College Search for Math based LD

Parents Forum
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A close friend called me because her child is very much like how I was a student. He is unable to get through high school math (including science based math like physics) classes except at the most basic level. He is taking “resource” classes in math and some science (though got an A in regular Bio which had little to no math). There is no 4th year of math of math or 4th year of science for him to take at his school that he could get through. Most kids in his math class are aiming very low for college or don’t expect to go to college.

He is a straight A student in all honors and AP classes in English, History, Social Science. His AP Euro teacher told him he would write a recommendation that said he had one of the best analytical minds he’d seen in 20 years.

For me, my inability to do take more than 2 years of math in high school was not important. I was still able to get into my well regarded state flagship. (Now they say they “recommend” 4 years). Not having any math ability made ZERO difference in my success at college and my ability to get into a top law school and successfully practice. I never gave it much thought.

This kids ACT scores are very similar to mine: English 36, Reading 36, Math 19, Science 25. Good EC’s (President of Debate and DECA, Won several awards). Exec Editor of literary magazine. Editor of Yearbook

He has a diagnosed number based learning disability but this kid like me does not think of himself as needing any special help because what we excel at, we excel at. He wants a path to law school and has more than adequate skills to do that.

Any thoughts on how one approaches colleges with this issue? He would like a school that reflects his ability in his planned area of study, not one that has any focus on LD.

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He can’t really have it both ways. You can’t pretend you don’t have a disability, but want a school to overlook very low scores and classroom performance in the area of difficulty. In my opinion, he would be better off disclosing the disability is his apps, and explaining his course selection due to it.

I’d say he should target some LACs around ranking 25-60 with that explanation in his additional info section.

3

“He can’t really have it both ways. You can’t pretend you don’t have a disability”

Sorry I wasn’t clear. He has no issue disclosing the disability. He simply has no interest in any kind of special program geared to LD students because he doesn’t need it.

4

This student has a 29 ACT and from what you have indicated a fairly good gpa. There will be many good schools that he can be accepted to even with only 3 years of science. I would start by looking at the CTCL schools and looking at their math/science requirements. I don’t think the lack of a 4th science will be an issue (though environmental or psych could be an option as it is light on math). 3 yrs of math may pose more of an issue, but perhaps with good support/reccos from his high school this can be overcome. I know several students who took no language in hs due to learning disabilities and got into very competitive colleges (top 50 liberal arts) that said they required it.

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@wisteria100. My friend talks to me about him often because he’s been told sooooo many times that “will really need math in real life work as a lawyer.” Um nope. I don’t need it for the very sophisticated corporate work I do, so I tell him to ignore the naysayers.

Do you think that even when 4 years of math is “required” he should just ignore that and apply anyway, having his counselor explain?

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“My friend talks to me about him often because he’s been told sooooo many times that “will really need math in real life work as a lawyer.” Um nope. I don’t need it for the very sophisticated corporate work I do, so I tell him to ignore the naysayers.”

Unless the person is a transactional attorney or a patent litigator/prosecution attorney, no. Definitely. Basic math - yes, basic statistics (probabilities: was that sack of flower flying out of the window more likely the result of someone’s negligent handling than something else?) - yes. Complex math - no.

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My son is not as strong a student as this boy because he is dyslexic on top of being dyscalculic. He didn’t take math past geometry and although he was able to do honors bio and chem (though not that well), he wound up dropping physics. He does also have earth science, marine science and APES. At our school. AP psych is under the social studies, not the math, department.

He has been accepted to two SUNY’s and 2 private schools. None are top ranked but he should be able to study what he wants to. He is considering various options to deal with college math. If the school gives CLEP credits, I will hire his former math tutor (who got him up to a 24 on the ACT) and hope that he scores high enough to forego math at college. Another option is to take math at the local CC over the summer. If you earn a C, the credits transfer and the grade doesn’t factor into your GPA. That would probably also entail working with the tutor. The third option is to take a class pass/fail and that, too, will probably require a lot of tutoring.

He also only took 2 years of FL because he simply could not do it anymore.

My son didn’t disclose his LD’s in the admission process but once he picks his college, he will connect with the LD services office.

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  • dang autocorrect. Sack of flour!!! :)

Your kid will be fine.

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@maya54
I believe most colleges ‘recommend’ vs ‘require’ certain classes or numbers of yrs of classes. so apply even without the 4yrs of math. The most competitive schools are the ones that will care the most, but with a 29 ACT he will not likely be applying to those anyway. (Not to disparage a 29 - it is a strong score, just not an Ivy/top school type of score)

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His counselor is encouraging him to apply to top 15-20 schools. She said she had one other student like this with perfect scores in reading and English ( and poor math science) and a 4.0 like this kid with a " best mind I’ve seen" from A teacher. Said he got into 2 in that range. That with such lopsided scores" it’s not viewed exactly the same way as most 29’s".

