College fears!

<p>Hello, I'm going to be going to college for the first time this fall. I'm really nervous about how I'll do. I'm 19 and took a year off due to being burnt out and having literally no interest in getting an education. So here I am, a year later, applying to school and intending to major in business or economics.</p>

<p>I was a below average student in high school. I made a decent GPA of 3.5 but my SAT scores were record low, I'm serious, I don't think anyone could possibly get a lower score. Because of my low scores, I have to apply to a community college since no other school would accept me with the test scores that I have.</p>

<p>I'm pretty stupid, btw. I've never succeeded in the classroom because most of the material taught is far beyond my reasoning level. I don't have critical thinking skills, creativity, or innovation, so it would be too hard for me to write reflection essays about literature or articles. My reading level is fine and I can comprehend fairly well. I can learn facts and remember them for tests but I cannot do anything that requires abstract reasoning (which is why my test scores are so low).</p>

<p>I'm scared that I won't succeed because I don't have a brain. I know that college is about effort but if you can't even make your mind work then I don't see what kind of effort would help you succeed. You need to be motivated and smart. I'm motivated but dumb.</p>

<p>Realistically, what are my chances of getting higher education?</p>

<p>If you honestly have no interest in getting an education, I suggest that you don’t go to college. You can definitely make a living and have a happy life without going to college. The point is, I am sure that you’re interested in getting an education. You clearly have a brain. All humans do. You can either use it or not; but you still have a brain. Don’t feel that you have to put yourself through college if that’s not what you want to do. For some people, higher education is just not for them. It’s important to have a general idea of what you want to do with your life. If college is required, then you should motivate yourself because if you don’t go, you won’t achieve that life goal. If college isn’t required, and you don’t want to go, then don’t.</p>

<p>Of course I wouldn’t considering going if I didn’t have the ambition to. I didn’t want to a year ago, hence why I mentioned I took a year off. What I want to do does require a college degree which is why I’ve enrolled in school this fall.</p>

<p>It’s true that everyone had a brain but not all brains are equal and worthy of higher education. You can’t simply turn on some magical “smart” switch in your brain and succeed in academics. Some people, like myself, are not able to think in complex levels which is why I’m so nervous to do anything that requires mental activity.</p>

<p>I’ve taught or tutored a number of college students who didn’t have the skills you say you don’t have, some of whom have thought they were stupid. I really haven’t ever ended up agreeing with them on that. I realize that your immediate reaction to that is going to be something like, “Well, you’ve never taught me,” which is true.</p>

<p>But yes, given what you’ve written, both what you say about yourself and the things that I notice about your writing (which is better than a lot of what I’ve read from students who were at the fairly prestigious schools where I’ve tutored, TA’d, or lectured), I believe you can get a decent education. I also believe, though, that it is possible for you to do poorly. I suspect that you will succeed or fail based on (1) your willingness to work hard – from what you say in your post your work ethic alone puts you in a better position to succeed than you probably realize; (2) how well or badly you choose strategies both for individual classes and for your education overall; (3) the kinds of teachers you get; and (4) your ability to set aside your certainty that you are not cut out for post-secondary education and behave as if you believed you belonged there.</p>

<p>I will find this thread again later and write more about the specific things I’ve seen students do that have helped them, and the specific things I’ve done that I think have been central to my success. I don’t have time to write as long a post as I’m probably going to end up doing. But I did want to ask you a few questions:</p>

<p>Have you ever been tested for learning disabilities? If you have not been tested, do you have the resources to get tested now?</p>

<p>How many classes are you expecting to take? If you wanted to take a reduced course load, how few classes could you take given your financial aid and/or your parents’ willingness to pay for your education?</p>

<p>What obligations other than school are you going to have? A job? Family responsibilities?</p>

<p>Do you expect to take developmental classes (classes that don’t count toward your college degree) in math and/or English?</p>

<p>Obviously you don’t have to answer any of those if you don’t want to. Or if you would prefer, you could PM me. But the answers to the questions could affect what my suggestions would be.</p>

<p>nontraditional, thank you for your concerns and advice. I do feel that my written ability is one of my strongest abilities. It may only be because English grammar and spelling is easier for me to remember due to them being repetitive and facts. I’m the same way with math, I’m able to remember and figure out equations so long as I know the rules and guidelines to follow for each set of problems.</p>

<p>I have been tested for a learning disability during my freshmen year of high school. The tests turned up negative. They tested mainly for ADD.</p>

