But was there any awareness in general in the US about any of these conflicts/atrocities? There are also thousands of people dying from natural disasters around the world every year, and we don’t hear about most of them.
I understand the point you’re trying to make, but if something doesn’t make the news here it’s not going to generate protests or outrage on either side of the issue. So I don’t think a comparison between these events can be drawn.
A more appropriate comparison I think, would be Russia attacking Ukraine. That did generate outrage and protests, but I don’t think anyone protested in favor of Russia. So again, not a true comparison.
Hey folks, this thread is veering/has veered into politics and personal swipes between users. So please, step away for a bit, or join the Politics Forum so you can engage in a less restrictive fashion. Don’t do it here please.
I’m putting the thread on slow mode for a while.
Edit: In order to keep the thread open, I will hide any further posts that are directed to any particular user in what seems to be an accusatory or provocative manner.
I agree with @TheVulcan 's post because I didn’t read it to say that the speech itself was violence, but that it represents a hypocrisy by many of those currently protesting. Rules for thee, but not for me. There is a lot of antisemitic rhetoric in those protests. If you don’t believe me, go find one of any size and you’ll see it and hear it.
“A Wake Forest humanities professor (Laura Mullen) is facing intense criticism and threats to her personal safety after a now-deleted post to her X (formerly Twitter) account regarding the Israel-Hamas War circulated among the Wake Forest community and beyond…
(Chair of Jewish History) Trachtenberg, for example, said he was disappointed by the university’s statement because it sent the message that professors would pay a professional price for acknowledging Palestinian suffering.
Trachtenberg also said the university missed an opportunity to de-escalate the conversation and provide context to Mullen’s post…
“The members of the Chabad Student Board wholly condemn the statements by Professor Laura Mullen,” the statement reads. “As Jewish students, we are alarmed and appalled…” “
Not exactly a conducive learning environment when those words are uttered by a person (teacher) in power to a Jewish student in the immediate aftermath of a mass slaughter of Jews at a dance party.
I don’t believe that being “prepared for adulthood” should include having to tolerate educators expressing sympathy for terrorists who just committed atrocities against people who shared your religious faith?
not to split hairs, but the words weren’t uttered (she tweeted) and they weren’t directed to a Jewish student. That’s my current understanding, anyway. If you have more info, please share.
This was the tweet:
‘So it’s kind of a Duh but if you turn me out of my house plow my olive groves under and confine what’s left of my family to the small impoverished state you run as an open air prison I could be tempted to shoot up your dance party yeah even knowing you will scorch the earth.’
I am not Jewish and I would not be comfortable with my kid taking her class.
If this professor wanted to make a point about the Palestinian situation she could have chosen a different way to do it. Her words are insensitive in the context of the events of Oct 7.
I understand and agree with the outrage at “I be tempted to shoot up your dance party.” Among other more obvious reasons, the professor not only puts herself into the story as terrorist, she flippantly underplays the horrific acts against innocents, as if those innocents were directly responsible for the acts of Israel.
But what if she had stopped short of that, yet still commented on why many Palestinians believe they have (and are being) wronged by Israel? ("‘. . . {Israel} turns me out of my house plows my olive groves under and confines what’s left of my family to the small impoverished state {Israel} runs as an open air prison.)
In other words, would you consider it antisemitic and threatening if a Professor tweets about whether Israel’s past and present policies with regard to Palestine might be partially responsible creating an environment which breeds hate and even terrorism? Would that be “expressing sympathy” for terrorists?
My highly unpopular view is that this professor was inartfully expressing what is obvious about human nature – the impulse for revenge. That’s why serious foreign policy experts always warn about overreach and how the killing of one terrorist often gives birth to more.
It’s not advocating terrorism to acknowledge that humans have emotions that can turn very very dark when loved ones are oppressed/killed. Those dark impulses are, obviously, unlawful. But to point out that circumstances can drive otherwise sane people to acts of murder is obvious. Shakespeare, anyone?
Her actual tweet refers to being “tempted.” My view is that the world needs to show a little more grace when people are emotionally talking about things that cut so deeply.
You didn’t ask me, but I would say, yes, that is a much different scenario, and those words alone would not justify her losing her job. I might still encourage my kid to steer clear of her if I were a Jew who had raised a Jew, but that’s where I’d draw the line.
Justifying or supporting 10/7 in any way, be it through twitter, facebook, instagram, or words in the classroom, with an exaggerated narrative that is begging for the “they deserved it” interpretation? I’d have a problem with it.
Her views both lack historical context and are invalid per se:
Hamas governs (well, governed…) Gaza. Palestinians of Gaza elected them. Israel, until the terrorist attack, had more or less left Gaza alone since 2006.
Palestinians may (and many do) live in Israel – they are not confined to Gaza or the West Bank.
Hamas destroyed the greenhouses of Gaza after Israel ceded power to them.
In other words… the prof is blaming Israel for things that either
a) Aren’t Israel’s fault, or
b) Are false or overexaggerated.
What is happening now in Gaza is almost entirely Hamas’s fault. (I’ll reserve 2-3% blame for Israel, as it takes two to tango. But how can they not aim to destroy Hamas? That is what Hamas plans for Israel.)
The circular debate not withstanding, I’m going to make the executive decision to assert that Laura Mullen was not speaking as a representative of the Wake Forest administration and therefore discussion of her actions is off-topic to this thread. Feel free to continue such discussion in the politics forum If you with.
I think the colleges response in firing the professor was appropriate and would influence our families decision regarding the school per OP question.
I don’t agree that someone who expresses immediate empathy and likemindedness towards terrorists is entitled to grace. She fails to expresses any “grace” for the terrorist’s victims and consequently I support the schools actions.
Her claims of victimhood in response to her firing are ironic and tone deaf in my opinion while Wake Forest’s response appropriate in my opinion.
This thread has really opened my eyes to different views. I am not sure if it is because I live on the west coast (not california) but I haven’t really experienced antisemitism. I am sure it is around but have not seen it at our local small University.