I don’t know if that’s true or not. ( how it’s viewed)

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I have heard from 2 GC, that consistency across sub scores is viewed more favorably than spikes, but perhaps other GC’s feel differently. The 36 in reading and math is impressive, but he will be competing with kids who have perfect or near perfect scores in English and reading, plus high math and science plus near perfect gpa’s acoss all subjects.
There were a couple posters here in Dec who had kids with very strong grades and very strong English/reading scores but lower math scores ( though higher than 19). Applied ED to Vassar and William & Mary and both got denied. One called the school and was told the math score was problematic.

12

He should,make sure he has met the REQUIRED math courses for,those top 15-20 schools.

There are plenty of colleges where this student will get accepted, do well, and be challenged. I’m nit sure the need to apply to colleges where he may not have met the minimum HS course requirements. So check those.

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If it says “required” - no, he shouldn’t apply. If the college say “recommended” then he is fine to apply.off

My DD had 3 years of high school math and was accepted to very selective colleges that “recommended” 4, but was waitlisted at a less selective college that “required” 4. That wasn’t an outright rejection, but my daughter had said in her application that she had enrolled in an online course to get the 4th year (not available at her high school due to scheduling issues) — so if it had come to being invited off the waitlist, the school might very well have asked for documentation of completion of that course. (Which my daughter didn’t do).

The difference between “required” and “recommended” is that at a selective college, if the “required” courses aren’t there, that’s an easy grounds for rejection - and when colleges are overwhelmed with applications from qualified candidates, rejecting the “unqualified” is an easy call.

He also needs to look for colleges with open curriculums, or very flexible breadth or distribution requirements. He doesn’t want to find himself struggling in a college math course that is required for graduation. If a college has a “quantitative reasoning” requirement, then he needs to know before he applies what courses can be taken to fill that.

And he needs a very good set of safety schools. He may very well get into his top choices, but he can’t count on that.

At the same time, he shouldn’t hesitate to apply to reach schools with holistic admission standards. It’s just that with a lopsided profile, he can never be sure. Obviously it makes sense to focus on his strengths, and find colleges that value them.

If he is a particularly gifted writer, he might do well with schools that require a lot of supplemental essays as part of their application process, or schools that welcome additional writing samples.

Given his interests in writing and literature, he might do well to apply to LAC’s that have a heavy female-to-male gender imbalance – in those situations, simply being male is something of an asset in admissions – and the LAC environment is probably more suited to his interests in any case. Sarah Lawrence is one that comes to mind (and also has a flexible curriculum and definitely loves writers) – but I am sure there are others. Definitely look through the CTCL list - see https://ctcl.org/category/college-profiles/

PS – to moderators: I think this topic belongs in the main parent forum, not the cafe – can it be moved?

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@calmom makes an excellent point about open curriculum and finding schools that don’t have a math requirement to graduate.
You may also want to look at test optional schools as I believe the 19 in math is below the ‘college readiness’ standard.

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“PS – to moderators: I think this topic belongs in the main parent forum, not the cafe – can it be moved?”

I agree! I meant to do that. Post here was an accident!

16

I think the testing is a mixed bag because while the math score is low – with an explanation, it also validates the math LD, and provides more of a sense as to why the academic record is so lopsided. Either way, an explanation from the GC will be important.

Are finances important? Would the family be eligible for substantial need based aid?

Also, any geographic preferences or limitations?

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No aid need or otherwise required. Large family resources (from what I know all grandchildren have large educational trust) No particular geographic presence. Definitely looking for a school where will find other very smart kids. Hoping for school that will understand that math/science score and classes has nothing to do with ability to excel as a English Lit or History major on path to law school ( is aware of being wary of schools with rigid requirements for math)

Im so sympathetic to him because I still remember my HS History teacher telling me how me how my HS geometry teacher told her she must be thinking of the wrong student when she told the other teachers at a meeting that I had won a prize for best current event essay. “I think you have your names mixed up? Maya is, you know…slow”. Lol lol.

18

Regarding top 15 schools, he could apply to a couple of them as reaches. But I see schools like Colorado College, Macalester, Skidmore as matches for him, with someplace Dickinson as a low match.

19

Be aware that many colleges have math graduation requirements, commonly at the precalculus or statistics (noncalculus, like AP statistics) level.

Also, is he fine with logic, since that can be in the LSAT and law?

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Since the family is full pay, that is a potential advantage at need-aware schools. He probably should target carefully and then consider applying ED to a top choice school where admission is a strong possibility. (There’s a certain value to a commitment to attend – one of the primary purposes of ED is to lock in a significant percentage of full pay students)

On the more selective end of things (reachy) - Wesleyen or Oberlin might be possibilities. Definitely look for a college with a reputation for attracting artsy types.

The college board site - https://bigfuture.collegeboard.org/ - is a good source of quick information about admission requirements vs. recommendations, and what factors are weighed heavily in admissions decisions.