<p>I’m only going part time to easy my way into the academic setting. I haven’t officially signed up for classes (because the deadline isn’t until the end of August). I’m planning on taking two classes starting off this semester, possibility three. Fortunately, money is not an issue in this situation.</p>

<p>I’ll have a job. I work four days a week and I live in my own apartment. Family support is not an option for me so there is no way that I’d be able to give up my job.</p>

<p>I’m figuring that I’ll be required to take developmental classes without my choice. Community colleges in this area require placement testing and I’m 300% sure I’ll be placed in the most basic English and math courses (which will probably require years just to make it to standard level).</p>

<p>Okay, you’re already doing two of the first things I would suggest that you do: taking a reduced course load and preparing to work hard. (It really sounds as if you’ve succeeded so far by using brute force. That’s something I respect: it is hard to spend 12 or 13 years constantly being evaluated according to a standard that seems impossible to achieve and still keep going. But while I think that working hard is going to be a key to your success, I also think that it is important for you to learn less demanding ways of succeeding in school.) I would add to that that you ought to be careful in picking classes that you don’t take multiple classes that will have similar assignments at the same time that you expect to struggle with. So, for example, if you’re concerned about your ability to write papers in which you critically assess something, you shouldn’t take two classes that are going to have term papers requiring critical assessment.</p>

<p>I’ll give you a piece of advice that I would give to any student: go to your professors’ office hours early in the year, and keep going back regularly. Tell them up front that you are willing to work hard, and then show them that you were telling the truth about that. Ask them to clarify things that you don’t understand, but more than that ask them to give you advice about how you can approach the subject to do better. Since you seem to be good at reading and writing, ask them for suggestions about things that you can read to help you understand abstract things that are being discussed in class and things you can read and use as models for your own papers. Then go back and discuss those things with them. (This serves two purposes: it shows your instructors that you really are working hard, which is not something they assume their students do, and it helps you to understand what you’re reading.) </p>

<p>Most of my students who either told me that they weren’t very intelligent or who really seemed to believe that they weren’t very intelligent had a really hard time coming to office hours: they thought I would become frustrated at their “stupidity” and think badly of them. I have to admit that there are some college professors who will do exactly that, but almost everyone I’ve known who teaches respects students who have a hard time and still work hard.</p>

<p>If you think you need more assistance than your professors have time to give you (and some of your professors are going to be adjuncts, and some adjuncts, if they do all the work that most of us think college professors ought to do when they’re teaching a class, end up making less than minimum wage – a lot of adjuncts teach a lot of classes at various schools in order to pay the bills – so there is a limit to what they can offer, but if you’re the only one going to office hours, then at the very least they can give you time then), ask for help finding a tutor. The school may offer free tutoring or you may be able to find someone who did well in the class before or someone who is taking the class with you and doing well, but – as with professors – even though you want someone who knows what he or she is talking about, you want tutors who are good at teaching, not just tutors who are getting As in the class.</p>

<p>I also urge you to go to the library and start looking at books about study skills. Even though you didn’t end up with a diagnosis of learning disability, you should read books aimed at students with learning disabilities, because those are likely to explain how to do things in ways other than the “standard” ones, and the standard ways of doing things have not been serving you well. There will probably be some kind of “learning center” at your school and you should go there as well. Again, ask for methods of studying and learning that work for people who <em>haven’t</em> done well in school in the past.</p>

<p>You could also look into some non-traditional colleges. There are many schools for which SATs are optional. There are many schools that focus on less cerebral education. Check out the Naropa Institute in Boulder Colorado. I know there are others. Here is a link to an article that might be interesting.<br>
[10</a> Tips for Nontraditional College Students: Completing a Continuing Education Program in a Successful Manner | Suite101.com](<a href=“http://continuingeducation.suite101.com/article.cfm/10_tips_for_nontraditional_college_students]10”>Suite 101 - How-tos, Inspiration and Other Ideas to Try)</p>

<p>If you are motivated to learn, that is more than half the battle. I would guess you are far from dumb. You just need to find the place where you can succeed. Such a place exists. It just might not be in the box you think it “should” be in. Hang in there!</p>

<p>One thing that you probably don’t realize is how many college freshmen show up on college campuses – even fairly prestigious college campuses – unable to critically assess an argument. Every semester I encountered students who were used to getting As and who were clearly very intelligent, but who did badly on their midterm or midterm paper because they were accustomed to absorbing and then setting out a bunch of facts (think: faced with the suggestion that x, Socrates responds with y, which shows x to be false; then he suggests that maybe z is the case, but …) but not to critical assessment (think: faced with the suggestion that x, Socrates responds with y, but I don’t think that y adequately refutes x because r. Socrates then suggests z, which I think is a strong position because s, but I still think t is a stronger position because t …). I’ve never known anyone who really tried to learn to critically assess things and who failed completely. </p>

