campus was more beautiful in my opinion. I visited on a normal day since I couldn’t make their admitted student’s day, and felt like I loved the campus- it was that feeling. However, I was a little put off by my overnight. While I did get to meet a couple students during a class, and they seemed very diverse in terms of type of person, my host was very mediocre. She didn’t even introduce me to her friends when she brought me to her African American (something) Group, and I was left sitting there awkwardly for half an hour as she left me alone with her friends, who didn’t try to get to know me. She had work later that evening, so she left me alone in her dorm room. Basically, I didn’t get to experience what I did at Colgate and didn’t really meet anyone besides my host. Maybe she just doesn’t have a lot of social stuff going on? Dorms nicer at Hamilton too for sure. If it had been based on visit alone, and not overnight, Hamilton wins. But after the overnights, I am not sure. Kind of flip flopped situations. I also noticed more diversity at Hamilton.

Which school is better in your opinion? Should I be worried about what I experienced at my overnight at Hamilton, or was that just a result of a poor host? And should I go with my first feelings of the campus? I think my gut says Hamilton, but I don’t know if I’m biased because it was my top choice on paper.

Sorry this is so long lol idk what to do bc this is the next 4 years of my life

2

Overnights are tricky because most of your perception comes from the host. You had a bad host at Hamilton. That doesn’t mean all students are like that. You had a friendly host at Colgate- doesn’t mean everyone there would be the same. However I will say, Colgate is known for having a strong sense of community and that persists after you graduate with a great alumni network. Hamilton works hard to bring in a diverse student population and is slightly more ethnically diverse than Colgate and perhaps would be a more inclusive place because the administration actively works on diversity programs. I wouldn’t let a bad overnight necessarily scare you and would go with your gut

3

It sounds like you prefer Hamilton but had a poor OV host and that, particularly in contrast to the good OV at Colgate, is making you second guess your gut.

This part is tough because you’re trying to assess how the place feels, but you also know that there is a random factor that plays into this. If you had a glimpse of clique-ish behavior or some divides along wealth lines, I would think about how that would affect you.

Ultimately, both are great schools. You will find your people at either. Reading between the lines, I think you prefer Hamilton…

4

Hamilton. Only because when D was searching, absolutely nothing appealed about Colgate and it never made any list, long or otherwise. Hamilton at least got a vist from us. D didn’t apply, but I liked the two sides of campus and the loose curricular requirements. They are pretty similar in many ways though.

Re your overnight, I wouldn’t worry about that. You will make friends and forget about it. I don’t ever think a choice should be made on an overnight visit, unless it involves something that is an absolute deal-breaker.

5

Pre-med? See if anyone on the pre-med forum attends or has attended and can offer insight into which is a more cooperative environment vs competitive. My anecdote is older, but weeding was a factor.

Fwiw, out of about 775 enrolled, class of 2020, Colgate is roughly 9% ‘Asian and Pacific Islander’ and Ham is 7% Asian, of 475 freshmen. If you only saw a handful at Colgate, clearly, you missed them.

Both are great schools.

6

My son (now at Swat) visited both, applied only to Hamilton. His impression was that Colgate was more frat-centric and not as intellectual, which is why he applied as he did. While Hamilton was something of a safety for him, we would have been very happy for him to go there.

7

USNWR (not a perfect source) lists Colgate as 4% Asian, Hamilton as 7%. For reference, those identifying as Asian nationally represent ~6% of the U.S. population. Note though that this year’s admitted Hamilton class has been reported as the most ethnically diverse in the College’s history:

http://students.hamilton.edu/spectator/news-2015/p/students-admitted-for-class-of-2021-most-diverse-in-hamilton-history/view

8

Regarding your overnight visit at Hamilton, it seems as if your host’s intent was to introduce you to a weeknight experience as it would have been without your presence, so in that microcosm, it may have been authentic. I heard of a similar experience last year in which the guest attended a women’s group meeting that offered little of interest to her. Nonetheless, that student evaluated her visit overall (she also sat in on a class) and felt confident in choosing to apply ED to Hamilton several weeks later.

9

Making the decision based on your experience with one host might not be the best or representative of other students and the friends you’ll make there. I’d go more with your other impressions (which seem to favor Hamilton).

10

Colgate is super prestigious. It has a lot of school spirit. There are lots of parties, but there are also plenty of people who do not partake. I think your chances of getting in to med school or other graduate school are better if you come from a better school. Colgate rubs shoulders with Duke, Dartmouth and Cornell; Hamilton does not.

11

@PNW, both are great schools, albeit with different vibes. That said I can’t fathom what “Colgate rubs shoulders with Duke, Dartmouth and Cornell; Hamilton does not” means…

12

Some eldritch comparison based on a flawed premise, it would seem. Certainly @PNW should be aware that Hamilton reports a lower acceptance rate, higher admission yield and higher entering scores than Colgate, should the implication have been related to elements such as these.