<p>I have known people who never tried, and I have known people who really had a hard time with it and never became great at it, but I’ve never known anyone who tried and failed. But even granting that some people may never get it, I don’t think you’re one of them. Why? Because your original post is a well-set-out argument for the proposition that are not as intelligent as your classmates and that you may not be intelligent enough to succeed in college. That’s more than a lot of freshmen at pretty competitive schools can do. I have no doubt that if I started raising objections to your proposition that you could answer them and give reasons. (“That will not work because …”)</p>

<p>Whatever English class you end up in, and whatever writing-intensive classes you take in general, I suggest that you ask your teacher whether he or she will read and critique short essays that are not assigned and that will not count toward your grade. If your instructor says no (see what I said above about adjuncts), I hope you’ll write anyway and look for people who are good at critical writing and see if they will help. If they won’t, start a blog. Write about things that interest you. In particular, look for things other people have written and write about whether or not you agree with them, and why. Read blogs or essays by people who have positions and argue for them. (Even if your professors don’t have time to critique extra writing, I bet some of them can recommend things for you to read.) Then answer them (even if you don’t name them in your own blog writing you can still say, “Some people may say x, y, and z; but I don’t agree with them. Rather, I believe r, s, and t, because …” But if you do this in papers you submit you will need to cite your sources).</p>

<p>Is any of this helping? I’ll happily keep the conversation going if you want.</p>

<p>But what I think is the most important thing is that you’ve got to stop thinking of yourself as unintelligent. I understand that you’ve spent years watching other people have a much easier time than you have had, and I understand that you’ve been doing through brute force what seems to come naturally to other people. At your age, I thought I was pretty stupid myself (my mother continues to believe that I am stupid, and I had teachers telling me I was up until my second year of college, when I finally figured out what I was good at), and I’ve known a lot of college students who thought they were stupid as well.</p>

<p>But it doesn’t serve you well.</p>

<p>If you think you are not intelligent, then you don’t really have many options other than trying to do by hard work what everyone else does much more easily.</p>

<p>But if you think you are not well-matched with the teachers you have had then you have more options: you can at least look for different teachers. And if you think that your talents are different than your classmates’, and that you can succeed if your approach to education is different than theirs <i>and different than the approaches 12 or 13 years of teachers have told you to use</i>, you have many more options.</p>

<p>If I were teaching you, I would take the default assumption that the standard ways of teaching do not work for you, and I would look for methods that did work for you. I would try to get you to come to office hours regularly to supplement the instruction in the classroom (because ultimately it would not be okay for me to try to teach you and leave the rest of the class to figure it out for themselves) and so that I could learn new methods of teaching that I might be able to use in class. I would start with the assumption that the teaching you have had has been inadequate, because that assumption suggests that I have an awful lot of options to help you improve.</p>

<p>But you’re a student, and I wouldn’t suggest that you assume your teachers are incompetent. If your teachers are incompetent, there is nothing you can do; you’ll just be at the mercy of incompetent teachers rather than of your own lack of intelligence. I would suggest that you take the default assumption that the ways you have been trying to learn and trying to demonstrate your knowledge are ineffective. (I wouldn’t suggest that a teacher begin with that assumption, because if the problem is your approach to education then the teacher is powerless to do much about it.) To the best of your ability, I urge you to think of yourself as an intelligent, hardworking person who does not meet most teachers’ expectations of what an intelligent, hardworking person looks like.</p>

<p>And here are some very specific suggestions that I have for you.</p>

<ol>
<li>Do all the reading, every day. Look at some of the websites on how to read in college, because they offer great advice on how to get the most out of your reading. Here’s where a lot of the “take a reduced course load” stuff fits, because you may need to spend more time preparing for class than your classmates, and that would mean that you need to take fewer classes than other people with similar work schedules would in order to be prepared.</li>
</ol>

<p>Ask for extra reading suggestions when what you’ve been assigned to read is hard, and then do those too.</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Try to figure out – based on the reading and the description of what’s going to happen on the syllabus, and also on any information you’ve gotten from teachers when you visit them in office hours – what the teacher is going to cover on any given day. (This works for lower-division classes, where what happens in class is more closely tied to what was in the reading, better than for upper-division classes. But community college classes are all lower-division classes.) Come up with an outline if you can. This serves two purposes: first, it means that you will not be struggling to follow what’s happening in class, and people who understand the lectures tend to feel a lot more competent and able than people who are struggling to keep up; second, an awful lot of the good stuff in college classes goes right over the heads of the people who are just trying to keep up, while the people who are hearing stuff they already know are able to benefit from little hints about how what they’re learning fits into the larger discipline, or how it connects to ideas in other disciplines, etc.</p></li>
<li><p>As soon as possible after class (so that you can remember what happend as well as possible), rewrite your notes so that they are clear. Also, when you have done each bit of reading, write clear notes about it as well. Your goal is to have notes that you can study for each exam – or look over in 10 years’ time when you have forgotten a lot of the details of the class – and that are sufficient to allow you to understand the course.</p></li>
</ol>

<p>On a regular basis, look over your notes to remind you about what has come before. </p>

<ol>
<li>Keep an academic journal – a blog, or something in a notebook, or a computer file – in which you write about what you’ve learned (and that can be outside of class as well as in class) and what you think about what you’ve learned. What interests you? What things do not seem important to you even though your teacher is spending a lot of time on it? Do you agree with the author of a given argumentative essay? Are there parts of someone’s argument that youthink don’t hold up?</li>
</ol>

<p>This, obviously, is exactly what you say you cannot do. I hope you will try to do it anyway – and in any case your journal isn’t something you have to share with anyone else, so even if you think your efforts are pretty awful it doesn’t matter: only you will ever see it. I suspect that after a few months you will be able to look back at the start and see improvement.</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Talk about what you’re learning. Even if it’s only to a pet or in your mind. (My dogs are really getting tired of hearing about the things I’m reading, but that’s kind of too bad for them. :slight_smile: I also, instead of singing in the shower, talk to myself, and try to go over the ideas in the most difficult thing I’ve read since the previous day’s shower.) Try to figure out how you would explain something to someone you were tutoring. Try to connect the ideas you’re learning to things in your everyday life. I once was supervising someone at a retail job and I asked her to tell me about how prices for a given line of products were determined. The answer I was going for was “The company tells us what price we may sell the items at. We are not allowed to have sales or give discounts. If we do, and if we get caught, we will no longer be allowed to sell this line of products. So if you’re buying from a legitimate seller of these products, you’re going to pay the same price anywhere – you won’t get a better deal at some other store.” She, however, had apparently taken a number of economics course, because she went off on a lecture about supply and demand. It wasn’t really the place for it, but the fact that she could do that probably had a lot to do with her success in college.</p></li>
<li><p>Try to connect what you’re learning in one class to what you’re learning or have learned somewhere else. If you take a developmental math class and a developmental English class next semester, you probably won’t be able to connect too many things from each. But if you take a sociology class and a psychology class, even if you don’t take them at the same time, you’ll be able to make connections. And in your major you will find that a lot of classes deal with common ideas.</p></li>
<li><p>Keep track of how much time you’re studying. At first, I’d just write down when you start and when you stop – including when you stop to go to the bathroom, to get a drink from the kitchen, to say hi to a classmate who sees you in the library, etc. – so that you know how much you’re really doing, and so that you can you can get close to an hour’s worth of studying done for every hour you aren’t doing anything other than studying (I know I lose time going to the bathroom, getting something from the refrigerator, answering email, and playing with my dogs whenever I’m “studying” something that bores me and I’m working on that). If you have a class from 9 to 9:50 and a class from 11 to 11:50, you don’t want to waste the time between 9:50 and 11 not doing much of anything. If you can get 45 minutes of going over the notes from your 9 am class before you 11 am class starts, that’s 45 minutes you will be able to use later doing something more fun. Once you have an idea of how much you are actually working when you are “working”, you can figure out how much downtime in the middle of studying is reasonable for you (I need at least a 5-minute break in each hour of work) and cut down on time that you don’t need for downtime but that you aren’t working. Then you can make a study schedule that allows you to get your work done and that reflects how much time you really need, both for study time and for downtime.</p></li>
<li><p>Take a break sometimes. The standard estimate is that you should be spending 2 hours working outside of class for every hour you spend in class. You will probably need a bit more than that, at least at first while you are developing skills and experimenting with how you learn best. But if all you do is work and study, you’ll burn out. You’ll probably have periods in the middle and at the end of each semester when you really do need to spend most of your time working or studying. But if you can’t find time to watch a TV show (one of the bloggers I read says he’s expecting the show “Community” – about students at a community college – to be really entertaining, so I’m planning to watch that; I usually have 2 or 3 shows I really follow at any one time, and a few more that I watch if I have time), read something that entertains you, see friends, go out, etc., it’s too much. It is better to get Bs and have a life you like than to get As and miss out on everything that is important to you – if for no other reason than that it will be harder to finish school if it requires you to be miserable for years.</p></li>
<li><p>And, finally, recognize that many, many teachers would be thrilled to have someone like you in class. Like you, my main skills are reading and writing. Unlike you, a lot of schoolwork came very easily to me. As a result, I got lazy. (The huge irony is that I blew off a class when I was a college freshman; but now, because I am doing a different kind of work than I originally expected to, I’m reading the same professor’s blog and studying all the books he wrote.) Worse than that, when I encountered something I was bad at I tended to quit very fast. I had little discipline. I lucked out and found something that I was talented at and that held my attention so that I was willing to work hard for it. But a lot of people like me never did find anything that excited them the way I did. When I started teaching, I realized that I loathed the students who were most like the person I had been. They struck me as lazy, and I hated that they quit so quickly when something got a little challenging. Someone who has spent most of his or her life in a system that requires them to work very hard in order to succeed, on the other hand, is my idea of a dream student. I’ve been lucky enough to have quite a few of them. It takes a lot of character to stick with academics for 12 or 13 years when academics don’t come naturally – or when the way academics are taught in one’s school doesn’t come naturally – and keep going. The strength of character that such students display makes me ashamed of who I was when I was 18. </p></li>
</ol>