13

@PNW I know I responded to you in another post, but your claims in this thread triggered me so much. Your claim that Colgate “rubs shoulders with Duke, Dartmouth, and Cornell” is just flat out not true. I have friends at Colgate and they would laugh at your claim that Colgate is on par with ivies and other elite schools. Colgate is a fantastic school, but it doesn’t have the same level of resources, nationwide/international recognition, student body, and staff as ivies and other top 20 schools. Just looking at the admissions statistics and class profile of Colgate students and Duke, Dartmouth, and Cornell, there is a huge disparity. It isn’t even a top 5 LAC. I also want to say that I respect Colgate and am not trying to **** on Colgate but am just being realistic.

Also Hamilton is on par as Colgate if not a little bit better.

14

Actually, these schools, along with Hamilton, would be notable for their statistical overlap:

Middle-range ACT Scores

Duke: 31-34
Hamilton: 31-33
Cornell: 30-34
Dartmouth: 30-34
Colgate: 30-33

http://www.■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■/college-profiles-new-sat/

Colgate’s endowment per student surpasses Cornell’s; Hamilton’s EPS surpasses that of Cornell, Brown and Columbia.

http://www.reachhighscholars.org/college_endowments.html

15

@merc81 it’s comparing apples to oranges to compare endowments per student of huge schools with small liberal arts schools. That is like comparing monthly growth of startup businesses to a well established business. The student body size at LACs are so small that the funds donated are still steep. When you get to huge student body sizes, obviously endowments can’t keep up at the same rate of increase and the margins decrease. Marginak returns start diminishing.

What about resources like facilities, faculty, programs, etc. Even though Hamilton and Colgate have higher endowments per student, there are still more resources at Cornell, Duke, etc.

Also, do you have the numbers with SAT scores? It is probably similar, but I am wondering because it is a larger sample size. Also what about other aspects. How many valedictorians or salutatorians go to the ivies and how many go to Colgate/Hamilton?

16

Dontskipthemoose, I HIGHLY doubt you have friends at Colgate who feel inferior to Dartmouth, Carleton or Cornell kids. Perhaps you’re confusing your Hamilton friends with your Colgate friends? Colgate’s admissions numbers reflect the huge pool of athletes and underrepresented kids they accept. Ask around, but I’m pretty sure that an applicant without a special qualification needs a 3.9 GPA and a 32 ACT. That’s the average for my friends who attend or were admitted. Colgate has plenty of valedictorians, but I agree, Hamilton not so much. Hamilton is a great school, and there are great reasons to go there (like a free ride), but it’s several steps down in reputation, and that will translate to a more difficult career or graduate school path at first. After 15 years, your work ethic will carry you, but in fields where pedigree matters, Colgate is a plus. Look up “colleges worth the tuition” and you’ll find schools like the ones I listed above on that list, but not Hamilton. Again, Hamilton is a great school. But it ain’t in the same league as Colgate. Just like GW and Catholic ain’t in the same league as Georgetown in DC, and UCSD ain’t the same as Stanford. All are terrific schools, but they provide different pedigrees (and opportunities). Sorry that these facts and the truth triggers you, but it doesn’t change the facts or the truth.

17

@PNW, unfortunately this thesis you are putting forth isn’t based in fact. Let’s just keep it simple - simpler is better and look at the 2016-2017 Common Data Set information as provided by each school:

Colgate:

SAT - Bottom 25% Top 25%
- Critical Reading. 640 720
- Math 650 740
ACT - 30 33

Hamilton:

SAT - Bottom 25% Top 25%
- Critical Reading. 650 740
- Math 650 740
ACT - 31 33

Not certain what reference to “free-ride” is, but you may be referring to Hamilton being one of 40+/- elite colleges, that are need-blind.

18

https://www.forbes.com/sites/larafishbane/2016/07/06/the-top-college-graduates-who-earn-the-most/2/#1d98b2c5115c

19

That’s one of many ranking systems. USNWR has both schools ranked as #12. BTW, much of the senior leadership at GS, including the current Co-COO, are alumni of Hamilton, so I trust they are preparing students well. Moving on…

20

The ideas that Hamilton is “several steps down in reputation” from Colgate, or not “in the same league” are – well, let’s just say that they’re several steps down from matching up with reality. Just look at the USNews LAC ranking, where they are tied (for 12th).

If anything, there are relatively major differences between these schools, with Colgate being more preppy, more conservative, more professional-oriented, more sports-focused, less diverse, having more Greek life, and having more students from wealthier backgrounds. (Someone pointed to a ratings based on how much graduates earn – some of the factors I just listed are probably more relevant to that than the school itself.)

In my mind, these are all negatives – but if that’s your cup of tea, fine.

OP: It’s unfortunate that you had a bad experience with your overnight visit, but I wouldn’t put too much weight on that, especially since you list so many factors that favor Hamilton. From what you say, I’d go with Hamilton. In any case, you’ve probably already made a decision.