<p>And if I’ve learned anything from the community college teachers I know and the ones whose blogs I read, it is that they get this. They get that they have students for whom academics (at least academics done in the traditional way) don’t come easy, students who have responsibilities on the job or in their own families, students who don’t speak English well, and so on. The students who annoy them most are the ones who don’t take school seriously, who resent any expectation that they work, who show up at the end of the semester asking for extra credit instead of showing up at the start of the semester asking for help earning all the regular credits. Students who assume that their failure to perform is entirely the teacher’s responsibility drive everyone I know who teaches completely up the wall.</p>

<p>I don’t think you should go to the other extreme and assume that your difficulties in school are all due to your own limitations – though I do think that assuming that the problem is more on your end than on the teachers’ or the textbook writers’ gives you power, I also think that that assumption has a heavy cost in terms of what you think of yourself – but I hope you will believe me that someone like you, someone who assumes some responsibility for their own performance, is someone that a huge number of teachers, especially at schools where teaching is valued over research, would love to have in their classes.</p>

<p>Your original question was about what your chances are. I think a lot of that has to do with you yourself. But from what you say, I would be very optimistic that you can get yourself a solid education and a good credential – I think the main risk for you is that you will decide that you are not intelligent enough and stop trying. I really hope you won’t do that. I know that it hasn’t been easy for you up to now, and I know it won’t be easy for you to take the next few steps, but I hope you will hang on long enough to at least get a Bachelor’s. It will open a lot of doors for you, and I have <i>absolutely no doubt whatsoever</i> that if you choose your teachers well and manage to stave off burnout you can make it.</p>

<p>I realize that my posts here are of the TL:DR variety; but I will check back to see whether there is anything else you would like me to tell you.</p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

<p>Go get an associates degree. Plumbers make way more than most college grads anyway.</p>

<p>

Rubbish! Haha. </p>

<p>Seriously, though, going to a community college is not something to be bitter about. And you’re not stupid for going there. Nor are you stupid for subnormal SAT scores or a 3.5 GPA. I, myself, had a sophomore GPA of sub 3.0. But, I got inspiration in the wierdest form. And, I just went with it, and now I’m having a fun time at a university. It’s definitely possible. I wish you the best of luck.</p>

<p>i’ve met a ****load of dumb people in my life but somehow they managed to pass high school and are now going to college. Its not that hard. Just choose the easiest thing in college which can actually help you earn money. lol</p>

<p>The key to college, at least getting through your GenEds, is BSing. </p>

<p>I don’t know what the yellow leaves on the oak tree are supposed to symbolize in Frankenstein. But SparkNotes does.</p>

<p>I don’t know what’s signified when Hitler crosses his T’s at midpoint in his journals. But some brainiac researcher in Yale does, and he’ll undoubtedly post his findings online for every college student to intermittently read, rehash, and cite while watching the Rock of Love finale the night before the paper is due.</p>

<p>Learn the art of BSing. It’s a wonderful skill.</p>